2022-2023 Post-Clerkship Hiring Forum

[Anonymous User]

PW, Kirkland, and Quinn (all NYC) are actively recruiting from Delaware clerkships.

[OPM]

had a few boutique interviews but none for biglaw yet. double clerk, T6. could it be that biglaw firms just aren't looking for clerks? Clerks are expensive and the biglaw lit model doesn't really need that many nor the kind of skillset or talent that clerks bring

what do you mean by this? My experience has been that big firms tend to appreciate/actively recruit clerks in lit?

Not OP but their original point that clerks are not as attractive to big law firms is correct. While firms like Susman and Quinn have raised clerkship bonuses big law clerkship bonuses have remained stagnant. The majority of profitable big law litigation is white collar and you certainly don't need a clerkship to be a good government investigations attorney (in fact I'd argue that associates that leave to clerk for a year are more are stunted compared to white collar associates that stayed at the firm). In a down market, existing litigation associates are usually safe but they have an obvious incentive to not expand loss leader groups like appellate.

Nobody who does a decent clerkship wants to do investigations, people who want to do criminal law want to do actual criminal work that can get them into AUSA/FPD positions

It also just isn’t true that white collar is the most profitable lit specialty (what?)

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

[Anonymous User]

had a few boutique interviews but none for biglaw yet. double clerk, T6. could it be that biglaw firms just aren't looking for clerks? Clerks are expensive and the biglaw lit model doesn't really need that many nor the kind of skillset or talent that clerks bring

what do you mean by this? My experience has been that big firms tend to appreciate/actively recruit clerks in lit?

Not OP but their original point that clerks are not as attractive to big law firms is correct. While firms like Susman and Quinn have raised clerkship bonuses big law clerkship bonuses have remained stagnant. The majority of profitable big law litigation is white collar and you certainly don't need a clerkship to be a good government investigations attorney (in fact I'd argue that associates that leave to clerk for a year are more are stunted compared to white collar associates that stayed at the firm). In a down market, existing litigation associates are usually safe but they have an obvious incentive to not expand loss leader groups like appellate.

Nobody who does a decent clerkship wants to do investigations, people who want to do criminal law want to do actual criminal work that can get them into AUSA/FPD positions

It also just isn’t true that white collar is the most profitable lit specialty (what?)

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Aren't at least a few of those places DC only? OP noted NYC.

[Anonymous User]

It seems like Gibson might be moving now?

Can confirm, I know of someone dinged by Gibson in the last week.

Is this post interview? I recently got an interview invite.

Which office?

LA.

[Anonymous User]

had a few boutique interviews but none for biglaw yet. double clerk, T6. could it be that biglaw firms just aren't looking for clerks? Clerks are expensive and the biglaw lit model doesn't really need that many nor the kind of skillset or talent that clerks bring

what do you mean by this? My experience has been that big firms tend to appreciate/actively recruit clerks in lit?

Not OP but their original point that clerks are not as attractive to big law firms is correct. While firms like Susman and Quinn have raised clerkship bonuses big law clerkship bonuses have remained stagnant. The majority of profitable big law litigation is white collar and you certainly don't need a clerkship to be a good government investigations attorney (in fact I'd argue that associates that leave to clerk for a year are more are stunted compared to white collar associates that stayed at the firm). In a down market, existing litigation associates are usually safe but they have an obvious incentive to not expand loss leader groups like appellate.

Nobody who does a decent clerkship wants to do investigations, people who want to do criminal law want to do actual criminal work that can get them into AUSA/FPD positions

It also just isn’t true that white collar is the most profitable lit specialty (what?)

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

[Anonymous User]

yeah I think the core of the concern isn't for people with feeder judges or feeder credentials, rather the more "average" clerk (even COA) looking to switch firms post-clerkship.

[Anonymous User]

what do you mean by this? My experience has been that big firms tend to appreciate/actively recruit clerks in lit?

Not OP but their original point that clerks are not as attractive to big law firms is correct. While firms like Susman and Quinn have raised clerkship bonuses big law clerkship bonuses have remained stagnant. The majority of profitable big law litigation is white collar and you certainly don't need a clerkship to be a good government investigations attorney (in fact I'd argue that associates that leave to clerk for a year are more are stunted compared to white collar associates that stayed at the firm). In a down market, existing litigation associates are usually safe but they have an obvious incentive to not expand loss leader groups like appellate.

Nobody who does a decent clerkship wants to do investigations, people who want to do criminal law want to do actual criminal work that can get them into AUSA/FPD positions

It also just isn’t true that white collar is the most profitable lit specialty (what?)

