It's only orientation...and I'm having a meltdown? Forum

[BigZuck]

I don't even really know how I would fill 60 hours a week

This is my whole thing. I literally don't know what you could possibly work on for that long. I guess just read/brief the cases over and over? Read multiple supplements? What else could you do?

[sublime]

..

[PepperJack]

I don't even really know how I would fill 60 hours a week

This is my whole thing. I literally don't know what you could possibly work on for that long. I guess just read/brief the cases over and over? Read multiple supplements? What else could you do?

I mean, at some point you can do PT's until your eyes bleed, but you can probably read multiple supplements per class in less than 40 a week.

Maybe profs at TTT's just assign more?

The basic fact is people who struggled through college and got a 150 on the LSAT are for the most part going to function slower than you. They require more time to see what you can see right away. What I have heard from friends and people in big law from TTT's (admittedly anecdotal) is that 80% of the class clearly should not be in law school, but there's heavy competition at the top. Because only a quarter of the qualified 20% are going to get a good job, there's a lot of competition.

[Mal Reynolds]

Just stop, pepper jack.

[bjsesq]

Just stop, pepper jack.

No, please keep going, Pepper Jack. Tell us more.

[McAvoy]

My logic was the reverse of that, Paul. Not if they study a lot, they'll have a good shot.

Learn how to quote, dickhead. Go back and fix it so you don't make Campos look like an asshole.

[heavoldgotjuice]

I went to a TTTT w/o a scholarship and probably studied 80+ hours a week in order to be #1 or to transfer. I ended up doing both and am now at a t-14 w/ a need-based scholarship and an offer from OCI.

If you're going to a non-t14 and you want to do really well for job purposes, then you will have no life and your marriage will likely suffer for 1L year.
If you're going to a t-14, then just relax and do your best to balance everything.

[LAWYER2]

Way overblown. Some people might do that but you absolutely don't have to. And most will not.

TRUTH!

I remember folks sitting up there talking about how they had to read their casebooks while in line at the grocery store, never saw their families, etc, blah blah. Bish please, I worked full time, attended classes all week during the evenings, partied on Fridays, then studied for approx. 6-8 hours a day on the weekend. Rinse & Repeat for 4 years straight.
Stop letting folks with limited life experience scare you.

[PepperJack]

I went to a TTTT w/o a scholarship and probably studied 80+ hours a week in order to be #1 or to transfer. I ended up doing both and am now at a t-14 w/ a need-based scholarship and an offer from OCI.

If you're going to a non-t14 and you want to do really well for job purposes, then you will have no life and your marriage will likely suffer for 1L year.
If you're going to a t-14, then just relax and do your best to balance everything.

only one person out of the three-hundred-and-fifty people will do this in OP's class. yes, they should drop out, and betting on being like this person is beyond stupid. but the idea that being number one in any game with three-hundred-and-fifty people is all luck is similarly stupid. yes, luck is needed. no, time alone won't guarantee anything. but if OP and this poster were competing with each other for one result on one test, game, job, etc. -> this poster is going to win most of the time. my point, which i stand by, and has been disputed was never that OP shouldn't drop out. It was just that if they don't work their tail off it is one-hundred percent certainty they get screwed vs. a ninety-nine point seven percent certainty.

[TTRansfer]

Stop giving horrible advice. The OP is currently three days into classes, so he can still get a full refund. More important, this "if you're going to stay then study 60 hours a week so you can have a good shot of being one of the top five people in your class" nonsense is based on the idea that getting top grades in law school is based on how hard you study, which in my experience (25 years of teaching) is almost completely untrue once people are past a certain minimal threshold that's way, way less than that.

I mean, anecdotal evidence and all, but the people at the top of my 1L class were mostly my friends (I studied with like 5 out of the top 10 people, not including myself) and we all studied about the same length of time. It's a mix of time and studying correctly, but most people aren't going to be able to jerk off all night and do well.

[pancakes3]

I went to a TTTT w/o a scholarship and probably studied 80+ hours a week in order to be #1 or to transfer. I ended up doing both and am now at a t-14 w/ a need-based scholarship and an offer from OCI.

If you're going to a non-t14 and you want to do really well for job purposes, then you will have no life and your marriage will likely suffer for 1L year.
If you're going to a t-14, then just relax and do your best to balance everything.

To me the question still remains, how are you filling those 80+ hrs? Are you counting class? Commute?

