Non-ranked to ranked school transfer Forum

[smcdonald]

Im considering transferring after my 1L year to where I may end up practicing. Different state to where i am now.

I just finished my 1L year at a currently non-ranked school. They went through a bad patch with some problems with ownership and Infilaw. Their reputation is fast improving, but a stigma still lingers overhead. I finished top 10%, got on law review, LRAW fellow, research assistant for a book being published, some externships lined up, 80% scholarship.

I have been accepted into a much higher ranked school in the state i may practice in. But would lose class rank etc. They have offered a 40% scholarship.

Finance is a big concern for me. Would it be wise to stick it out at my current school and keep the awards I have so far, or risk transferring to a different school? I've have people advise both sides. Some attorney friends in the area where i may move to recommended I stay put as it's going well.

This is probably a no brainer for most people, but I have a family with 3 young kids that makes this a more difficult decision. Any thoughts would be helpful and appreciated!

[UCLAHopeful16]

What's the rank of the school that you got in to? I'd say it's not worth it unless you're going to a T14 or at least T20. Having law review, TA positions or whatever, and 80% scholarship will be a lot better than being a transfer student at a TT or TTT.

[clshopeful]

Agreed; we need more facts. What rank roughly is the school you are considering? And how much better are their employment statistics?

[smcdonald]

The school I'm considering is Duquesne. Ranked #111. Their employment rate out of school is around 88%. About a 10% difference from my current school.
I'm leaning towards staying here at the advice of some attorneys from PA, and my gut feeling. If I were considering a top tier school, it would be an easier decision.

[pancakes3]

a bit late now but i would think top 10% from CoC would have netted you better offers than Duqesne. do you have any non-scholly acceptances in PA? my general advice would be: if you really want Western Pa, it's worth transferring (pending your career goals). If you really want Philly, i think the distinction is negligible and it's still an uphill battle even with top 10%, LR, RA, TA.

also, 40% scholly for a transfer seems like good in the short term but red flag long term. incoming 1Ls get scholarships because they boost LSAT/GPA medians. your worth as a transfer would only be reflected in the bar pass rate and it doesn't think they have a lot of faith in their bar pass rate in offering incentives for transfers. it could also be a cash grab, which means they're not getting any transfer apps and collecting 60 cents on the dollar is better than nothing.

[SkinnyFat]

Duquesne outperforms its ranking, by a lot, especially in western PA. Others here may advise against transferring, because the school isn't ranked "high enough," but I would argue the real issue here is whether you want to be in Pittsburgh or not. If yes, then it probably makes sense to transfer. I don't know how much schools are willing to negotiate scholarships when it comes to transfers, but you've clearly demonstrated an ability to perform well... see if Duq is willing to bump that money up. I bet they are.

[smcdonald]

Duquesne outperforms its ranking, by a lot, especially in western PA. Others here may advise against transferring, because the school isn't ranked "high enough," but I would argue the real issue here is whether you want to be in Pittsburgh or not. If yes, then it probably makes sense to transfer. I don't know how much schools are willing to negotiate scholarships when it comes to transfers, but you've clearly demonstrated an ability to perform well... see if Duq is willing to bump that money up. I bet they are.

Pittsburgh isn't necessarily the location I want to end up in. It's more PA in general, to be closer to family etc, as we 3 small kids, which is somewhat important but not absolutely necessary.

I was surprised that they even offered a scholarship after I requested one. I guess I could try to negotiate a little more.

[smcdonald]

a bit late now but i would think top 10% from CoC would have netted you better offers than Duqesne. do you have any non-scholly acceptances in PA? my general advice would be: if you really want Western Pa, it's worth transferring (pending your career goals). If you really want Philly, i think the distinction is negligible and it's still an uphill battle even with top 10%, LR, RA, TA.

also, 40% scholly for a transfer seems like good in the short term but red flag long term. incoming 1Ls get scholarships because they boost LSAT/GPA medians. your worth as a transfer would only be reflected in the bar pass rate and it doesn't think they have a lot of faith in their bar pass rate in offering incentives for transfers. it could also be a cash grab, which means they're not getting any transfer apps and collecting 60 cents on the dollar is better than nothing.