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

It appears from past posts that OPM went to Y/S and clerked for COA. At the very least, I suspect what they are seeing is not what top students at lower-ranked T14/T20 schools in COA or FDCs are experiencing right now.

[OPM]

what do you mean by this? My experience has been that big firms tend to appreciate/actively recruit clerks in lit?

Not OP but their original point that clerks are not as attractive to big law firms is correct. While firms like Susman and Quinn have raised clerkship bonuses big law clerkship bonuses have remained stagnant. The majority of profitable big law litigation is white collar and you certainly don't need a clerkship to be a good government investigations attorney (in fact I'd argue that associates that leave to clerk for a year are more are stunted compared to white collar associates that stayed at the firm). In a down market, existing litigation associates are usually safe but they have an obvious incentive to not expand loss leader groups like appellate.

Nobody who does a decent clerkship wants to do investigations, people who want to do criminal law want to do actual criminal work that can get them into AUSA/FPD positions

It also just isn’t true that white collar is the most profitable lit specialty (what?)

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

To clarify, yes my judges are feeders. Interviews and offers across NYC, DC, Boston offices—not just DC, where I am. Yes, the clerks I’m helping have good credentials, but the point is just that firms are hiring. How much they’ve tightened classes up, I don’t know. I know that my firm is hiring a relatively normal sized clerk class across NYC and DC. Point of the post was just to push back against the idea that many of these firms are taking *no* clerk laterals because of market conditions etc.

[Anonymous User]

Not OP but their original point that clerks are not as attractive to big law firms is correct. While firms like Susman and Quinn have raised clerkship bonuses big law clerkship bonuses have remained stagnant. The majority of profitable big law litigation is white collar and you certainly don't need a clerkship to be a good government investigations attorney (in fact I'd argue that associates that leave to clerk for a year are more are stunted compared to white collar associates that stayed at the firm). In a down market, existing litigation associates are usually safe but they have an obvious incentive to not expand loss leader groups like appellate.

Nobody who does a decent clerkship wants to do investigations, people who want to do criminal law want to do actual criminal work that can get them into AUSA/FPD positions

It also just isn’t true that white collar is the most profitable lit specialty (what?)

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

To clarify, yes my judges are feeders. Interviews and offers across NYC, DC, Boston offices—not just DC, where I am. Yes, the clerks I’m helping have good credentials, but the point is just that firms are hiring. How much they’ve tightened classes up, I don’t know. I know that my firm is hiring a relatively normal sized clerk class across NYC and DC. Point of the post was just to push back against the idea that many of these firms are taking *no* clerk laterals because of market conditions etc.

Thanks so much!! I will take my transcript and Coif plaque from my mid-T14 school and tell the firms to fill one of their three available spots with me instead of the HYS clerks from feeder judges. Perfect, actionable intel.

[Anonymous User]

Nobody who does a decent clerkship wants to do investigations, people who want to do criminal law want to do actual criminal work that can get them into AUSA/FPD positions

It also just isn’t true that white collar is the most profitable lit specialty (what?)

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

To clarify, yes my judges are feeders. Interviews and offers across NYC, DC, Boston offices—not just DC, where I am. Yes, the clerks I’m helping have good credentials, but the point is just that firms are hiring. How much they’ve tightened classes up, I don’t know. I know that my firm is hiring a relatively normal sized clerk class across NYC and DC. Point of the post was just to push back against the idea that many of these firms are taking *no* clerk laterals because of market conditions etc.

Thanks so much!! I will take my transcript and Coif plaque from my mid-T14 school and tell the firms to fill one of their three available spots with me instead of the HYS clerks from feeder judges. Perfect, actionable intel.

FWIW, I'm top 20% HYS and clerked for two occasional feeders who sit in major cities. I've struck out completely in NY despite outreach through my judges' clerk networks. Not even a single interview. Granted, I liked my pre-clerkship firm so I only applied to a handful of places, but I assumed it would be fairly easy to get interviews and offers with my profile. It is genuinely challenging this year, perhaps unless you're a Srinivasan or Sutton clerk.

[Anonymous User]

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

To clarify, yes my judges are feeders. Interviews and offers across NYC, DC, Boston offices—not just DC, where I am. Yes, the clerks I’m helping have good credentials, but the point is just that firms are hiring. How much they’ve tightened classes up, I don’t know. I know that my firm is hiring a relatively normal sized clerk class across NYC and DC. Point of the post was just to push back against the idea that many of these firms are taking *no* clerk laterals because of market conditions etc.

Thanks so much!! I will take my transcript and Coif plaque from my mid-T14 school and tell the firms to fill one of their three available spots with me instead of the HYS clerks from feeder judges. Perfect, actionable intel.