[Progress01]

OP here.
Few points of clarification: OP is a female, first in the family to pursue more than a bachelors, there are NO attorneys in my family. Anywhere. School is tier 4 (yes, bring the flames), I'm on a scholarship that covers close to all of tuition. Won't say what school, in case my classmates came across this (although, from asking most of them...Most didn't/don't even know what this forum is, so that's probably not a concern).

So life update: We are entering week 5 of school. And this meltdown I was having when I started the thread isn't really the same--I now am understanding the time it takes to brief and study and prepare for class and work on hypos and study questions. And I have NO IDEA who the hell they were catering that 60 hours a week to. I don't even know. People that only can read 10 pages an hour? No clue. It doesn't take me that long. It fills up my nights, early mornings and lunch hours, but I can do it. I keep up well, I get cold called and am okay, etc.

BUT...I still hate every minute of every day. I hate all my classes, with torts being the one I dislike the least (which seems uncommon, as everyone I know loves Civ Pro and I want to stab myself while I'm in there). I have time to eat..I just don't want to. I hate my readings. And I don't like the people I go to school with. My family thinks this is the greatest thing ever--They think now that law school is prestige and money when I get out, etc. And how you can do "anything" with a law degree (but let's be real, unless anything means attorney, you can't).
The economy is worse here than where I'm from. My parents aren't super well to do, but they're doing pretty well financially and they bought a little house here--less than 5 mins from school, for less than a car. It's really old and has some issues, but my dad came and has been ripping out and remodeling things with me. Which makes me feel even MORE guilty for hating--they're like "Why can't you be happy? We got you a place to live. Stop being whiny and just suck it up and do it." So I'm stuck here.

1 out of 5 of my professors has a wedding ring. They all look like REALLY happy people.

I miss science. I miss psychology. I would give anything to hear someone say the word phenotype. NO ONE here is interested in those things. I haven't even met anyone who had the same undergraduate major (or combo of majors) as me.
I WISH I would have taken the GRE, and applied to grad school.

I went to counseling the other day. I was told I have a very high depression index. I can't say I'm really surprised. I don't laugh anymore. I don't smile.

[patogordo]

oh god you went to law school AND detroit? i'm so sorry

[BigZuck]

Drop out immediately. You have to get yourself right and law school obviously isn't helping.

[McAvoy]

Yeah drop out OP. Get yourself right and figure out what you actually want to do. If you take a year or two and decide law school is what you actually wanted to do, you can retake the LSAT and go somewhere actually worth attending. And it's not like dropping out is going to "set you back" or anything; depending on what TTT you're at, dropping out might be TCR even if you loved school so far.

[Danger Zone]

OP here.
Few points of clarification: OP is a female, first in the family to pursue more than a bachelors, there are NO attorneys in my family. Anywhere. School is tier 4 (yes, bring the flames), I'm on a scholarship that covers close to all of tuition. Won't say what school, in case my classmates came across this (although, from asking most of them...Most didn't/don't even know what this forum is, so that's probably not a concern).

So life update: We are entering week 5 of school. And this meltdown I was having when I started the thread isn't really the same--I now am understanding the time it takes to brief and study and prepare for class and work on hypos and study questions. And I have NO IDEA who the hell they were catering that 60 hours a week to. I don't even know. People that only can read 10 pages an hour? No clue. It doesn't take me that long. It fills up my nights, early mornings and lunch hours, but I can do it. I keep up well, I get cold called and am okay, etc.

BUT...I still hate every minute of every day. I hate all my classes, with torts being the one I dislike the least (which seems uncommon, as everyone I know loves Civ Pro and I want to stab myself while I'm in there). I have time to eat..I just don't want to. I hate my readings. And I don't like the people I go to school with. My family thinks this is the greatest thing ever--They think now that law school is prestige and money when I get out, etc. And how you can do "anything" with a law degree (but let's be real, unless anything means attorney, you can't).
The economy is worse here than where I'm from. My parents aren't super well to do, but they're doing pretty well financially and they bought a little house here--less than 5 mins from school, for less than a car. It's really old and has some issues, but my dad came and has been ripping out and remodeling things with me. Which makes me feel even MORE guilty for hating--they're like "Why can't you be happy? We got you a place to live. Stop being whiny and just suck it up and do it." So I'm stuck here.

1 out of 5 of my professors has a wedding ring. They all look like REALLY happy people.

I miss science. I miss psychology. I would give anything to hear someone say the word phenotype. NO ONE here is interested in those things. I haven't even met anyone who had the same undergraduate major (or combo of majors) as me.
I WISH I would have taken the GRE, and applied to grad school.

