Top 7% at Chicago T2; Chicago ties Forum

[Anonymous User]

I'm top 7% at a Kent/Loyola/DePaul. I have 2 years solid WE after doing undergrad at a Chicago/Northwestern (and thus the ties to Chicago). I don't have family here or anything. I want BigLaw, for now.

I am not set about working in Chicago, but I have been networking and making connections in Chicago. I like the city. I'm not sure I love it. I am open to new cities, but I don't want Boston/NYC. I don't have enough experience with DC to judge. So I guess that only leaves Chicago and California...

Should I EA to GULC? If I get in, should I even go?

If I wanted Chicago firms, does doing undergrad at a prestigious Chicago-area school and then doing very well at a Chicago-area T2 look better than looking undecided by randomly leaving the area and trying to come back?

[RodneyRuxin]

Use the search function to find "should I transfer threads." The answers are usually something along the lines of "You'll be judged from the grades you got at your original LS, but there may be more employers at a new school's OCI."

Whether or not you leave will be a judgment call based on your own preferences.

You're going to look like you want to be in Chicago by being there for UG and LS, but on average, firms don't care as much about ties in major markets.

[IAFG]

Do NOT transfer out of Chicago to come back to Chicago.

[Anonymous User]

OP here. Two questions.

IAFG: Could you elaborate? I am very interesting in why you think that.

Rodney: When people say "Firms will hire based on your 1L grades" ... I've seen people say "they won't hire you unless they would've hired you with your 1L grades". Does that mean they also take the 1L school/location into consideration? For example, even if you were top 5% at a Chicago T2, and a California firm would not have hired you because they never hire from Chicago T2s, does going to a T14 make you employable then? Or do they judge you based on your 1L school/location?

[IAFG]

PM me.

[jarofsoup]

ED Chicago. EA GULC. Being bound to Chicago ain't bad.

[keg411]

PM me.

FWIW, there were some people at Chicago TT's and TTT's that transferred to Michigan and got Chicago BigLaw. So I would think it would be okay to try to transfer to Chi/NU/Michigan and come back, but not outside of that.

[RPK34]

This "don't transfer out of Chicago" thing might be a little over stated if you're going to a very good school. I go to school in an insular market. I know someone who went here, transferred to a T6, and had zero problems coming back here for OCI. Got offers at all the top firms despite leaving here to go to another market for school. Now that I think about it, I also talked to someone else from last years class who did the same thing and had no problem coming back, and he didn't even originally have any ties here.

My sense is if you're going to a top school and have a good story for why you still want to be in the original city, firms will understand. They probably get that people want to transfer, but there are a limited number of top schools in each market.

[Anonymous User]

FWIW, there were some people at Chicago TT's and TTT's that transferred to Michigan and got Chicago BigLaw. So I would think it would be okay to try to transfer to Chi/NU/Michigan and come back, but not outside of that.

I know I don't have to make a decision right now, but I like to have a plan. And this sounds like a good plan. FWIW, by looking through old TLS threads, it seems like Michigan and NU take transfer applicants from Chicago T2 who are in the top 10% (is this a correct assumption?) I'm also not opposed to staying at my T2, assuming I continue doing well.

I may ED Chicago and RD Northwestern/Michigan and see what I get. Again, I'm not set on staying in Chicago, but Michigan does have its appeal for someone undecided like me.

[Anonymous User]

This "don't transfer out of Chicago" thing might be a little over stated if you're going to a very good school. I go to school in an insular market. I know someone who went here, transferred to a T6, and had zero problems coming back here for OCI. Got offers at all the top firms despite leaving here to go to another market for school. Now that I think about it, I also talked to someone else from last years class who did the same thing and had no problem coming back, and he didn't even originally have any ties here.

My sense is if you're going to a top school and have a good story for why you still want to be in the original city, firms will understand. They probably get that people want to transfer, but there are a limited number of top schools in each market.

What do you mean by an insular market? Is Chicago an insular market, relatively speaking?

[IAFG]

PM me.

FWIW, there were some people at Chicago TT's and TTT's that transferred to Michigan and got Chicago BigLaw. So I would think it would be okay to try to transfer to Chi/NU/Michigan and come back, but not outside of that.

yeah after i thought about it longer i tacked on michigan, which is plausible enough.

[jbiresq]

Just from my experience you're not getting Chicago ED with those stats and will have to improve to get RD. That said, you should be able to get into Northwestern. There was a person from my Chicago T2 who got Northwestern the year before me who was barely Top 25%. He also ended up with a V5 job in NYC (though he did have really good work experience and you don't want to be there.)

