Should I get a MacBook Pro? Forum

[SuichiKurama]

I was originally leaning toward the Macbook Pro, but I ultimately opted for a Lenovo T410 instead. The cost was similar but I ended up getting a faster processor and larger hard drive for the same price ($1100). I also didn't want to deal with bootcamp or any compatibility issues as I'm a PC user at heart.

These are the exact two laptops I'm debating between.

http://www.uvastudentcomputers.com/shop ... 7A16561775

http://www.uvastudentcomputers.com/shop ... 7A16561775

[JOThompson]

Those are both solid machines and you can't go wrong with either choice. If you get a chance to test out both models, it may help you decide. The build quality on the Lenovo seemed a bit sturdier to me and the internal rollcage added to my peace of mind. I found the T410 keyboard to be very natural, whereas the MBP felt awkward to me, and that difference sealed my choice.

Also, if you buy directly from Apple, I think they're still doing the free iPod promotion. That's combinable with the $100 student discount. You wouldn't get that three year Applecare though

[SuichiKurama]

Those are both solid machines and you can't go wrong with either choice. If you get a chance to test out both models, it may help you decide. The build quality on the Lenovo seemed a bit sturdier to me and the internal rollcage added to my peace of mind. I found the T410 keyboard to be very natural, whereas the MBP felt awkward to me, and that difference sealed my choice.

Also, if you buy directly from Apple, I think they're still doing the free iPod promotion. That's combinable with the $100 student discount. You wouldn't get that three year Applecare though

UVA does the rebate for it. I've used the Mac keyboard a few times before and I hated it.....but I like it's lower price combined with the Ipod thing. I know I'll be buying a Ipod regardless so it does sort of entice me, I hate how Mac doesn't have OneNote though; I really want OneNote.

[ResolutePear]

Those are both solid machines and you can't go wrong with either choice. If you get a chance to test out both models, it may help you decide. The build quality on the Lenovo seemed a bit sturdier to me and the internal rollcage added to my peace of mind. I found the T410 keyboard to be very natural, whereas the MBP felt awkward to me, and that difference sealed my choice.

Also, if you buy directly from Apple, I think they're still doing the free iPod promotion. That's combinable with the $100 student discount. You wouldn't get that three year Applecare though

UVA does the rebate for it. I've used the Mac keyboard a few times before and I hated it.....but I like it's lower price combined with the Ipod thing. I know I'll be buying a Ipod regardless so it does sort of entice me, I hate how Mac doesn't have OneNote though; I really want OneNote.

Chances are, getting a Thinkpad + iPod will still be less expensive.

If you're hellbent on getting a Macbook - you can boot off windows with it... though at that point you paid too much for your PC. On the other hand, there is also the possibility of successfully loading OSX on select laptops.

[GettingReady2010]

Emma, please read into Darwin/FreeBSD and EFI before making statements like that. It just proves my point that people who want Macbooks want them because they're "in" but really know nothing else about it.

Dude, really? You are calling me out because I asked that question? I was just trying to get clarity on what you meant.

+1 These people are actually kind of funny.

It's so much more than that they think Macs are inferior to other computers. They seem to be actually offended and pissed off when someone says that they are buying one. I have no idea why.

Just for the record, I have never met anyone who was truly unsatisfied with their Mac.

[SuichiKurama]

Those are both solid machines and you can't go wrong with either choice. If you get a chance to test out both models, it may help you decide. The build quality on the Lenovo seemed a bit sturdier to me and the internal rollcage added to my peace of mind. I found the T410 keyboard to be very natural, whereas the MBP felt awkward to me, and that difference sealed my choice.

Also, if you buy directly from Apple, I think they're still doing the free iPod promotion. That's combinable with the $100 student discount. You wouldn't get that three year Applecare though

UVA does the rebate for it. I've used the Mac keyboard a few times before and I hated it.....but I like it's lower price combined with the Ipod thing. I know I'll be buying a Ipod regardless so it does sort of entice me, I hate how Mac doesn't have OneNote though; I really want OneNote.