I went to counseling the other day. I was told I have a very high depression index. I can't say I'm really surprised. I don't laugh anymore. I don't smile.

You absolutely need to drop out.

[BigZuck]

Yeah drop out OP. Get yourself right and figure out what you actually want to do. If you take a year or two and decide law school is what you actually wanted to do, you can retake the LSAT and go somewhere actually worth attending. And it's not like dropping out is going to "set you back" or anything; depending on what TTT you're at, dropping out might be TCR even if you loved school so far.

Agreed, the OP's job prospects will likely be better without this JD.

[It's A Lion]

OP here.
Few points of clarification: OP is a female, first in the family to pursue more than a bachelors, there are NO attorneys in my family. Anywhere. School is tier 4 (yes, bring the flames), I'm on a scholarship that covers close to all of tuition. Won't say what school, in case my classmates came across this (although, from asking most of them...Most didn't/don't even know what this forum is, so that's probably not a concern).

So life update: We are entering week 5 of school. And this meltdown I was having when I started the thread isn't really the same--I now am understanding the time it takes to brief and study and prepare for class and work on hypos and study questions. And I have NO IDEA who the hell they were catering that 60 hours a week to. I don't even know. People that only can read 10 pages an hour? No clue. It doesn't take me that long. It fills up my nights, early mornings and lunch hours, but I can do it. I keep up well, I get cold called and am okay, etc.

BUT...I still hate every minute of every day. I hate all my classes, with torts being the one I dislike the least (which seems uncommon, as everyone I know loves Civ Pro and I want to stab myself while I'm in there). I have time to eat..I just don't want to. I hate my readings. And I don't like the people I go to school with. My family thinks this is the greatest thing ever--They think now that law school is prestige and money when I get out, etc. And how you can do "anything" with a law degree (but let's be real, unless anything means attorney, you can't).
The economy is worse here than where I'm from. My parents aren't super well to do, but they're doing pretty well financially and they bought a little house here--less than 5 mins from school, for less than a car. It's really old and has some issues, but my dad came and has been ripping out and remodeling things with me. Which makes me feel even MORE guilty for hating--they're like "Why can't you be happy? We got you a place to live. Stop being whiny and just suck it up and do it." So I'm stuck here.

1 out of 5 of my professors has a wedding ring. They all look like REALLY happy people.

I miss science. I miss psychology. I would give anything to hear someone say the word phenotype. NO ONE here is interested in those things. I haven't even met anyone who had the same undergraduate major (or combo of majors) as me.
I WISH I would have taken the GRE, and applied to grad school.

I went to counseling the other day. I was told I have a very high depression index. I can't say I'm really surprised. I don't laugh anymore. I don't smile.

Hey OP, what did you do for fun prior to law school?

Law school is not worth harming your mental health, which can lead to harming your physical health.

You'll likely have some long weekends coming up. Use them to relax. Go out with friends. Exercise. Have a late night bender. Whatever you do to relax. Don't worry about course work for a weekend.

[crazycanuck]

BUT...I still hate every minute of every day. I hate all my classes, with torts being the one I dislike the least (which seems uncommon, as everyone I know loves Civ Pro and I want to stab myself while I'm in there). I have time to eat..I just don't want to. I hate my readings. And I don't like the people I go to school with. My family thinks this is the greatest thing ever--They think now that law school is prestige and money when I get out, etc. And how you can do "anything" with a law degree (but let's be real, unless anything means attorney, you can't).
The economy is worse here than where I'm from. My parents aren't super well to do, but they're doing pretty well financially and they bought a little house here--less than 5 mins from school, for less than a car. It's really old and has some issues, but my dad came and has been ripping out and remodeling things with me. Which makes me feel even MORE guilty for hating--they're like "Why can't you be happy? We got you a place to live. Stop being whiny and just suck it up and do it." So I'm stuck here.

This is your life. Not theirs. You hate it, that's telling you something. The cost of a car isn't a huge financial investment. They'll be fine if you decide you don't want to be there anymore.

Do what maximizes your happiness. Law school doesn't seem to be doing that.

[pancakes3]

I'm as much for people dropping out of T4's as anyone but I think the underlying source of "hate" here isn't law school. I don't really know how anyone can hate civpro so much that it casts a pall over their entire lives. I think it's good that you're talking it out but I think you might need to pop some pills to get your brain chemistry in check. Don't expect to drop out of law school and then all of a sudden your world view immediately blinks into a more rosy disposition.