ETA: You're probably going to have to improve to even get BigLaw from a Chicago T2. Most of the OCI firms want Top 10% minimum (really top 5%,) plus law review, plus moot court/mock trial, etc.

[Anonymous User]

Just from my experience you're not getting Chicago ED with those stats and will have to improve to get RD. That said, you should be able to get into Northwestern. There was a person from my Chicago T2 who got Northwestern the year before me who was barely Top 25%. He also ended up with a V5 job in NYC (though he did have really good work experience and you don't want to be there.)

ETA: You're probably going to have to improve to even get BigLaw from a Chicago T2. Most of the OCI firms want Top 10% minimum (really top 5%,) plus law review, plus moot court/mock trial, etc.

Yeah. You're right.

As for Chicago ED, I am just trying to show that I'm interested. Is this even worth stressing over apps early? If not, I won't.

[jbiresq]

Just from my experience you're not getting Chicago ED with those stats and will have to improve to get RD. That said, you should be able to get into Northwestern. There was a person from my Chicago T2 who got Northwestern the year before me who was barely Top 25%. He also ended up with a V5 job in NYC (though he did have really good work experience and you don't want to be there.)

ETA: You're probably going to have to improve to even get BigLaw from a Chicago T2. Most of the OCI firms want Top 10% minimum (really top 5%,) plus law review, plus moot court/mock trial, etc.

Yeah. You're right.

As for Chicago ED, I am just trying to show that I'm interested. Is this even worth stressing over apps early? If not, I won't.

I did really well my first semester (Top 1%) and got in the mindset of transferring early. I think it influenced my performance and I dropped a bit. Though by then I was already in at Georgetown and on my way to an acceptance at UChicago ED. If you maintain or better your performance you'll certainly be in at Northwestern and maybe Michigan.

[jarofsoup]

You could get into U Chicago with those stats simply because you go to a school in Chicago. Last year that helped students. The application does not open up until May I think for ED.

[Anonymous User]

You could get into U Chicago with those stats simply because you go to a school in Chicago. Last year that helped students. The application does not open up until May I think for ED.

I have heard about this. What kind of boost did it give last year students? I can't find it on transfer threads

[jbiresq]

You could get into U Chicago with those stats simply because you go to a school in Chicago. Last year that helped students. The application does not open up until May I think for ED.

I have heard about this. What kind of boost did it give last year students? I can't find it on transfer threads

I really don't think there's a boost as much as the only T2 students they want are from Chicago schools. Though, the few people that did get into from Chicago T2s this year were at the top of their class. AFAIK I was the only one of them to get in ED.

Caveat though. If you look at the first year class it's smaller than last year's so they may be attempting to fill it up with a larger transfer class. That follows the pattern I've seen (the 2011 transfer class was small because the 2010 1st year class was so big.) So they may be recruiting deeper from schools and from within schools.

Just throw an app and see what happens.

[XxSpyKEx]

Use the search function to find "should I transfer threads." The answers are usually something along the lines of "You'll be judged from the grades you got at your original LS, but there may be more employers at a new school's OCI."

Whether or not you leave will be a judgment call based on your own preferences.

You're going to look like you want to be in Chicago by being there for UG and LS, but on average, firms don't care as much about ties in major markets.

That's true in NYC, but NOT in Chicago. Firms DO care about ties in Chicago.

This "don't transfer out of Chicago" thing might be a little over stated if you're going to a very good school. I go to school in an insular market. I know someone who went here, transferred to a T6, and had zero problems coming back here for OCI. Got offers at all the top firms despite leaving here to go to another market for school. Now that I think about it, I also talked to someone else from last years class who did the same thing and had no problem coming back, and he didn't even originally have any ties here.

My sense is if you're going to a top school and have a good story for why you still want to be in the original city, firms will understand. They probably get that people want to transfer, but there are a limited number of top schools in each market.

I think this depends on the specific transfer school you're talking about. One serious consideration is the number of Chicago biglaw firms that do OCI at the transfer school. I remember looking at this the year I transferred, and was really surprised by the lack of Chicago biglaw firms attending GULC & Columbia that year. I think not being able to OCI with Chicago biglaw firms will put you at a disadvantage. I mean you can mass mail, but there are just so many people who do that and so few biglaw jobs in Chicago. To get a reasonable number of Chicago biglaw interviews outside of OCI, you're going to need to network. (Obviously, if you were open to NYC, then t2--> Columbia would be a no brainer.)