Chances are, getting a Thinkpad + iPod will still be less expensive.

If you're hellbent on getting a Macbook - you can boot off windows with it... though at that point you paid too much for your PC. On the other hand, there is also the possibility of successfully loading OSX on select laptops.

In this instance it wouldn't, that's what's making the decision a tough one.

--LinkRemoved-- ... 7A16561775

--LinkRemoved-- ... 7A16561775

[wadeny]

MacBook Pros are a great investment, but they're usually just too expensive if you ask me. OP, if money isn't really an object for you, go with the MacBook. If you're looking to save some money, though, go with a PC. Personally, I like Dells, although I know they generally seem to get a bad rep on these boards (and for a good reason in some cases). I've owned Dell laptops for several years and never experienced too many problems; they come with decent warranty and are highly customizable for a great price. The Studio 15 with i5/i7 is a great value for the money ($1k or less depending on the specs). By comparison, the MacBook Pro 15 can easily exceed $2k.

[JOThompson]

MacBook Pros are a great investment, but they're usually just too expensive if you ask me. OP, if money isn't really an object for you, go with the MacBook. If you're looking to save some money, though, go with a PC. Personally, I like Dells, although I know they generally seem to get a bad rep on these boards (and for a good reason in some cases). I've owned Dell laptops for several years and never experienced too many problems; they come with decent warranty and are highly customizable for a great price. The Studio 15 with i5/i7 is a great value for the money ($1k or less depending on the specs). By comparison, the MacBook Pro 15 can easily exceed $2k.

The high resale value on Macs is another point to consider. You can use the hell out of it for a couple years and easily turn around and sell it for several hundred dollars.

[ResolutePear]

MacBook Pros are a great investment, but they're usually just too expensive if you ask me. OP, if money isn't really an object for you, go with the MacBook. If you're looking to save some money, though, go with a PC. Personally, I like Dells, although I know they generally seem to get a bad rep on these boards (and for a good reason in some cases). I've owned Dell laptops for several years and never experienced too many problems; they come with decent warranty and are highly customizable for a great price. The Studio 15 with i5/i7 is a great value for the money ($1k or less depending on the specs). By comparison, the MacBook Pro 15 can easily exceed $2k.

The high resale value on Macs is another point to consider. You can use the hell out of it for a couple years and easily turn around and sell it for several hundred dollars.

With the high resale value, you also have to factor in the high replacement parts and labor price.

[GettingReady2010]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

[ResolutePear]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

This is the most retarded statement I've heard all week.

[Emma.]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

IB ResolutePear talks about how this is a huge exaggeration.

Edit: Fuuuuuck. Too slow.

[ResolutePear]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

IB ResolutePear talks about how this is a huge exaggeration.

Edit: Fuuuuuck. Too slow.

Can't beat the pear

EDIT: But - you're on point with my views.

[GettingReady2010]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

This is the most retarded statement I've heard all week.

If your intention is to one day become a trial lawyer, I suggest that you choose another career path.

[ResolutePear]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

This is the most retarded statement I've heard all week.

If your intention is to one day become a trial lawyer, I suggest that you choose another career path.

You're right. I would totally shit on the prosecution/defense if they said something like this. It would go something like:

Macs are not "virus proof". The only difference between a PC and a Mac is the operating system. If anything, a Mac is MORE prone to viruses and more destructive viruses because of the fact that while all PC manufactures source their parts from different locations and part manufactures - Apple does not. Macs share a LARGE amount of similar parts between different models which allows a malicious coder to target macs more successfully than anything else.


The reason why you don't see this is simple: Macs do not have a large enough market share yet.


Also, who needs a virus when you can just *ASK* the damn OS for root access and execute a one-line shell script: chmod 444 / -R
Game over.

I award you no points.

