Let’s Talk DC Circuit! Forum

[boliver783]

Haven’t seen this one yet! Info on judges (esp. new appointees), general experience, etc

[Pennoyer v. Meh]

I find their anti-Garamond stance offensive. For that reason I won't be applying to any judge on that court.

[Anonymous User]

I would be interested in hearing about some of the senior judges on the circuit. Do they all take full caseloads? Full clerk classes? Are they easier to get than the active judges?

[Anonymous User]

I would be interested in hearing about some of the senior judges on the circuit. Do they all take full caseloads? Full clerk classes? Are they easier to get than the active judges?

I don't have any current info about specific senior judges, but they are generally less competitive than the active judges, in part because they don't feed. I will say that even those that take on a full caseload will likely give you a pretty relaxed working year; the D.C. caseload is low as is, and judges generally finish hearing cases by the end of April. After that, it's all en banc cases, which the senior judges don't participate in. So unless you have some especially meaty panel opinion you're working on, your workload dissipates pretty drastically by April.

You can get a sense of how active each senior judge is just by looking at the calendar for their sittings. Looks like active judges have about 20-25 sittings per term (with usually three cases per sitting). All of the senior judges (except the newly-seniored Tatel) have only 10 sittings, so they're probably at 50% caseloads. Which means they likely only have two clerks; I would think with that few of spots they rely heavily on professor/judge recommendations in their hiring.

I think Judge Tatel will be an exception to most of this, though. As a senior judge (and without Justice Ginsburg on the court) his feeding days are likely over, but I wouldn't be surprised if he still keeps a full caseload for the next couple of years and his clerkship remains intensely competitive.

[GoneSouth]

I would be interested in hearing about some of the senior judges on the circuit. Do they all take full caseloads? Full clerk classes? Are they easier to get than the active judges?

I don't have any current info about specific senior judges, but they are generally less competitive than the active judges, in part because they don't feed. I will say that even those that take on a full caseload will likely give you a pretty relaxed working year; the D.C. caseload is low as is, and judges generally finish hearing cases by the end of April. After that, it's all en banc cases, which the senior judges don't participate in. So unless you have some especially meaty panel opinion you're working on, your workload dissipates pretty drastically by April.

You can get a sense of how active each senior judge is just by looking at the calendar for their sittings. Looks like active judges have about 20-25 sittings per term (with usually three cases per sitting). All of the senior judges (except the newly-seniored Tatel) have only 10 sittings, so they're probably at 50% caseloads. Which means they likely only have two clerks; I would think with that few of spots they rely heavily on professor/judge recommendations in their hiring.

I think Judge Tatel will be an exception to most of this, though. As a senior judge (and without Justice Ginsburg on the court) his feeding days are likely over, but I wouldn't be surprised if he still keeps a full caseload for the next couple of years and his clerkship remains intensely competitive.

As a former Ninth Circuit clerk, this is insane to me. Ninth Circuit judges sit something like 35 days a year, with each day having 5-6 cases. So that’s more than double the caseload.

[Anonymous User]

I would be interested in hearing about some of the senior judges on the circuit. Do they all take full caseloads? Full clerk classes? Are they easier to get than the active judges?

I don't have any current info about specific senior judges, but they are generally less competitive than the active judges, in part because they don't feed. I will say that even those that take on a full caseload will likely give you a pretty relaxed working year; the D.C. caseload is low as is, and judges generally finish hearing cases by the end of April. After that, it's all en banc cases, which the senior judges don't participate in. So unless you have some especially meaty panel opinion you're working on, your workload dissipates pretty drastically by April.

You can get a sense of how active each senior judge is just by looking at the calendar for their sittings. Looks like active judges have about 20-25 sittings per term (with usually three cases per sitting). All of the senior judges (except the newly-seniored Tatel) have only 10 sittings, so they're probably at 50% caseloads. Which means they likely only have two clerks; I would think with that few of spots they rely heavily on professor/judge recommendations in their hiring.

I think Judge Tatel will be an exception to most of this, though. As a senior judge (and without Justice Ginsburg on the court) his feeding days are likely over, but I wouldn't be surprised if he still keeps a full caseload for the next couple of years and his clerkship remains intensely competitive.

As a former Ninth Circuit clerk, this is insane to me. Ninth Circuit judges sit something like 35 days a year, with each day having 5-6 cases. So that’s more than double the caseload.