I only applied to Duquesne and Penn State (haven't heard back from Penn State yet). I don't think Philly is on the cards either. It would be Penn State/State College area, or Pittsburgh area. I've spoken to PSU students and attorneys who have graduated from there, and advise me that the work opportunities there, as a student and graduate are pretty low. The fact I have work/internships lined up through the year was another reason they advised me to stay, as employers look at experience a great deal when hiring.

[redbird]

The school I'm considering is Duquesne. Ranked #111. Their employment rate out of school is around 88%. About a 10% difference from my current school.
I'm leaning towards staying here at the advice of some attorneys from PA, and my gut feeling. If I were considering a top tier school, it would be an easier decision.

http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandr ... sity-03138

In what universe did you get that their employment rate is around 88%?? ^^ above link shows it at below 30%...

[A. Nony Mouse]

I was going to say Law School Transparency/the stat for 9 months after graduation rather than the stat for at graduation, but that's not quite 88% either, depending on what you're counting:

0.7% of graduates were employed in school-funded jobs. 0% were in full-time, long-term school-funded jobs (i.e. the job was for at least 35 hours per week, and had a fixed duration of at least one year or the job had no definite duration).
53.1% of graduates were known to be employed in long-term, full-time legal jobs. This figure includes no school-funded jobs.
80.7% graduates were employed in long-term jobs.
82.1% graduates were employed in full-time jobs.

[smcdonald]

I was going to say Law School Transparency/the stat for 9 months after graduation rather than the stat for at graduation, but that's not quite 88% either, depending on what you're counting:

0.7% of graduates were employed in school-funded jobs. 0% were in full-time, long-term school-funded jobs (i.e. the job was for at least 35 hours per week, and had a fixed duration of at least one year or the job had no definite duration).
53.1% of graduates were known to be employed in long-term, full-time legal jobs. This figure includes no school-funded jobs.
80.7% graduates were employed in long-term jobs.
82.1% graduates were employed in full-time jobs.

I think what i was looking at was employment overall, not just the legal field. The info I had didn't have a breakdown like what you've shown. Thanks for that.

[smcdonald]

The school I'm considering is Duquesne. Ranked #111. Their employment rate out of school is around 88%. About a 10% difference from my current school.
I'm leaning towards staying here at the advice of some attorneys from PA, and my gut feeling. If I were considering a top tier school, it would be an easier decision.

http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandr ... sity-03138

In what universe did you get that their employment rate is around 88%?? ^^ above link shows it at below 30%...

http://law-schools.startclass.com/l/130 ... University

[reasonable_man]

Just to clarify - when you say non-ranked you simply mean an ABA approved law school that is a 4th tier? You aren't talking about a non-ABA approved law school.

As long as it's an ABA approved school, at this point, keep your rank, law review and scholarship.

[Nachoo2019]

The school I'm considering is Duquesne. Ranked #111. Their employment rate out of school is around 88%. About a 10% difference from my current school.
I'm leaning towards staying here at the advice of some attorneys from PA, and my gut feeling. If I were considering a top tier school, it would be an easier decision.

http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandr ... sity-03138

In what universe did you get that their employment rate is around 88%?? ^^ above link shows it at below 30%...

http://law-schools.startclass.com/l/130 ... University

This is the real employment for Duquesne. None of this us news/start class bullshit.

http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/duquesne/

They have 53% of graduates actually working as attorneys 10 months after graduation. That 88% figure you have probably includes Starbucks baristas and fast food drive through attendants.


Charleston employs 46.6% of their grads into attorney jobs. There is absolutely no reason to give up law review, scholarships, ect for Duquesne.


http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/charleston/



Sorry I know I'm an 0L and shouldn't post in transfers but the use of shitty employment numbers really gets on my nerves lol

[smcdonald]

The school I'm considering is Duquesne. Ranked #111. Their employment rate out of school is around 88%. About a 10% difference from my current school.
I'm leaning towards staying here at the advice of some attorneys from PA, and my gut feeling. If I were considering a top tier school, it would be an easier decision.

http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandr ... sity-03138

In what universe did you get that their employment rate is around 88%?? ^^ above link shows it at below 30%...

http://law-schools.startclass.com/l/130 ... University

This is the real employment for Duquesne. None of this us news/start class bullshit.

http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/duquesne/

They have 53% of graduates actually working as attorneys 10 months after graduation. That 88% figure you have probably includes Starbucks baristas and fast food drive through attendants.