EDIT: I am aware that there is another part to the shell script, I just didn't want people testing it out and losing all their data.

[Emma.]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

This is the most retarded statement I've heard all week.

If your intention is to one day become a trial lawyer, I suggest that you choose another career path.

You're right. I would totally shit on the prosecution/defense if they said something like this. It would go something like:

Macs are not "virus proof". The only difference between a PC and a Mac is the operating system. If anything, a Mac is MORE prone to viruses and more destructive viruses because of the fact that while all PC manufactures source their parts from different locations and part manufactures - Apple does not. Macs share a LARGE amount of similar parts between different models which allows a malicious coder to target macs more successfully than anything else.


The reason why you don't see this is simple: Macs do not have a large enough market share yet.
[/img]

Also, who needs a virus when you can just *ASK* the damn OS for root access and execute a one-line shell script: chmod 444 / -R
Game over.

I award you no points.

EDIT: I am aware that there is another part to the shell script, I just didn't want people testing it out and losing all their data.

[ResolutePear]

Alright Emma, I raise you with:

[Warhawk]

IMO, if you're willing to shell out the money for a Macbook Pro, get a Dell XPS instead.

And it'll still be cheaper.

[kalvano]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

Macs aren't virus proof.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13846_3-20011 ... 7-1_3-0-20

A new report from security software provider Secunia shows that despite considerable security investments, the software industry at large is unable to produce software with substantially fewer vulnerabilities. The latest data shows that Apple has surpassed Oracle and even Microsoft with accounting for the most software vulnerabilities, though the No. 1 ranking is related only to the number of vulnerabilities--not to how risky they are or how fast they get patched.

This analysis also supports the general perception that a high market share correlates with a high number of vulnerabilities--with Apple (maker of iTunes and QuickTime), Microsoft (Windows, Internet Explorer), and Oracle's Sun Microsystems (Java) consistently occupying the top ranks during the last five years, along with Adobe Systems (Acrobat Reader, Flash), which joined the group in 2008.

Mac OS has remained relatively untouched by major viruses and hacking efforts in the past, as most ne'er-do-wells may have considered the operating system's market share and thus potential for private information less enticing than those of Microsoft's Windows. With the rise of Mac market share and the popularity of the iPhone, however, there is little doubt that Apple platforms will become major malware targets in the near future.

[ResolutePear]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

Macs aren't virus proof.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13846_3-20011 ... 7-1_3-0-20

A new report from security software provider Secunia shows that despite considerable security investments, the software industry at large is unable to produce software with substantially fewer vulnerabilities. The latest data shows that Apple has surpassed Oracle and even Microsoft with accounting for the most software vulnerabilities, though the No. 1 ranking is related only to the number of vulnerabilities--not to how risky they are or how fast they get patched.

This analysis also supports the general perception that a high market share correlates with a high number of vulnerabilities--with Apple (maker of iTunes and QuickTime), Microsoft (Windows, Internet Explorer), and Oracle's Sun Microsystems (Java) consistently occupying the top ranks during the last five years, along with Adobe Systems (Acrobat Reader, Flash), which joined the group in 2008.

Mac OS has remained relatively untouched by major viruses and hacking efforts in the past, as most ne'er-do-wells may have considered the operating system's market share and thus potential for private information less enticing than those of Microsoft's Windows. With the rise of Mac market share and the popularity of the iPhone, however, there is little doubt that Apple platforms will become major malware targets in the near future.

Heh, yeah. Security on a mac is basically:

Hacker: Hello Mac.

Mac: Hello user. Would you like root?

Hacker: ....sure?

Mac: Granted. Have fun!
-------------

For those unaware, root access is like the admin account on Windows - you can do anything and change anything. Any protections given to mac thanks to it's BSD core is circumvented.

