Summer Day to Day Forum

[KunAgnis]

No troll, seriously wanted advice.

So I'm a KJD and will be starting as a summer associate at a firm. I want to study for/pass the patent bar and work out every day if possible. So I wondered if anyone who has had experience summering could provide an input.

6 30 AM: wake up
6 45 AM: leave house
7 to 7 45 AM: work out (mostly cardio)
8 50 AM: arrive at office

7 PM: leave office
7 40 PM to 8 30PM: dinner
8 30PM to 9 00 PM: relax
9 00PM to 11 00PM: study for patent bar
1130PM: sleep

Does anyone think this is a viable schedule or am I being overly ambitious here? Haven't worked a real job before, hence the nature of my question.

[SmokeytheBear]

No troll, seriously wanted advice.

So I'm a KJD and will be starting as a summer associate at a firm. I want to study for/pass the patent bar and work out every day if possible. So I wondered if anyone who has had experience summering could provide an input.

6 30 AM: wake up
6 45 AM: leave house
7 to 7 45 AM: work out (mostly cardio)
8 50 AM: arrive at office

7 PM: leave office
7 40 PM to 8 30PM: dinner
8 30PM to 9 00 PM: relax
9 00PM to 11 00PM: study for patent bar
1130PM: sleep

Does anyone think this is a viable schedule or am I being overly ambitious here? Haven't worked a real job before, hence the nature of my question.

I don't think ambitious is the correct word; perhaps rigid.

If you're summering at a firm, each day is different. Some days you're going to be able to leave at 5pm and there won't be any events; you should take this time to seriously increase the amount of relaxing. Some days there will be events that will last until at the very least 8pm if not later. It's the summer, so you need to make yourself available to the firm and the people. I've known several people to get no offered because they did not make themselves available to the firm--either socially or professionally--after business hours.

I think your morning schedule is great--but you gotta leave the evening more open. If not, you're going to get too stressed out that you made a rigid schedule for you and you will have to abandon that schedule some days. Most firms will give you a calendar the first day of the summer so you have an idea of the days where there are *scheduled* events. But there will be many impromptu events that you *should* go to.

Also, summering at a firm is basically the best summer you'll have during your adult life. You get exposed to substantive work, but little is expected of you. Great lunches. Great dinners. Awesome events. Take advantage of it. Take a breath and enjoy it.

[SeewhathappensLarry]

No troll, seriously wanted advice.

So I'm a KJD and will be starting as a summer associate at a firm. I want to study for/pass the patent bar and work out every day if possible. So I wondered if anyone who has had experience summering could provide an input.

6 30 AM: wake up
6 45 AM: leave house
7 to 7 45 AM: work out (mostly cardio)
8 50 AM: arrive at office

7 PM: leave office
7 40 PM to 8 30PM: dinner
8 30PM to 9 00 PM: relax
9 00PM to 11 00PM: study for patent bar
1130PM: sleep

Does anyone think this is a viable schedule or am I being overly ambitious here? Haven't worked a real job before, hence the nature of my question.

I don't think ambitious is the correct word; perhaps rigid.

If you're summering at a firm, each day is different. Some days you're going to be able to leave at 5pm and there won't be any events; you should take this time to seriously increase the amount of relaxing. Some days there will be events that will last until at the very least 8pm if not later. It's the summer, so you need to make yourself available to the firm and the people. I've known several people to get no offered because they did not make themselves available to the firm--either socially or professionally--after business hours.

I think your morning schedule is great--but you gotta leave the evening more open. If not, you're going to get too stressed out that you made a rigid schedule for you and you will have to abandon that schedule some days. Most firms will give you a calendar the first day of the summer so you have an idea of the days where there are *scheduled* events. But there will be many impromptu events that you *should* go to.

Also, summering at a firm is basically the best summer you'll have during your adult life. You get exposed to substantive work, but little is expected of you. Great lunches. Great dinners. Awesome events. Take advantage of it. Take a breath and enjoy it.

I second all of this. Don't be the person that always has to leave events early or skips them altogether. Also, if you drink it might be tough to study after firm events. I stuck to a rigid schedule when I was a summer but I only used the mornings for the things I needed to get done, including working out. But that involved waking up around 4:30/5 every day.

[Mr. Blackacre]

I'll add to the above by saying it's impossible to accurately tell you without knowing the firm, b/c different firms treat their summers differently. At my firm last summer (DC V50), there wasn't a single day where I did actual work 9-7. There were maybe 10 days where I had firm social events past 7, and the rest of the time (i.e. 80% of the time) I was out by 5:30-6:00. I was one of the later ones, and even got yelled at a bunch of times for being there too late. On the other hand if I'd gone to Cravath, I'd be working probably 9:00-9:00 all summer.

Unlike the commenters above, my schedule was also very predictable. I got a calendar of events at the start of the summer, and planned around the evening events. There were basically no impromptu events, but again it depends on the firm. You will probably have the time for your study, but I'd wait until the summer to actually start planning formally.

[Pure Applesauce]

if you are at the office during your SA from 850am-7pm every day, you are doing summer completely wrong

[RaceJudicata]

if you are at the office during your SA from 850am-7pm every day, you are doing summer completely wrong

^^

[SmokeytheBear]

if you are at the office during your SA from 850am-7pm every day, you are doing summer completely wrong

This.