FWIW, I'm top 20% HYS and clerked for two occasional feeders who sit in major cities. I've struck out completely in NY despite outreach through my judges' clerk networks. Not even a single interview. Granted, I liked my pre-clerkship firm so I only applied to a handful of places, but I assumed it would be fairly easy to get interviews and offers with my profile. It is genuinely challenging this year, perhaps unless you're a Srinivasan or Sutton clerk.

Yeah, I was also rejected out of pocket from a lot of places I would have anticipated interviews in a normal hiring cycle. Luckily, I have an offer from my pre-clerkship firm too, but glad to know its not just me.

Just wanted to make the point that it is objectively bad in NYC and OPM's post was a little bit obtuse in light of what most relatively "normal" A3 applicants are dealing with.

[Anonymous User]

Hiring is stressful, but I think there’s some unneeded aggression here. This thread gets angsty every year. Clerking is no guarantee of tons of biglaw interest, especially if you have the normal biglaw headwinds—lack of a biglaw 2L summer, lower-tier school, lack of geographic ties, etc. But it’s true that if you aren’t getting much interest, that doesn’t mean nobody else is. Pure biglaw litigation is just competitive. Regardless people get positions way later than this, it’s not time to panic.

Also, not all of the jobs are going to feeder clerks because there just aren’t that many feeder clerks on the market—there aren’t many to begin with (that’s why they’re special snowflakes) and lots go back to their 2L firms or to niche employers like small boutiques and fellowships.

[Anonymous User]

Not OP but their original point that clerks are not as attractive to big law firms is correct. While firms like Susman and Quinn have raised clerkship bonuses big law clerkship bonuses have remained stagnant. The majority of profitable big law litigation is white collar and you certainly don't need a clerkship to be a good government investigations attorney (in fact I'd argue that associates that leave to clerk for a year are more are stunted compared to white collar associates that stayed at the firm). In a down market, existing litigation associates are usually safe but they have an obvious incentive to not expand loss leader groups like appellate.

Nobody who does a decent clerkship wants to do investigations, people who want to do criminal law want to do actual criminal work that can get them into AUSA/FPD positions

It also just isn’t true that white collar is the most profitable lit specialty (what?)

Yeah this. Also, litigation is countercyclical. It's corporate that shrinks in down years.

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

To clarify, yes my judges are feeders. Interviews and offers across NYC, DC, Boston offices—not just DC, where I am. Yes, the clerks I’m helping have good credentials, but the point is just that firms are hiring. How much they’ve tightened classes up, I don’t know. I know that my firm is hiring a relatively normal sized clerk class across NYC and DC. Point of the post was just to push back against the idea that many of these firms are taking *no* clerk laterals because of market conditions etc.

Thanks OPM. But, it would be great if more clerks not from HYS coming from feeder judges could chime in. I imagine even when hiring is at it worst, HYS top 20% clerks will likely always have at least a few offers. Doesn't tell us much about the broader market for A3 clerks.

[OPM]

Seems not to be the case in NYC at the moment, where litigation is obviously more directly tied to capital markets. Many large firms do not seem to be hiring in litigation right now, including, Latham, Skadden, PW, Kirkland, and MiIlbank. At least, that's what I suspect based on friends recruiting processes and their relative qualifications. So far, the only spots in NYC I have affirmatively heard of interviewing folks in lit are Cravath, S&C, Quinn, and Susman. I wonder if that comports with others experiences in NYC lit this cycle?

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

To clarify, yes my judges are feeders. Interviews and offers across NYC, DC, Boston offices—not just DC, where I am. Yes, the clerks I’m helping have good credentials, but the point is just that firms are hiring. How much they’ve tightened classes up, I don’t know. I know that my firm is hiring a relatively normal sized clerk class across NYC and DC. Point of the post was just to push back against the idea that many of these firms are taking *no* clerk laterals because of market conditions etc.

Thanks so much!! I will take my transcript and Coif plaque from my mid-T14 school and tell the firms to fill one of their three available spots with me instead of the HYS clerks from feeder judges. Perfect, actionable intel.

FWIW, I'm top 20% HYS and clerked for two occasional feeders who sit in major cities. I've struck out completely in NY despite outreach through my judges' clerk networks. Not even a single interview. Granted, I liked my pre-clerkship firm so I only applied to a handful of places, but I assumed it would be fairly easy to get interviews and offers with my profile. It is genuinely challenging this year, perhaps unless you're a Srinivasan or Sutton clerk.

Yeah, I was also rejected out of pocket from a lot of places I would have anticipated interviews in a normal hiring cycle. Luckily, I have an offer from my pre-clerkship firm too, but glad to know its not just me.