[Emma.]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

Macs aren't virus proof.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13846_3-20011 ... 7-1_3-0-20

A new report from security software provider Secunia shows that despite considerable security investments, the software industry at large is unable to produce software with substantially fewer vulnerabilities. The latest data shows that Apple has surpassed Oracle and even Microsoft with accounting for the most software vulnerabilities, though the No. 1 ranking is related only to the number of vulnerabilities--not to how risky they are or how fast they get patched.

This analysis also supports the general perception that a high market share correlates with a high number of vulnerabilities--with Apple (maker of iTunes and QuickTime), Microsoft (Windows, Internet Explorer), and Oracle's Sun Microsystems (Java) consistently occupying the top ranks during the last five years, along with Adobe Systems (Acrobat Reader, Flash), which joined the group in 2008.

Mac OS has remained relatively untouched by major viruses and hacking efforts in the past, as most ne'er-do-wells may have considered the operating system's market share and thus potential for private information less enticing than those of Microsoft's Windows. With the rise of Mac market share and the popularity of the iPhone, however, there is little doubt that Apple platforms will become major malware targets in the near future.

Heh, yeah. Security on a mac is basically:

Hacker: Hello Mac.

Mac: Hello user. Would you like root?

Hacker: ....sure?

Mac: Granted. Have fun!
-------------

For those unaware, root access is like the admin account on Windows - you can do anything and change anything. Any protections given to mac thanks to it's BSD core is circumvented.

The question is, how much does this really affect the subjective experience of a mac user? It might be true that the mac OS is less inherently secure than windows, but when your day to day experience on the computer is that of not having to worry about viruses and malware, isn't that a benefit to the user?

What I don't understand is the basis of your vehemence against the mac. Sure the hardware is often identical to what is found in PCs, and sure macs are expensive to the point of being overpriced, but do you rail against every overpriced product? In your mind is it a terrible mistake to ever pay a premium for a certain brand? Do you buy all your clothes at Walmart?

[kalvano]

The question is, how much does this really affect the subjective experience of a mac user? It might be true that the mac OS is less inherently secure than windows, but when your day to day experience on the computer is that of not having to worry about viruses and malware, isn't that a benefit to the user?

It going to affect it a lot when people start making viruses for Macs.

Also, who worries day-to-day about viruses? That's asinine. Run a virus scanner on a regular basis, and don't click pop-up links or open strange emails. That eliminates 99% of the viruses right there. I've been a Windows user all my life, I've had maybe 2 viruses. This isn't something to worry about. If you have to worry about it, you're doing something wrong.

What I don't understand is the basis of your vehemence against the mac. Sure the hardware is often identical to what is found in PCs, and sure macs are expensive to the point of being overpriced, but do you rail against every overpriced product? In your mind is it a terrible mistake to ever pay a premium for a certain brand? Do you buy all your clothes at Walmart?

I don't think it's so much the fact that they are overpriced as the fact that so many people seem to think they are perfect and inherently better than PC's. Like that idiotic statement about how Macs are virus-proof.

[Emma.]

It going to affect it a lot when people start making viruses for Macs.

I've been hearing that this is going to happen "any day now" literally for years.

Also, who worries day-to-day about viruses? That's asinine. Run a virus scanner on a regular basis, and don't click pop-up links or open strange emails. That eliminates 99% of the viruses right there. I've been a Windows user all my life, I've had maybe 2 viruses. This isn't something to worry about. If you have to worry about it, you're doing something wrong.

I totally agree with you here. It really isn't a big selling point to me for the mac, or something I consider a serious problem for PCs. In the end my main attraction to the mac is that I've been an Apple user all my life, since before there were macs (yeah, I'm showing my age here). It is a question of familiarity more than anything. I don't know my way around windows nearly as well as I know my way around the Mac OS, and for a long time learning windows was far less intuitive than learning to use a mac, so I just didn't really make the effort. I'll freely admit though that part of my attraction to the mac is that I like Pretty Things, and I'm willing to pay that premium.

