2018-2019 Clerkship Application Thread Forum

[jbagelboy]

The handful of judges EzraFitz is referring to are the type who take a yearly call from Akhil Amar, Epstein, Metzger, Lawrence Tribe, Eric Posner and a couple others in mid-May with a short list of favorite students to fly out for interviews after finals. These aren't people who are pulling names off OSCAR or out of a stack of envelopes. That's why the gig is up before it's begun, but the vast majority of federal judges will be hiring much later.

[Anonymous User]

As someone being helped out by one of the above named professors, I strongly suspect the above is not true.

[EzraFitz]

Not to dampen hopeful spirits, but the tippy top feeders are NOT sitting on their hands. They are really moving ASAP (if they haven't already filled up). But yes, this applies to a very small sect of top top judges. For most, waiting for Spring grades is fine and acceptable. For the most competitive, it's possibly too late.

This is doubtful, unless you can name a specific judge or judges?

Based on my (very limited) sample size, the judges that are moving for 2018-19 seem to be looking at rising 3Ls or graduates - people with grades and a proven track record. It would be insane for a feeder to hire before Spring grades come out for 1Ls/rising 2Ls (especially for Yale students, who don't even have grades after the first semester.) But maybe there are some insane ones? I don't know any personally, but that doesn't mean they aren't out there.

I should clarify. I am saying the top feeders are moving for 2018-2019. Not necessarily that they are hiring 2Ls. But if 2Ls want to be competitive for any spots left, they need to move quickly and be proactive.

The handful of judges EzraFitz is referring to are the type who take a yearly call from Akhil Amar, Epstein, Metzger, Lawrence Tribe, Eric Posner and a couple others in mid-May with a short list of favorite students to fly out for interviews after finals. These aren't people who are pulling names off OSCAR or out of a stack of envelopes. That's why the gig is up before it's begun, but the vast majority of federal judges will be hiring much later.

Also this to a large degree as well.

As someone being helped out by one of the above named professors, I strongly suspect the above is not true.

To reiterate an above poster, just because it hasn't happened for you doesn't mean it isn't happening for others.

[Anonymous User]

I'm generally confused by this thread. Non-feeders in desirable circuits (2/9/DC) are definitely interviewing/hiring already for 2018-19.

[Anonymous User]

I'm generally confused by this thread. Non-feeders in desirable circuits (2/9/DC) are definitely interviewing/hiring already for 2018-19.

Agreed -- this thread is something of a misnomer. I'm a current DDC/SDNY clerk, and my judge has been full for '18-'19 for a few months. Many top feeders filled at least some (if not all) of their '18-'19 spots last summer. Tippy-top rising 2Ls should obviously apply when spring grades are released, but know that your feeder applications will very likely be considered for the '19-'20 term.

[jbagelboy]

I'm generally confused by this thread. Non-feeders in desirable circuits (2/9/DC) are definitely interviewing/hiring already for 2018-19.

Agreed -- this thread is something of a misnomer. I'm a current DDC/SDNY clerk, and my judge has been full for '18-'19 for a few months. Many top feeders filled at least some (if not all) of their '18-'19 spots last summer. Tippy-top rising 2Ls should obviously apply when spring grades are released, but know that your feeder applications will very likely be considered for the '19-'20 term.

Completely agree. A lot of people are going to have to start learning that they won't be clerking--or at least won't be with their "feeder"--the year they graduate from law school. The schedule has accelerated such that it no longer resembles what it was five years ago, and as I've been saying throughout these boards, everyone--including the ABA--will have to adjust.

As someone being helped out by one of the above named professors, I strongly suspect the above is not true.

No offense, but the experience of it happening regularly is far more conclusive as to whether it occurs than one case in which it did not. The names of the professors aren't important, I was just sampling the sorts of people at different top schools who take these sorts of calls and are consistently relevant to this process. It doesn't mean you are necessarily in a position to receive this treatment (but if one of these profs is earnestly backing you, you will probably get a clerkship at some point).