[Wingtip88]

-

[Young Marino]

OP, you are traveling down a dangerous road here. If u do not have the passion to be a lawyer, don't do it. You will only hate your life more and more everyday. This profession isn't for everyone. Drop out, cut your losses and go to grad school at Detroit if u have a decent living situation set up.

[NYCFAN1]

OP here.
Few points of clarification: OP is a female, first in the family to pursue more than a bachelors, there are NO attorneys in my family. Anywhere. School is tier 4 (yes, bring the flames), I'm on a scholarship that covers close to all of tuition. Won't say what school, in case my classmates came across this (although, from asking most of them...Most didn't/don't even know what this forum is, so that's probably not a concern).

So life update: We are entering week 5 of school. And this meltdown I was having when I started the thread isn't really the same--I now am understanding the time it takes to brief and study and prepare for class and work on hypos and study questions. And I have NO IDEA who the hell they were catering that 60 hours a week to. I don't even know. People that only can read 10 pages an hour? No clue. It doesn't take me that long. It fills up my nights, early mornings and lunch hours, but I can do it. I keep up well, I get cold called and am okay, etc.

BUT...I still hate every minute of every day. I hate all my classes, with torts being the one I dislike the least (which seems uncommon, as everyone I know loves Civ Pro and I want to stab myself while I'm in there). I have time to eat..I just don't want to. I hate my readings. And I don't like the people I go to school with. My family thinks this is the greatest thing ever--They think now that law school is prestige and money when I get out, etc. And how you can do "anything" with a law degree (but let's be real, unless anything means attorney, you can't).
The economy is worse here than where I'm from. My parents aren't super well to do, but they're doing pretty well financially and they bought a little house here--less than 5 mins from school, for less than a car. It's really old and has some issues, but my dad came and has been ripping out and remodeling things with me. Which makes me feel even MORE guilty for hating--they're like "Why can't you be happy? We got you a place to live. Stop being whiny and just suck it up and do it." So I'm stuck here.

1 out of 5 of my professors has a wedding ring. They all look like REALLY happy people.

I miss science. I miss psychology. I would give anything to hear someone say the word phenotype. NO ONE here is interested in those things. I haven't even met anyone who had the same undergraduate major (or combo of majors) as me.
I WISH I would have taken the GRE, and applied to grad school.

I went to counseling the other day. I was told I have a very high depression index. I can't say I'm really surprised. I don't laugh anymore. I don't smile.

Even if you loved the law, I would tell you to drop out of a T4 immediately. If you don't like any of you classmates, the issue is you.

Life's too short to commit 3 years doing something you dislike. Drop out.

[McAvoy]

OP, you are traveling down a dangerous road here. If u do not have the passion to be a lawyer or are attending a TTT, don't do it. You will only hate your life more and more everyday. This profession isn't for everyone. Drop out, cut your losses and go to grad school at Detroit if u have a decent living situation set up.

I agree with what Young Marino said in bold and disagree with what I have struck out.

I am also glad that YM has stopped encouraging people to attend TTTs

[chevelle64]

Note to the OP:

You should not feel like you are the only person who hates your classes as a 1L. I am a 2L (who is currently happy to have chosen law school BTW) who felt somewhat similar to you at this same point last year. I didn't enjoy most of my classes, didn't understand why I viewed being at law school differently than most of the people in my class, and thought this was a bad decision for me. I had worked before law school (for a STEM field firm) and started to regret leaving my old job. I had serious discussions with folks close to me about whether I should leave law school too...and hated the readings. None of my friends from back home would have gotten my problem with it since not many folks I knew went to law school and since the school I went to is well known (and none of us knew anyone who had attended before) they would've thought I was stupid to drop out and go back to my very average job.

I stuck it out to see what happened. Things grew on me a bit during the course of the year and (as is common with these things) started to like it more as time went on. Two things made it a lot better: (a) I had an internship with a firm last summer and really actually loved the work. More than what I did before (and not just summer fun activities, I mean the actual work). School is not the same as working in a legal field (granted I have a limited view from one summer) and since you have a more technical (probably also hardworking from your description) viewpoint, you may find it better. (b) You can find areas of the law (NOTE: AFTER 1L ONLY) that you can study which intersect with your area of interest in many cases. You'll start to see this next year and you'll feel better about your choice.

I know I have and I don't regret it anymore

FYI Conventional wisdom on this site is often to drop out. This should be more targeted advice and shouldn't be something you do just because of where you go to school. Take more time to think about how you can use your differences from other classmates to make yourself stand out.