do you need law review for a clerksip Forum

[elizh1016]

wondering if its even worth me applying. I'm not on law review, but a secondary journal at t14 with a 3.7ish

[Anonymous User]

wondering if its even worth me applying. I'm not on law review, but a secondary journal at t14 with a 3.7ish

In my experience, conservative judges do not care if you are on Law Review. I can't imagine it is a dealbreaker with liberal judges. IDK where a 3.7 falls on the curve on your T-14, but I totally think its worth applying

[Anonymous User]

Depends on the judge but you seem to be in the ballpark so you should apply.

[Anonymous User]

Nope. I had a high 3.7 at my t14, and I'm doing a semi-feeder COA.

[Anonymous User]

Required? No. Does it help? I think so.

Data point: 4.0 at a T14, moot court/mock trial/secondary journal. I struck out applying to district court judges in some very competitive districts. No one has ever said it, but I have to imagine the lack of LR might have played a part in that. Granted, I have no FedSoc ties and I did not apply to any conservative judges, so I was probably applying to judges that care more about brass rings like LR.

[Anonymous User]

Most judges don't seem to give that much weight to LR anymore, especially for schools where it is no grade-on. You can see on OSCAR if they prefer it.

[Anonymous User]

wondering if its even worth me applying. I'm not on law review, but a secondary journal at t14 with a 3.7ish

As a law clerk, I spend a lot of time bluebooking and editing generally. I need to know that you'll be able to do this work. It's mindless, and all it requires is a strong knowledge of arbitrary rules, including those of English grammar.

But how else am I supposed to know whether you can do this basic work if you're not on law review?

But I'm speaking for myself. Out of the last few clerks my judge hired, I think only one was on law review. So you should be fine.

[Anonymous User]

But how else am I supposed to know whether you can do this basic work if you're not on law review?

Based on the writing sample? I mean, duh.

FWIW, many FedSoc COA judges have realized that LR now means nothing because the selection process is largely not meritocratic and therefore do not care whether you are on LR compared to some other journal.

[Anonymous User]

wondering if its even worth me applying. I'm not on law review, but a secondary journal at t14 with a 3.7ish

But how else am I supposed to know whether you can do this basic work if you're not on law review?

Maybe poster was only half-joking but this was particularly funny to me. Like the only way people know how to write well and for others to see that is to be on law review?? I wasn’t on a journal but I’ve always strived to improve my writing, take writing courses, read, etc. I was told in several interviews that my writing samples were good/I was a good writer. Clerking on district and COA. I applied to conservative judges, so maybe that supports what others are saying.

[Anonymous User]

But how else am I supposed to know whether you can do this basic work if you're not on law review?

Based on the writing sample? I mean, duh.

Yes, but this is why some judges now explicitly ask you to specify whether your writing sample was edited by someone else. Alternatively, some judges will accept only "unedited" writing samples. Most judges still do not ask.

[Anonymous User]

Yeah, this is really subjective and will vary. I clerked for a judge who didn't really care about law review or other journals b/c his theory was everyone who really wants to can find some journal to be on, so it's not really much of a marker of writing skills. I don't agree with the person above saying that LR isn't at all meritocratic (like lol of course FedSoc judges have that issue), but either you grade on, which doesn't say much about writing skill, or you write on, which can say something about writing skill, but is still just relative to everyone else who applied and is evaluated by other students. (I'm not going to touch the diversity/holistic/personal statement side of things.) So my judge wanted to see other markers of writing ability (he especially liked applicants who had work experience writing before they went to law school, like former journalists).

But other judges will care b/c you can always find some judge somewhere who will care about whatever possible thing it is.

I don't think you have to have LR to apply - to the extent LR teaches you editing and bluebooking, so does a secondary journal (it's not like they're churning out typos and bad cites any more than LRs do). To the extent getting on LR is a signal of anything, it's often good grades, which a judge will see on your transcript anyway.

Lol at the idea that LR is the only reliable signal that you can edit or bluebook (and frankly bluebooking in most courts is absolutely not complicated, it's federal cases all day long). Personally, I think what LR most signals is a willingness to do a lot of grunt work on something that you're not personally invested in, but LR's not the only way to signal that.

I think for a lot of judges, in general, some kind of recognition or focus on writing is good even if not LR - publishing something, winning a moot court brief competition, or the like. (I would also say that most judges ask for an unedited writing sample.) But again, while it's probably fair to say that all judges want to see good grades and good schools, the details are all over the place. Don't take yourself out of the running for anything.

[Anonymous User]

In my experience from last year most judges did not ask for unedited samples. Unedited samples generally kick out law review comments, which are a very common form of writing sample. But anyway it doesn't matter, if they want unedited it will be on OSCAR.

[Anonymous User]

I think a lot of judges don't ask for unedited writing samples because it reduces the number of apps they will get. Who wants to do a whole second writing sample without edits from someone else (assuming their primary sample was edited by others)? Same goes for judges who ask for two samples regardless of editing. I never got around to applying to any of the two sample judges because I got an offer while working on my second sample (off-plan). Furthermore, with no way to verify the sample was not edited, you disadvantage those people who will actually comply and aid people who don't follow the rules.

On a side note, I think LR is not a super useful indicator of writing ability as it judges writing ability after your 1L year (same could be said for grades though, hence why even some off-plan judges like to see more than just one year). I didn't come from a family of lawyers or have any serious writing background, so legal writing was tough for me at the start of my law school career. I have really improved my writing since then, but I knew I had no chance at LR while trying to write on. I think its best to judge writing based off of the writing sample and calling professors who you have written for.

[nixy]

It is really not that hard to come up with an unedited writing sample, especially if you're applying while still in school - just submit something you wrote before it got graded. And lots of judges ask for 2 samples. I don't think judges are really worrying at all about limiting applications because they get hundreds as it is.