Yeah D.C. Circuit caseload is very small and Ninth Circuit is huge. Granted, the D.C. Circuit doesn't have the screening process the Ninth does or nearly as many staff attorneys as the Ninth (though they probably resolve a third of cases without oral argument). There also isn't a bench memo pool. But yes, unless you're working for a couple of extra thorough judges (I know Millett and probably Srinivasan would fall into this category, unsure who else), you can usually work 9-5 (With an hour for lunch) pretty comfortably. I know a former Ninth Circuit clerk who then clerked on the D.C. Circuit who actually found themself kind of bored with the lighter caseload.

[Anonymous User]

Any info on particular judges and how they run chambers

[Anonymous User]

Any info on particular judges and how they run chambers

As someone alluded to earlier, Judge Millett's chambers work very long hours. They do mini moots for each case to drill down on all the arguments on both sides.

[Anonymous User]

Any info on particular judges and how they run chambers

As someone alluded to earlier, Judge Millett's chambers work very long hours. They do mini moots for each case to drill down on all the arguments on both sides.

Goodness, doing that for every case sounds like a waste of time, though probably good experience

[Anonymous User]

Silberman has an, uh, interesting new dissent calling for the reversal of NYT v. Sullivan.

https://www.cadc.uscourts.gov/internet/ ... 890626.pdf

[Anonymous User]

Any info on particular judges and how they run chambers

As someone alluded to earlier, Judge Millett's chambers work very long hours. They do mini moots for each case to drill down on all the arguments on both sides.

Goodness, doing that for every case sounds like a waste of time, though probably good experience

I have heard another DC Cir judge does this. Maybe it isn't as bad when you have so few oral arguments.

[Anonymous User]

Any info on particular judges and how they run chambers

As someone alluded to earlier, Judge Millett's chambers work very long hours. They do mini moots for each case to drill down on all the arguments on both sides.

Goodness, doing that for every case sounds like a waste of time, though probably good experience

I have heard another DC Cir judge does this. Maybe it isn't as bad when you have so few oral arguments.

I know of a judge on the Ninth who does a simplified version of this. Not sure how they do it.

[Anonymous User]

Any specific knowledge of Pillard, Wilkins, and Srinavasin?

[Anonymous User]

Any info on particular judges and how they run chambers

As someone alluded to earlier, Judge Millett's chambers work very long hours. They do mini moots for each case to drill down on all the arguments on both sides.

Goodness, doing that for every case sounds like a waste of time, though probably good experience

I have heard another DC Cir judge does this. Maybe it isn't as bad when you have so few oral arguments.

I know of a judge on the Ninth who does a simplified version of this. Not sure how they do it.

Which judge?

[Anonymous User]

Any specific knowledge of Pillard, Wilkins, and Srinavasin?

Bump, but also interested if anyone has a breakdown of all the Judges, like someone posted for the 6th Circuit

[Anonymous User]

Any specific knowledge of Pillard, Wilkins, and Srinavasin?

Bump, but also interested if anyone has a breakdown of all the Judges, like someone posted for the 6th Circuit

Bump, this would be helpful

[Anonymous User]

Any specific knowledge of Pillard, Wilkins, and Srinavasin?

Bump, but also interested if anyone has a breakdown of all the Judges, like someone posted for the 6th Circuit

Bump, this would be helpful

What do you actually want to know and why? Anyone who would be in a position to choose between multiple judges on the D.C. Circuit would also be at a school where they could speak with professors and alumni who know the judge personally, which would be much more helpful than an anonymous stranger telling you whether they like the judge.
Judges Wilkins, Henderson, and Rao are the ones most likely to hire grads who aren't from HSYC. Judge Henderson seems to not be super well-tempered in chambers (she sent out a couple passive aggressive emails while I was there), but overall a fine judge; Judge Rao requires FedSoc connections and ideology; and Judge Wilkins seems like a great boss (his clerks seemed quite happy, though he's also the least likely of the three to dip below the T14).

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know what term most of the off-plan judges are hiring for? I saw that McFadden is apparently full till the 2024-25 term this morning.

[Anonymous User]

Any specific knowledge of Pillard, Wilkins, and Srinavasin?

