Why do we have the MPRE? Forum

[amk110]

Having passed the February bar exam, but using all of my finances to take it, I had nothing left to pay for the March MPRE, and thus, cannot take it until August. Meaning I can't swear in this month with fellow February bar exam passers, and must wait until September to swear in with the July crowd.

Then I started wondering why there's an MPRE at all, and why states can't just lump this all into one test. Why not put ethics on the MBE? Why not have the MPRE be a part of the bar exam itself?

Does anyone have any insight as to why the states have decided to do things this way?

[zot1]

To take all of our money.

[amk110]

Well, at least it's a lot cheaper than the bar exam.

Seriously though, I can't find anything on the interweb to explain why we have to take two exams, or why this can't somehow be combined into one. Couldn't they just up the cost of the single exam to make up the difference in revenue?

[zot1]

The MPRE and the bar require substantially different amounts of preparation. Personally, I wouldn't want to add anything else to the bar. That's just adding another way to help people fail.

[amk110]

This is true. But for the relatively short amount of preparation the MPRE requires versus the bar exam, I'd rather they just lump this into one. It's especially infuriating in my case, given the MPRE is only offered twice per year. I took it once in law school, but missed it by 5 points. After dealing with this year's bar exam, full of civil procedure, and experimental wills questions (yeah, they're probably adding that to property...) and an ethics essay, I just wish it were all in one exam.

[A. Nony Mouse]

3x a year.

[banjo]

Partly historical accident, partly the notion that ethics is so important that you need to test it independently. If they just tested it on the bar, students could theoretically blow off ethics and focus on other subjects. Someone wrote a whole LR article on the origin of the MPRE, which I skimmed: http://ir.lawnet.fordham.edu/cgi/viewco ... ontext=flr.

In practice, most students treat the MPRE as a huge joke, but there's too much inertia and status quo bias in our profession to change anything.

[zot1]

This is true. But for the relatively short amount of preparation the MPRE requires versus the bar exam, I'd rather they just lump this into one. It's especially infuriating in my case, given the MPRE is only offered twice per year. I took it once in law school, but missed it by 5 points. After dealing with this year's bar exam, full of civil procedure, and experimental wills questions (yeah, they're probably adding that to property...) and an ethics essay, I just wish it were all in one exam.

You just sound upset because you haven't passed it. I get it... I took it twice only to end up in a jurisdiction that would have accepted my first score. How's that for an MPRE joke?

[reasonableperson]

Partly historical accident, partly the notion that ethics is so important that you need to test it independently. If they just tested it on the bar, students could theoretically blow off ethics and focus on other subjects. Someone wrote a whole LR article on the origin of the MPRE, which I skimmed: http://ir.lawnet.fordham.edu/cgi/viewco ... ontext=flr.

In practice, most students treat the MPRE as a huge joke, but there's too much inertia and status quo bias in our profession to change anything.

TITCR.

[amk110]

There are a whole lot of things I want to respond to and I'm not sure how to quote you all. But here goes:

1) Yes, 3x a year. Sorry, I completely forgot about that November offering.

2) You're right. I didn't pass. I took it once during 2L year, and missed it by 5 points. The score I received would have been passing in a lot of jurisdictions. (I got an 80. I'm in an 85 jurisdiction.)

3) I've never seen that acronym before. What's TITCR?

I'm still frustrated as a February passer that was too poor after that exam to afford the March MPRE. I'm stuck unlicensed until September at the earliest.

And while it's possible that students would blow off ethics entirely if it were merely another subject on the bar exam, how is this reconciled with the fact that most students treat the MPRE as a huge joke anyway, and barely study at all for it? I myself stayed up all night before the exam, studying for about 7 hours.

I still maintain it would be far more efficient for there to only be a single licensing examination.


EDIT: I'm too drunk to read that article on the origin of the MPRE, but I'm definitely going to tomorrow. Forgive me if I'm rehashing anything that article has addressed.

EDIT 2: Looked up that TITCR thing. Isn't the Google age awesome?

[zot1]

Why stop there, the amount of money we have to pay to get licensed and remain licensed is insane, specially for non-BigLaw attorneys.

[consesusadidem]

There are a whole lot of things I want to respond to and I'm not sure how to quote you all. But here goes:

1) Yes, 3x a year. Sorry, I completely forgot about that November offering.

2) You're right. I didn't pass. I took it once during 2L year, and missed it by 5 points. The score I received would have been passing in a lot of jurisdictions. (I got an 80. I'm in an 85 jurisdiction.)

3) I've never seen that acronym before. What's TITCR?

I'm still frustrated as a February passer that was too poor after that exam to afford the March MPRE. I'm stuck unlicensed until September at the earliest.

And while it's possible that students would blow off ethics entirely if it were merely another subject on the bar exam, how is this reconciled with the fact that most students treat the MPRE as a huge joke anyway, and barely study at all for it? I myself stayed up all night before the exam, studying for about 7 hours.

I still maintain it would be far more efficient for there to only be a single licensing examination.


EDIT: I'm too drunk to read that article on the origin of the MPRE, but I'm definitely going to tomorrow. Forgive me if I'm rehashing anything that article has addressed.

EDIT 2: Looked up that TITCR thing. Isn't the Google age awesome?

Is the MPRE difficult? Does anyone how long it takes to get the results from the MPRE please?

[brorepresentation1]

"Is the MPRE difficult?" Yes. Failed it once, passed it after sufficient studying. Do 300 BARBRI questions and watch Chemerinskys BARBRI video and you will do fine; however, taking it cold is risky.


People on this website will tell you otherwise.... Play it safe..

[speed_the_loot]

.

[lacrossebrother]

Enron & Watergate

[lacrossebrother]

http://www.nationallawjournal.com/id=12 ... =concierge

[philosoraptor]

Maryland has ethics on the bar exam and no MPRE requirement. Its lawyers don't seem any more or less ethical than those in other states. Makes it extra-annoying to get licensed in a second jurisdiction, though, since integrated ethics doesn't replace the MPRE...

[Actus Reus]

The MPRE is not difficult.

fin

[jrass]

If you want the one true answer, the Bible explicitly discusses the MPRE so the Board of Examiners' hands are tied: https://books.google.com/books?id=qkEDG ... re&f=false (third line from the top on p. 483).