Class Participation Forum

[Bruce W. 1991]

Serious question...

What do you all think about the kids who participate consistently in doctrinal classes?

They seem very articulate and insightful, but are they the ones that get the As?

[Trippel]

Some will get A's. Many will not. There will also be ppl who never seem to have a clue what's going on who will get A's.

[Traynor Brah]

do not concern yourself with what goes on in class. Period.

[star fox]

Yeah some people are serial participators, it's fine as long as they don't waste everyone's time by asking dumb questions. Don't really worry about other people's grades or whatever.

[totesTheGoat]

do not concern yourself with what goes on in class. Period.

The only reason I can be here to agree with this is because I'm practicing this as we speak.

[Ajren Robben]

Serious question...

What do you all think about the kids who participate consistently in doctrinal classes?

They seem very articulate and insightful, but are they the ones that get the As?

No. The people who know how to take issuer-spotter exams and type fast get the As.

[Bruce W. 1991]

Is there a correlation between class participation and grades?

The answer seems to be no.

Probably a pointless question, but I always find myself thinking about it in class when these kids seem like they were born to raise their hand.

My focus has been 100 percent on the exam. Hopefully it pays off.

[RaceJudicata]

I am a serial participator. It helps me stay engaged in the class (and helps me avoid getting distracted by the inter web). That being said, I do my best to not hold up the class or ask irrelevant questions.

It has worked for me, however, I know many other serial participators have gotten shit grades, while other students who don't pay a second of attention ace the exams.

Bottom line, don't worry about what other people in the class are doing. Be an adult, understand people learn differently, and do what works best for you.

[Bruce W. 1991]

I am a serial participator. It helps me stay engaged in the class (and helps me avoid getting distracted by the inter web). That being said, I do my best to not hold up the class or ask irrelevant questions.

It has worked for me, however, I know many other serial participators have gotten shit grades, while other students who don't pay a second of attention ace the exams.

Bottom line, don't worry about what other people in the class are doing. Be an adult, understand people learn differently, and do what works best for you.

I think that's good advice. The only reason I bring it up is because it is impossible not worry about what other people are doing in class...captive audience. I'm also not going to sit there and zone out or surf the web.

I enjoy listening to most people's comments. If anything I am jealous of the ease with which they participate. Maybe I'm paranoid and think there's something wrong with me for not participating.

[RaceJudicata]

I am a serial participator. It helps me stay engaged in the class (and helps me avoid getting distracted by the inter web). That being said, I do my best to not hold up the class or ask irrelevant questions.

It has worked for me, however, I know many other serial participators have gotten shit grades, while other students who don't pay a second of attention ace the exams.

Bottom line, don't worry about what other people in the class are doing. Be an adult, understand people learn differently, and do what works best for you.

I think that's good advice. The only reason I bring it up is because it is impossible not worry about what other people are doing in class...captive audience. I'm also not going to sit there and zone out or surf the web.

I enjoy listening to most people's comments. If anything I am jealous of the ease with which they participate. Maybe I'm paranoid and think there's something wrong with me for not participating.

Zoning out and surfing the web is one of the best parts of my day! Grades are still strong...

[BVest]

The main participators in my section almost all did very well. In fact all the ones I can think of graduated top 10% with the exception of one. The one guy who didn't do well was the guy who always participated to sound smart. All the others seemed to participate only in the non-cold-call classes when it was apparent that (a) the prof wasn't going to move on until someone at least tried to answer the question and (2) no one else was going to volunteer, and in the cold-call classes when it looked like the person on call wanted help.

[KMart]

Just don't waste everyone's time. They're paying to hear the professor, not you.

[rcharter1978]

Serious question...

What do you all think about the kids who participate consistently in doctrinal classes?

They seem very articulate and insightful, but are they the ones that get the As?

I'm late to this, but you always must look at what a person is saying, not just the fact that they are talking.

If they are just giving an opinion, as many people in law school like to do, thats fine, and actually pretty interesting, but that won't really give you an idea if they actually know anything about the class. If they are actually talking about applying a rule to a case, if they know a rule, if they can brief a case and respond to the professors questions about the case, I think that is a person who might do well.