Bump, but also interested if anyone has a breakdown of all the Judges, like someone posted for the 6th Circuit

Bump, this would be helpful

What do you actually want to know and why? Anyone who would be in a position to choose between multiple judges on the D.C. Circuit would also be at a school where they could speak with professors and alumni who know the judge personally, which would be much more helpful than an anonymous stranger telling you whether they like the judge.
Judges Wilkins, Henderson, and Rao are the ones most likely to hire grads who aren't from HSYC. Judge Henderson seems to not be super well-tempered in chambers (she sent out a couple passive aggressive emails while I was there), but overall a fine judge; Judge Rao requires FedSoc connections and ideology; and Judge Wilkins seems like a great boss (his clerks seemed quite happy, though he's also the least likely of the three to dip below the T14).

Walker is hiring quite a few non-T14 clerks as well.

[Anonymous User]

Any specific knowledge of Pillard, Wilkins, and Srinavasin?

Bump, but also interested if anyone has a breakdown of all the Judges, like someone posted for the 6th Circuit

Bump, this would be helpful

What do you actually want to know and why? Anyone who would be in a position to choose between multiple judges on the D.C. Circuit would also be at a school where they could speak with professors and alumni who know the judge personally, which would be much more helpful than an anonymous stranger telling you whether they like the judge.
Judges Wilkins, Henderson, and Rao are the ones most likely to hire grads who aren't from HSYC. Judge Henderson seems to not be super well-tempered in chambers (she sent out a couple passive aggressive emails while I was there), but overall a fine judge; Judge Rao requires FedSoc connections and ideology; and Judge Wilkins seems like a great boss (his clerks seemed quite happy, though he's also the least likely of the three to dip below the T14).

Walker is hiring quite a few non-T14 clerks as well.

Does Walker screen for ideology?

[Anonymous User]

Any specific knowledge of Pillard, Wilkins, and Srinavasin?

Bump, but also interested if anyone has a breakdown of all the Judges, like someone posted for the 6th Circuit

Bump, this would be helpful

What do you actually want to know and why? Anyone who would be in a position to choose between multiple judges on the D.C. Circuit would also be at a school where they could speak with professors and alumni who know the judge personally, which would be much more helpful than an anonymous stranger telling you whether they like the judge.
Judges Wilkins, Henderson, and Rao are the ones most likely to hire grads who aren't from HSYC. Judge Henderson seems to not be super well-tempered in chambers (she sent out a couple passive aggressive emails while I was there), but overall a fine judge; Judge Rao requires FedSoc connections and ideology; and Judge Wilkins seems like a great boss (his clerks seemed quite happy, though he's also the least likely of the three to dip below the T14).

Walker is hiring quite a few non-T14 clerks as well.

Does Walker screen for ideology?

Cannot imagine that he doesn’t. I also think he used a writing test last year too.

[Anonymous User]

Any specific knowledge of Pillard, Wilkins, and Srinavasin?

Bump, but also interested if anyone has a breakdown of all the Judges, like someone posted for the 6th Circuit

Bump, this would be helpful

What do you actually want to know and why? Anyone who would be in a position to choose between multiple judges on the D.C. Circuit would also be at a school where they could speak with professors and alumni who know the judge personally, which would be much more helpful than an anonymous stranger telling you whether they like the judge.
Judges Wilkins, Henderson, and Rao are the ones most likely to hire grads who aren't from HSYC. Judge Henderson seems to not be super well-tempered in chambers (she sent out a couple passive aggressive emails while I was there), but overall a fine judge; Judge Rao requires FedSoc connections and ideology; and Judge Wilkins seems like a great boss (his clerks seemed quite happy, though he's also the least likely of the three to dip below the T14).

Walker is hiring quite a few non-T14 clerks as well.

Does Walker screen for ideology?

Cannot imagine that he doesn’t. I also think he used a writing test last year too.

Given how shitty of a writer he is you should pile on the cliches and flourishes

[Anonymous User]

Has Katsas hired for 2023-24?

[Anonymous User]

Has Katsas hired for 2023-24?

Yes he has

[Anonymous User]

Judge Wilkins posted a remarkably helpful OSCAR posting recently. From it, here are the list of schools he has hired from so far:

American University Washington College of Law
Columbia Law School
Duke University School of Law
Fordham University School of Law
George Washington University School of Law
Georgetown University Law Center
Harvard Law School
New York University School of Law
Northwestern Pritzker School of Law
Pepperdine University School of Law
Stanford Law School
Tulane University Law School
University of California Berkeley School of Law
University of California Hastings, College of Law
University of California at Los Angeles Law School
University of Chicago Law School
University of Georgia School of Law
University of North Carolina School of Law
University of South Carolina School of Law
University of Virginia School of Law
Vanderbilt University Law School
Wake Forest School of Law
Washington University School of Law
Yale Law School