What I don't understand is the basis of your vehemence against the mac. Sure the hardware is often identical to what is found in PCs, and sure macs are expensive to the point of being overpriced, but do you rail against every overpriced product? In your mind is it a terrible mistake to ever pay a premium for a certain brand? Do you buy all your clothes at Walmart?

I don't think it's so much the fact that they are overpriced as the fact that so many people seem to think they are perfect and inherently better than PC's. Like that idiotic statement about how Macs are virus-proof.

Again, I agree that it is ridiculous to think macs are perfect, but equally ridiculous to pour hate onto them.

[ResolutePear]

I haven't heard anyone comment on how Macs are virus proof, also.

Macs aren't virus proof.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13846_3-20011 ... 7-1_3-0-20

A new report from security software provider Secunia shows that despite considerable security investments, the software industry at large is unable to produce software with substantially fewer vulnerabilities. The latest data shows that Apple has surpassed Oracle and even Microsoft with accounting for the most software vulnerabilities, though the No. 1 ranking is related only to the number of vulnerabilities--not to how risky they are or how fast they get patched.

This analysis also supports the general perception that a high market share correlates with a high number of vulnerabilities--with Apple (maker of iTunes and QuickTime), Microsoft (Windows, Internet Explorer), and Oracle's Sun Microsystems (Java) consistently occupying the top ranks during the last five years, along with Adobe Systems (Acrobat Reader, Flash), which joined the group in 2008.

Mac OS has remained relatively untouched by major viruses and hacking efforts in the past, as most ne'er-do-wells may have considered the operating system's market share and thus potential for private information less enticing than those of Microsoft's Windows. With the rise of Mac market share and the popularity of the iPhone, however, there is little doubt that Apple platforms will become major malware targets in the near future.

Heh, yeah. Security on a mac is basically:

Hacker: Hello Mac.

Mac: Hello user. Would you like root?

Hacker: ....sure?

Mac: Granted. Have fun!
-------------

For those unaware, root access is like the admin account on Windows - you can do anything and change anything. Any protections given to mac thanks to it's BSD core is circumvented.

The question is, how much does this really affect the subjective experience of a mac user? It might be true that the mac OS is less inherently secure than windows, but when your day to day experience on the computer is that of not having to worry about viruses and malware, isn't that a benefit to the user?

What I don't understand is the basis of your vehemence against the mac. Sure the hardware is often identical to what is found in PCs, and sure macs are expensive to the point of being overpriced, but do you rail against every overpriced product? In your mind is it a terrible mistake to ever pay a premium for a certain brand? Do you buy all your clothes at Walmart?

To be honest, I'm just having fun playing the devil's advocate here and the virus-proof argument strikes at me like a well-done steak. I can argue against Windows/PCs just as good, heh.. and I say this while typing away on a copy OSX, after all... a lot of the vulnerabilities were introduced to make the OS more 'friendly' and I have no problem nerdifying it back up

Just because a user ignorant to viruses and malware doesn't mean the user protected. Malware isn't this magical software that transforms your computer to shit - sometimes you'll never notice it. Although the market share is quite small for OSX there are and still will be people who want to target macs for a specific reason(CD Key to the new Adobe suite, for instance.)

And... the only thing I've ever bought from Walmart are Dickies. My wardrobe currently consists of shirt.woot.com shirts and Levi jeans.

[kalvano]

In the end my main attraction to the mac is that I've been an Apple user all my life, since before there were macs (yeah, I'm showing my age here). It is a question of familiarity more than anything. I don't know my way around windows nearly as well as I know my way around the Mac OS, and for a long time learning windows was far less intuitive than learning to use a mac, so I just didn't really make the effort. I'll freely admit though that part of my attraction to the mac is that I like Pretty Things, and I'm willing to pay that premium.

And that's a perfectly valid reason. I like Windows for the same reason.

It used to be true that Macs (I remember working on an Apple II. Damn, I'm old.) were much better than PC's.

Now, it's just personal preference. Neither one is better than the other.