That said, I respect that you have your eye on doing the patent bar and commend you for wanting to make a schedule so that you feel as if you can attend to your summer associate responsibilities and pass the bar. I'm just pushing you to realize two things (which may seem a bit counter to the other):

1. Much like when you go to work for the firm full time, the firm pays you the obnoxious amount that they do during your summer so that you are available to them generally. So be available to them generally.

2. That said, you're sounding like a vegan who is riding the gravy train with biscuit wheels. Take a bit of a break for the summer and indulge.

[NYC2012]

.

[RaceJudicata]

"Doing summer wrong" is not a thing when your firm gives you tons of assignments and there are also lots of social events (which you do have to attend). I had basically no control over my life during my summer. We had lots of work, and daily lunches and frequent social events meant that I often logged on and worked from home in the late night hours. I would just be prepared for either situation, not every firm is chill with their summers.

Sucks, dude.

[Pure Applesauce]

"Doing summer wrong" is not a thing when your firm gives you tons of assignments and there are also lots of social events (which you do have to attend). I had basically no control over my life during my summer. We had lots of work, and daily lunches and frequent social events meant that I often logged on and worked from home in the late night hours. I would just be prepared for either situation, not every firm is chill with their summers.

that sucks, but most firms are not this way

and your situation completely different from making a schedule in advance and planningto be at the office for 10 hours a day. Sure if you have to, obviously be there when they tell you.

[bearsfan23]

"Doing summer wrong" is not a thing when your firm gives you tons of assignments and there are also lots of social events (which you do have to attend). I had basically no control over my life during my summer. We had lots of work, and daily lunches and frequent social events meant that I often logged on and worked from home in the late night hours. I would just be prepared for either situation, not every firm is chill with their summers.

The downside of Cravath

[KunAgnis]

Thanks everyone for the input. I have received a schedule and it looks like, roughly speaking, about 3 to 4 evening events each week. I'm not too sure if there will be impromptu events at all but if there are, I'll probably just attend those and study more during the weekends. Again, thanks a lot for the wisdom and advice.

[RaceJudicata]

Thanks everyone for the input. I have received a schedule and it looks like, roughly speaking, about 3 to 4 evening events each week. I'm not too sure if there will be impromptu events at all but if there are, I'll probably just attend those and study more during the weekends. Again, thanks a lot for the wisdom and advice.

Damn, that's a pretty heavy schedule.

[TheSpanishMain]

Just an aside, but if you have something you need to do, honestly, you can skip evening events. I wouldn't make a habit of it, but don't think that missing a dinner = no offer.

[BaberhamLincoln]

You don't have time between school ending and job starting or job ending and school starting to cram for patent bar? That's what I did last summer (studied end of April and May before SA began).

[umichman]

I never actually worked past 5. The partners would actually make fun of us if we stayed later. Any associate that made a summer stay later was reprimanded by partners. However, there were impromptu bar night type stuff where partners or associates would ask if wanted to go to a ball game or go get drinks or something. Make sure you can say yes to that kind of thing because it really is fun and useful to get to know people outside of work settings and official events.

[KunAgnis]

You don't have time between school ending and job starting or job ending and school starting to cram for patent bar? That's what I did last summer (studied end of April and May before SA began).

Late reply, just saw this. I'm not sure if I need to do that (low-key burnt out from cramming for finals), since I'm estimating the study time requirement to be roughly 100 hours. So I was thinking to put in 25 hours each week and finish by mid June and take the exam in July.

[KunAgnis]

I never actually worked past 5. The partners would actually make fun of us if we stayed later. Any associate that made a summer stay later was reprimanded by partners. However, there were impromptu bar night type stuff where partners or associates would ask if wanted to go to a ball game or go get drinks or something. Make sure you can say yes to that kind of thing because it really is fun and useful to get to know people outside of work settings and official events.

Thanks for the pointer, I'll be sure to attend the social events and bond with the associates and partners. To be honest, the above schedule I listed of "til 7PM" was meant to potentially include time for night events. The firm lists starting times for social events and any that start at night begins at 5PM, which made me assume work hours would be til 5PM for summers.

[KunAgnis]

Just an aside, but if you have something you need to do, honestly, you can skip evening events. I wouldn't make a habit of it, but don't think that missing a dinner = no offer.

I'm going to err on the side of not skipping, because this office has a smaller class size so I feel like one person missing is going to stick out.

[TheSpanishMain]

Just an aside, but if you have something you need to do, honestly, you can skip evening events. I wouldn't make a habit of it, but don't think that missing a dinner = no offer.

I'm going to err on the side of not skipping, because this office has a smaller class size so I feel like one person missing is going to stick out.

You definitely can't miss regularly without raising a red flag. I'm just saying that if you are truly under the gun, you're not going to lose your offer because you went home after work instead of to another happy hour. You can also do what I usually did with events like that: go for a bit, have one drink and mingle, make sure you chat people up, and then dip out early. I'm older and married and was much more into going home to see my wife and dog than I was hanging out with a bunch of firm people for hours on end.