Just wanted to make the point that it is objectively bad in NYC and OPM's post was a little bit obtuse in light of what most relatively "normal" A3 applicants are dealing with.

Certainly was not trying to be obtuse, and apologize if the post came across that way. I can’t speak to what I don’t know, only offer the data points that I have. I’m not trying to suggest that the market is easy, but I would still push back against the people saying you need to be a Sri or Sutton clerk to get a firm offer this year. Not all of the clerks I’m helping are like the very top of their class at HYS either. Without doxxing myself, across my two judges, there are other clerks who have either somewhat lower grades or come from other schools. And I am interviewing for my firm, which has extended offers to circuit clerks from MVPB schools who did not clerk for top feeders or anything.

Biglaw lit is more competitive than people realize, it’s idiosyncratic, and I think firms are moving slowly this year. I don’t mean to make light of the people who are struggling this year—I’ve been there and it sucks. The good news is that fed clerks will eventually be fine in my experience. I just think sometimes this forum can be biased towards the downside, and at least one of the clerks i’m helping has been texting me for weeks freaked out because of things they’ve been reading here.

[Anonymous User]

Just chiming in here to say that's not true. I am involved with my firm's hiring, and also help my judges' clerks with recruiting each year. For the current clerks, I know of interviews at: Wilmer, Jones Day, Kirkland, Ropes, Susman, Quinn, Skadden, Covington, Gibson, Latham, Crabath, Sullcrom, Williams & Connolly, Paul Weiss, Kellogg. And this is just the ones I'm helping. Offers have been handed out about half of these firms from direct knowledge. It is a bit slower this year and generally a bit more selective, and they have been recent. But I think some of the fear-mongering on here isn't quite fair: clerks are still getting looks and offers.

Is your judge a feeder?

To clarify, yes my judges are feeders. Interviews and offers across NYC, DC, Boston offices—not just DC, where I am. Yes, the clerks I’m helping have good credentials, but the point is just that firms are hiring. How much they’ve tightened classes up, I don’t know. I know that my firm is hiring a relatively normal sized clerk class across NYC and DC. Point of the post was just to push back against the idea that many of these firms are taking *no* clerk laterals because of market conditions etc.

Thanks so much!! I will take my transcript and Coif plaque from my mid-T14 school and tell the firms to fill one of their three available spots with me instead of the HYS clerks from feeder judges. Perfect, actionable intel.

FWIW, I'm top 20% HYS and clerked for two occasional feeders who sit in major cities. I've struck out completely in NY despite outreach through my judges' clerk networks. Not even a single interview. Granted, I liked my pre-clerkship firm so I only applied to a handful of places, but I assumed it would be fairly easy to get interviews and offers with my profile. It is genuinely challenging this year, perhaps unless you're a Srinivasan or Sutton clerk.

Yeah, I was also rejected out of pocket from a lot of places I would have anticipated interviews in a normal hiring cycle. Luckily, I have an offer from my pre-clerkship firm too, but glad to know its not just me.

Just wanted to make the point that it is objectively bad in NYC and OPM's post was a little bit obtuse in light of what most relatively "normal" A3 applicants are dealing with.

Certainly was not trying to be obtuse, and apologize if the post came across that way. I can’t speak to what I don’t know, only offer the data points that I have. I’m not trying to suggest that the market is easy, but I would still push back against the people saying you need to be a Sri or Sutton clerk to get a firm offer this year. Not all of the clerks I’m helping are like the very top of their class at HYS either. Without doxxing myself, across my two judges, there are other clerks who have either somewhat lower grades or come from other schools. And I am interviewing for my firm, which has extended offers to circuit clerks from MVPB schools who did not clerk for top feeders or anything.

Biglaw lit is more competitive than people realize, it’s idiosyncratic, and I think firms are moving slowly this year. I don’t mean to make light of the people who are struggling this year—I’ve been there and it sucks. The good news is that fed clerks will eventually be fine in my experience. I just think sometimes this forum can be biased towards the downside, and at least one of the clerks i’m helping has been texting me for weeks freaked out because of things they’ve been reading here.

On that note, I have some bright news for the "average" folks out there!

I was a top ~20-25% of my class at a T20, LR, and I am clerking in an FDC in a big city (not SDNY or anything, my judge has no NYC connections). After striking out many places I felt like I "should" have been competitive (I think I had 5 dings, no interviews), I did a ton of networking and landed callbacks at two top NYC biglaw firms that outranked my rejections--both in lit. So far, I have gotten an offer from one, and I am waiting to hear back from the other.