And always watch out for the guy who thinks he is smarter than the professor and wants to show it by arguing. Please watch for that dude, because: a) he is normally not as smart as the professor, b) he is not as smart as he thinks he is, c) that guy doesn't know how to read a room and d) that is the guy that won't know shit, but will try to convince you he knows everything.

And you should learn to hate the person that wants to raise their hand a minute before the end of class to give a long winded opinion about something no one cares about. He is normally the guy that wants to argue with the professor. Two of the most intelligent people I knew in law school almost never raised their hand, but if they were asked to brief a case they always nailed it. But of course, by the time you pass 1L I think professors know who they want to pick on and who they don't.

[BVest]

And always watch out for the guy who thinks he is smarter than the professor and wants to show it by arguing. Please watch for that dude, because: a) he is normally not as smart as the professor, b) he is not as smart as he thinks he is, c) that guy doesn't know how to read a room and d) that is the guy that won't know shit, but will try to convince you he knows everything.

We had this guy. He was so unaware of his context that the prof, when discussing Peevyhouse, noted that many of us would disagree with it, but there would also be one person who would try to convince him it was wrong for several weeks. The dude was still talking to the prof after class about Peevyhouse at the end of the semester, like six or eight weeks later.

[rcharter1978]

And always watch out for the guy who thinks he is smarter than the professor and wants to show it by arguing. Please watch for that dude, because: a) he is normally not as smart as the professor, b) he is not as smart as he thinks he is, c) that guy doesn't know how to read a room and d) that is the guy that won't know shit, but will try to convince you he knows everything.

We had this guy. He was so unaware of his context that the prof, when discussing Peevyhouse, noted that many of us would disagree with it, but there would also be one person who would try to convince him it was wrong for several weeks. The dude was still talking to the prof after class about Peevyhouse at the end of the semester, like six or eight weeks later.

Ugh. That's the guy. The guy in my evidence class would make it a point to go to office hours to argue with the professor....in addition to his in class monologues. I bought so much shit from Amazon while that guy was bloviating. Your professor must have wanted to make a run for it by the end of the semester.

[EzraFitz]

And always watch out for the guy who thinks he is smarter than the professor and wants to show it by arguing. Please watch for that dude, because: a) he is normally not as smart as the professor, b) he is not as smart as he thinks he is, c) that guy doesn't know how to read a room and d) that is the guy that won't know shit, but will try to convince you he knows everything.

We had this guy. He was so unaware of his context that the prof, when discussing Peevyhouse, noted that many of us would disagree with it, but there would also be one person who would try to convince him it was wrong for several weeks. The dude was still talking to the prof after class about Peevyhouse at the end of the semester, like six or eight weeks later.

Ugh. That's the guy. The guy in my evidence class would make it a point to go to office hours to argue with the professor....in addition to his in class monologues. I bought so much shit from Amazon while that guy was bloviating. Your professor must have wanted to make a run for it by the end of the semester.

I am a serial participator, but only to the extent of answering questions set out to crickets, and only for relevant topics. I sat beside another serial participator, a windbag of a thing who was so bad, that by the end of the semester, the professor actively made fun of him when he spoke. Take one guess at who got As and who got Bs. Participation matters if it's done the right way. Just like studying matters if it's done in the right way.

[rcharter1978]

And always watch out for the guy who thinks he is smarter than the professor and wants to show it by arguing. Please watch for that dude, because: a) he is normally not as smart as the professor, b) he is not as smart as he thinks he is, c) that guy doesn't know how to read a room and d) that is the guy that won't know shit, but will try to convince you he knows everything.

We had this guy. He was so unaware of his context that the prof, when discussing Peevyhouse, noted that many of us would disagree with it, but there would also be one person who would try to convince him it was wrong for several weeks. The dude was still talking to the prof after class about Peevyhouse at the end of the semester, like six or eight weeks later.

Ugh. That's the guy. The guy in my evidence class would make it a point to go to office hours to argue with the professor....in addition to his in class monologues. I bought so much shit from Amazon while that guy was bloviating. Your professor must have wanted to make a run for it by the end of the semester.

I am a serial participator, but only to the extent of answering questions set out to crickets, and only for relevant topics. I sat beside another serial participator, a windbag of a thing who was so bad, that by the end of the semester, the professor actively made fun of him when he spoke. Take one guess at who got As and who got Bs. Participation matters if it's done the right way. Just like studying matters if it's done in the right way.