Charleston employs 46.6% of their grads into attorney jobs. There is absolutely no reason to give up law review, scholarships, ect for Duquesne.


http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/charleston/



Sorry I know I'm an 0L and shouldn't post in transfers but the use of shitty employment numbers really gets on my nerves lol

Great info. I appreciate it.

[UCLAHopeful16]

Definitely do not transfer. Don't. Do. It.

You won't gain anything and will lose all your awesome opportunities at your current school. You should have applied to some higher ranked schools, but oh well.

[smcdonald]

Definitely do not transfer. Don't. Do. It.

You won't gain anything and will lose all your awesome opportunities at your current school. You should have applied to some higher ranked schools, but oh well.

Thanks for the advice. I thought about other schools, but needed something closer to family.
But you're right about losing the opportunities I have. I'll probably stay put.

Thanks!

[Illini817]

I've got a similar situation to the above transfer candidate:

I go to a Tier 4 school, top 10%, invited to law review, good work experience, about a 50% scholarship over my final 2 years. I was just admitted to Notre Dame with no scholarship. I'm still waiting to hear from Northwestern (which I know is a reach).

Any opinions would be appreciated! Thanks.

(And no intent to hijack this thread, I saw a similar situation and jumped in; I'm not sure if there's a better spot for my question!)

[omar1]

Definitely do not transfer. Don't. Do. It.

You won't gain anything and will lose all your awesome opportunities at your current school. You should have applied to some higher ranked schools, but oh well.

Thanks for the advice. I thought about other schools, but needed something closer to family.
But you're right about losing the opportunities I have. I'll probably stay put.

Thanks!

I would go to your current school and tell them you've been offered a scholly to a "higher ranked school" closer to your fam etc. etc. and ask them about more $$$. You have nothing to lose since you're leaning towards staying anyway.

[smcdonald]

Definitely do not transfer. Don't. Do. It.

You won't gain anything and will lose all your awesome opportunities at your current school. You should have applied to some higher ranked schools, but oh well.

Thanks for the advice. I thought about other schools, but needed something closer to family.
But you're right about losing the opportunities I have. I'll probably stay put.

Thanks!

I would go to your current school and tell them you've been offered a scholly to a "higher ranked school" closer to your fam etc. etc. and ask them about more $$$. You have nothing to lose since you're leaning towards staying anyway.

I did that a few days ago and they just got back to me...they increased it again. So good news!

[lawadmin]

I've got a similar situation to the above transfer candidate:

I go to a Tier 4 school, top 10%, invited to law review, good work experience, about a 50% scholarship over my final 2 years. I was just admitted to Notre Dame with no scholarship. I'm still waiting to hear from Northwestern (which I know is a reach).

Any opinions would be appreciated! Thanks.

(And no intent to hijack this thread, I saw a similar situation and jumped in; I'm not sure if there's a better spot for my question!)

VERY different circumstance than the OP. I'd need way more information (e.g., does your TTTT have a decent local reputation), but I'd probably take ND sticker for two years over 50% scholarship at your TTTT. But ask them to raise you to a full scholarship for the last two years. You're going to (supposedly) be one of their poster-child students. Employed in a LT-FT job, passing the bar, etc. They need you there as a "success story" for future students. Be firm with them; you actually do have *some* bargaining power.

I doubt ND would offer you money even once you get up to a full. But at least you'd have two better options than you currently have.

[UCLAHopeful16]

I've got a similar situation to the above transfer candidate:

I go to a Tier 4 school, top 10%, invited to law review, good work experience, about a 50% scholarship over my final 2 years. I was just admitted to Notre Dame with no scholarship. I'm still waiting to hear from Northwestern (which I know is a reach).

Any opinions would be appreciated! Thanks.

(And no intent to hijack this thread, I saw a similar situation and jumped in; I'm not sure if there's a better spot for my question!)

Go to Notre Dame.