The market is objectively tough, but there are jobs out there! Stay brave friends. I echo that A3 clerks will be ok eventually, even if we are hustling harder than expected

[Anonymous User]

I guess the big question is why is this slow clerk cycle occurring? Are firms in a holding position based on inflation? Something else? Any insight from those in the know might be helpful to see if a change could occur in next few months or we’re screwed.

[Anonymous User]

Just posting to sprinkle some positive vibes on this thread. I have no doubt that all of you are amazing, hardworking, and intelligent people - and we will all land on our feet!

[Anonymous User]

Ding from Paul Weiss, Cleary (the email was worded as if they aren't in a position to hire anyone at the moment), Gibson Dunn, Quinn, & DPW

Screener with Kirkland NY & Latham DC

[Anonymous User]

What are the prospects for a fed mag clerk in a non-competitive district? Applying to major markets with connections and median at T25. Looking for lit boutiques!

[Anonymous User]

What are the prospects for a fed mag clerk in a non-competitive district? Applying to major markets with connections and median at T25. Looking for lit boutiques!

Quite poor tbh. That generally isn’t a competitive resume for biglaw lit, let alone boutiques (which tend to be pickier), and a magistrate clerkship in a non-competitive district doesn’t significantly improve your app. I’d make sure you’re also applying in your judge’s local area and other places you have ties.

[Anonymous User]

What are the prospects for a fed mag clerk in a non-competitive district? Applying to major markets with connections and median at T25. Looking for lit boutiques!

Quite poor tbh. That generally isn’t a competitive resume for biglaw lit, let alone boutiques (which tend to be pickier), and a magistrate clerkship in a non-competitive district doesn’t significantly improve your app. I’d make sure you’re also applying in your judge’s local area and other places you have ties.

Gonna veto the above. I'd say where you should look might be guided by your grades. If they were top third, I'd recommend networking with alumni in the markets you're interested in and then applying wherever you want. Let the firms tell you no! You don't need to be top 5% at HYS to get a job at biglaw lit in a major market.

Also, underrated, Houston has a lot of biglaw and interesting lit boutiques you might consider. Massive city, no state income tax, and really active firms. Somewhere like Susman or V&E probably aren't an option unless you were tip top of your class, but I'd consider AZA or Reynolds Frizzell.

[himi bimi]

What are the prospects for a fed mag clerk in a non-competitive district? Applying to major markets with connections and median at T25. Looking for lit boutiques!

Quite poor tbh. That generally isn’t a competitive resume for biglaw lit, let alone boutiques (which tend to be pickier), and a magistrate clerkship in a non-competitive district doesn’t significantly improve your app. I’d make sure you’re also applying in your judge’s local area and other places you have ties.

What about fed mag clerk in Boston looking in Boston?

[Anonymous User]

What are the prospects for a fed mag clerk in a non-competitive district? Applying to major markets with connections and median at T25. Looking for lit boutiques!

Quite poor tbh. That generally isn’t a competitive resume for biglaw lit, let alone boutiques (which tend to be pickier), and a magistrate clerkship in a non-competitive district doesn’t significantly improve your app. I’d make sure you’re also applying in your judge’s local area and other places you have ties.

boutiques like susman and HH are out, and a lot of DC litigation is out, but chances at a big firm aren't bad in New York

[Chokenhauer]

What are the prospects for a fed mag clerk in a non-competitive district? Applying to major markets with connections and median at T25. Looking for lit boutiques!

Quite poor tbh. That generally isn’t a competitive resume for biglaw lit, let alone boutiques (which tend to be pickier), and a magistrate clerkship in a non-competitive district doesn’t significantly improve your app. I’d make sure you’re also applying in your judge’s local area and other places you have ties.

What about fed mag clerk in Boston looking in Boston?

Someone feel free to correct me, but I think Boston firms love Boston ties. That might give you an edge. I think someone clerking for D. Mass. is quite competitive, considering I think even WH poaches MJ clerks from there.

[himi bimi]

What are the prospects for a fed mag clerk in a non-competitive district? Applying to major markets with connections and median at T25. Looking for lit boutiques!

Quite poor tbh. That generally isn’t a competitive resume for biglaw lit, let alone boutiques (which tend to be pickier), and a magistrate clerkship in a non-competitive district doesn’t significantly improve your app. I’d make sure you’re also applying in your judge’s local area and other places you have ties.

What about fed mag clerk in Boston looking in Boston?

Someone feel free to correct me, but I think Boston firms love Boston ties. That might give you an edge. I think someone clerking for D. Mass. is quite competitive, considering I think even WH poaches MJ clerks from there.

Thank you so much!