I agree there is a difference. And like you said, participating is a way to stay actively engaged in the material. It's only a difference in the quality of the participation. But, I guess even the windbags serve their purpose, since it gives you a little mental break to check the Sephora site or whatever sports scores. The only person I actively despised was the guy who raised his hand to make windbag point #10 a minute before class ended. I think people were patient at first, but after a while everyone would just loudly pack up their stuff.

[bretby]

And always watch out for the guy who thinks he is smarter than the professor and wants to show it by arguing. Please watch for that dude, because: a) he is normally not as smart as the professor, b) he is not as smart as he thinks he is, c) that guy doesn't know how to read a room and d) that is the guy that won't know shit, but will try to convince you he knows everything.

We had this guy. He was so unaware of his context that the prof, when discussing Peevyhouse, noted that many of us would disagree with it, but there would also be one person who would try to convince him it was wrong for several weeks. The dude was still talking to the prof after class about Peevyhouse at the end of the semester, like six or eight weeks later.

Ugh. That's the guy. The guy in my evidence class would make it a point to go to office hours to argue with the professor....in addition to his in class monologues. I bought so much shit from Amazon while that guy was bloviating. Your professor must have wanted to make a run for it by the end of the semester.

I am a serial participator, but only to the extent of answering questions set out to crickets, and only for relevant topics. I sat beside another serial participator, a windbag of a thing who was so bad, that by the end of the semester, the professor actively made fun of him when he spoke. Take one guess at who got As and who got Bs. Participation matters if it's done the right way. Just like studying matters if it's done in the right way.

Agreed. One point, though is that the people who are asking questions, even if they are "stupid" questions, will often turn out to be the more successful overall (maybe not in grades or initial hires, but in the long run). Feeling comfortable asking questions (while also keeping in mind the mood/pace of the room) is essential to doing well in a job. Plus, professors do not know where people are confused unless someone asks a question, and it's rare that the question is one that ONLY that person has and that on which everyone else is crystal clear. Listening to answers to other students' questions can be more helpful than the initial explanation. Certainly way more helpful than wasting time online.

[EzraFitz]

And always watch out for the guy who thinks he is smarter than the professor and wants to show it by arguing. Please watch for that dude, because: a) he is normally not as smart as the professor, b) he is not as smart as he thinks he is, c) that guy doesn't know how to read a room and d) that is the guy that won't know shit, but will try to convince you he knows everything.

We had this guy. He was so unaware of his context that the prof, when discussing Peevyhouse, noted that many of us would disagree with it, but there would also be one person who would try to convince him it was wrong for several weeks. The dude was still talking to the prof after class about Peevyhouse at the end of the semester, like six or eight weeks later.

Ugh. That's the guy. The guy in my evidence class would make it a point to go to office hours to argue with the professor....in addition to his in class monologues. I bought so much shit from Amazon while that guy was bloviating. Your professor must have wanted to make a run for it by the end of the semester.

I am a serial participator, but only to the extent of answering questions set out to crickets, and only for relevant topics. I sat beside another serial participator, a windbag of a thing who was so bad, that by the end of the semester, the professor actively made fun of him when he spoke. Take one guess at who got As and who got Bs. Participation matters if it's done the right way. Just like studying matters if it's done in the right way.

Agreed. One point, though is that the people who are asking questions, even if they are "stupid" questions, will often turn out to be the more successful overall (maybe not in grades or initial hires, but in the long run). Feeling comfortable asking questions (while also keeping in mind the mood/pace of the room) is essential to doing well in a job. Plus, professors do not know where people are confused unless someone asks a question, and it's rare that the question is one that ONLY that person has and that on which everyone else is crystal clear. Listening to answers to other students' questions can be more helpful than the initial explanation. Certainly way more helpful than wasting time online.

Well, this particular person was not asking questions 90% of the time. He was either attempting to correct the book or the professor, or bringing up a tangential point, sometimes unrelated to the entire doctrine of the class we were in.

[General_Tso]

In my experience the gunners did not do very well. One gunner that I thought was very smart based on her comments failed the bar exam her first try. Don't be intimidated by them