[MyNameIsFlynn!]

I'm generally confused by this thread. Non-feeders in desirable circuits (2/9/DC) are definitely interviewing/hiring already for 2018-19.

Agreed -- this thread is something of a misnomer. I'm a current DDC/SDNY clerk, and my judge has been full for '18-'19 for a few months. Many top feeders filled at least some (if not all) of their '18-'19 spots last summer. Tippy-top rising 2Ls should obviously apply when spring grades are released, but know that your feeder applications will very likely be considered for the '19-'20 term.

Completely agree. A lot of people are going to have to start learning that they won't be clerking--or at least won't be with their "feeder"--the year they graduate from law school. The schedule has accelerated such that it no longer resembles what it was five years ago, and as I've been saying throughout these boards, everyone--including the ABA--will have to adjust.

As someone being helped out by one of the above named professors, I strongly suspect the above is not true.

No offense, but the experience of it happening regularly is far more conclusive as to whether it occurs than one case in which it did not. The names of the professors aren't important, I was just sampling the sorts of people at different top schools who take these sorts of calls and are consistently relevant to this process. It doesn't mean you are necessarily in a position to receive this treatment (but if one of these profs is earnestly backing you, you will probably get a clerkship at some point).

The first part of this post is on point. Not just for feeders either -- a lot of "regular" judges have already hired for 2018. We just don't hear a lot about it because it's exclusively alumni hiring this far out. The gameplan of graduating and then clerking right afterward is attainable but the breakdown of the hiring plan has made it more and more difficult.

And this isn't even trolling. I assume most of y'alls T14 schools have lists of clerkship acceptances. Look through them and you'll see lots of 2018 hiring, especially in the next month or so (as 3Ls get their final transcripts locked down). It'll all be class of 2017 or earlier.

[Anonymous User]

So are we supposed to send 19-20 term apps to judges after grades are released? Very few are open on Oscar.

[Anonymous User]

I'm generally confused by this thread. Non-feeders in desirable circuits (2/9/DC) are definitely interviewing/hiring already for 2018-19.

Agreed -- this thread is something of a misnomer. I'm a current DDC/SDNY clerk, and my judge has been full for '18-'19 for a few months. Many top feeders filled at least some (if not all) of their '18-'19 spots last summer. Tippy-top rising 2Ls should obviously apply when spring grades are released, but know that your feeder applications will very likely be considered for the '19-'20 term.

Completely agree. A lot of people are going to have to start learning that they won't be clerking--or at least won't be with their "feeder"--the year they graduate from law school. The schedule has accelerated such that it no longer resembles what it was five years ago, and as I've been saying throughout these boards, everyone--including the ABA--will have to adjust.

As someone being helped out by one of the above named professors, I strongly suspect the above is not true.

No offense, but the experience of it happening regularly is far more conclusive as to whether it occurs than one case in which it did not. The names of the professors aren't important, I was just sampling the sorts of people at different top schools who take these sorts of calls and are consistently relevant to this process. It doesn't mean you are necessarily in a position to receive this treatment (but if one of these profs is earnestly backing you, you will probably get a clerkship at some point).

The first part of this post is on point. Not just for feeders either -- a lot of "regular" judges have already hired for 2018. We just don't hear a lot about it because it's exclusively alumni hiring this far out. The gameplan of graduating and then clerking right afterward is attainable but the breakdown of the hiring plan has made it more and more difficult.

And this isn't even trolling. I assume most of y'alls T14 schools have lists of clerkship acceptances. Look through them and you'll see lots of 2018 hiring, especially in the next month or so (as 3Ls get their final transcripts locked down). It'll all be class of 2017 or earlier.

First anon poster here (and current 2/9/DC clerk). It isn't exactly exclusively alumni hiring this far out though I suppose if you consider rising 3Ls with a d. ct. clerkship already lined up alumni hiring then yeah, pretty much.

I would suggest to anyone not applying now to start and even if the requisite grades aren't out yet, just add a line in your cover letter that you'll update your materials when they become available.

[hdunlop]

But also, if you're in your first summer, not to lose your mind at whatever's going on here.

[Anonymous User]

I think some of you all are making it sound more dire than it is. Once you get past feeders and the most competitive circuit/SDNY judges, the process has not sped up so much in the past year.

I was one of those people who was on the low edge of being competitive and scratched and clawed and sent thousand of packets (including updates) over a almost 2 year period. I just graduated with a district 16-17 in edpa/ndil/edny and a circuit 17-18 in 1st/3rd/4th. Both of them were secured near the end of that term's hiring cycle.

It is far from over for 2018 and soul crushing persistence often pays off.

[redwallabbey]

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[meisme23]

For judges that take email applications—one PDF with all the materials, or separate PDFs for cover letter, etc.?

[naenae2745]

For judges that take email applications—one PDF with all the materials, or separate PDFs for cover letter, etc.?

follow the instructions. if none, send in one. why would you ever send multiple pdfs? it's annoying and unnecessary. only exception is if your clerkship office sends recommendation letters separately (aside from your CL, resume, etc.).

[meisme23]

For judges that take email applications—one PDF with all the materials, or separate PDFs for cover letter, etc.?

follow the instructions. if none, send in one. why would you ever send multiple pdfs? it's annoying and unnecessary. only exception is if your clerkship office sends recommendation letters separately (aside from your CL, resume, etc.).

Thanks. I don't have OSCAR access yet (just finished 1L), so there's no instructions to be found.

[WhiskeyAndCupcakes]

.

[A. Nony Mouse]

1 or 2, not 3. I would say go for a 3rd 1L prof and maybe if you're still applying at the end of the summer get the employer letter and substitute that if you think it's better.

[Auxilio]

1 or 2, not 3. I would say go for a 3rd 1L prof and maybe if you're still applying at the end of the summer get the employer letter and substitute that if you think it's better.

Is it ameliorated at all if the pre-1L employer is a law firm?

[A. Nony Mouse]

I still wouldn't. But when I was applying the plan was still a thing, so people had more law-school-timeframe options. So I can't say definitively it's a terrible idea. There are definitely judges who want to see all academic recommendations, though. Of course, some judges want an employer's rec, too, so it's a dilemma either way (though I think there are more of the former than the latter).

[Auxilio]

I still wouldn't. But when I was applying the plan was still a thing, so people had more law-school-timeframe options. So I can't say definitively it's a terrible idea. There are definitely judges who want to see all academic recommendations, though. Of course, some judges want an employer's rec, too, so it's a dilemma either way (though I think there are more of the former than the latter).

I'll probably just get another academic rec then, was thinking before I could have waited until 1L summer job knew me enough (but judge is rarely there, so going to take till at least the end). Am I right that I go with lukewarm law prof over really friendly and positive History undergrad prof?

[A. Nony Mouse]

Yeah, I wouldn't do an undergrad prof. But if other people disagree they should chime in - the compressed time frame does make things tougher.

[Anonymous User]

So I got my grades back and have a 3.89 cumulative (Mich/Northwestern/GULC) and a "star" prof told me he would "go to bat" for me re: clerkships. Should I be frantically sending apps to a couple feeders before OSCAR opens on July 1?

[Anonymous User]

FWIW, my feeder hired a Harvard 2018er for '18-'19 several weeks ago.

[FloridaCoastalorbust]

FWIW, my feeder hired a Harvard 2018er for '18-'19 several weeks ago.

[CourCour]

Yeah, I wouldn't do an undergrad prof. But if other people disagree they should chime in - the compressed time frame does make things tougher.

I totally disagree. A lukewarm app is a total waste. Anyone can get a professor to say lukewarm things about them. While it might not be worth so much better have a stellar letter from an undergrad professor then ---- was in my class, K thanx bye. Work with your undergrad professor to make sure its law clerk oriented.