WUSTL Class of 2013 Forum

[JCougar]

Proposition:

We convert the CSO into a student lounge with pool tables, pinball machines, and a whiskey bar. The fact that the CSO has completely gone away will actually benefit us. Getting rid of it will make us more likely to find a job, since its mere existance conveys the impression that there is something that it is doing that we don't have to do ourselves. However, it, in fact, does nothing. If the impression that it does something did not occupy a spot in our minds, we would all be more inclined to get our own shit together and get everything done ourselves without any help from the CSO, instead of relying on their empty promises.

Thoughts? Questions?

I might have to take this back...with a qualification.

It really just depends on who you talk to and deal with at the CSO. Each person is an individual. I just happened that initially, I got assigned a very disorganized and non-conscientious adviser to begin with.

My advice (targeted to the 0Ls that have been reading this thread and messaging me) is to talk and network with everybody you can at the school. The professors themselves are an excellent resource for jobs around the city. Some of them have some pretty incredible connections, and most love helping out students. Certain other people in the CSO will also really work hard for you. Don't just rely on one person or expect the CSO to do things alone, though.

As it is, I have a pretty awesome internship this summer...one that I'd never expected I'd be doing. It came as a complete surprise, but my resume was perfect for it. One of the assistant deans simply had a personal connection here and alerted the CSO to collect resumes for those that were interested. It doesn't pay any money, but it's a good one to put on my resume. I am happy.

[ec2xs]

Proposition:

We convert the CSO into a student lounge with pool tables, pinball machines, and a whiskey bar. The fact that the CSO has completely gone away will actually benefit us. Getting rid of it will make us more likely to find a job, since its mere existance conveys the impression that there is something that it is doing that we don't have to do ourselves. However, it, in fact, does nothing. If the impression that it does something did not occupy a spot in our minds, we would all be more inclined to get our own shit together and get everything done ourselves without any help from the CSO, instead of relying on their empty promises.

Thoughts? Questions?

I might have to take this back...with a qualification.

It really just depends on who you talk to and deal with at the CSO. Each person is an individual. I just happened that initially, I got assigned a very disorganized and non-conscientious adviser to begin with.

My advice (targeted to the 0Ls that have been reading this thread and messaging me) is to talk and network with everybody you can at the school. The professors themselves are an excellent resource for jobs around the city. Some of them have some pretty incredible connections, and most love helping out students. Certain other people in the CSO will also really work hard for you. Don't just rely on one person or expect the CSO to do things alone, though.

As it is, I have a pretty awesome internship this summer...one that I'd never expected I'd be doing. It came as a complete surprise, but my resume was perfect for it. One of the assistant deans simply had a personal connection here and alerted the CSO to collect resumes for those that were interested. It doesn't pay any money, but it's a good one to put on my resume. I am happy.

This is a sharp turnaround. I worry that someone is holding some type of loaded weapon to your temple at the moment. Cougs, should I be concerned?

[stratocophic]

Proposition:

We convert the CSO into a student lounge with pool tables, pinball machines, and a whiskey bar. The fact that the CSO has completely gone away will actually benefit us. Getting rid of it will make us more likely to find a job, since its mere existance conveys the impression that there is something that it is doing that we don't have to do ourselves. However, it, in fact, does nothing. If the impression that it does something did not occupy a spot in our minds, we would all be more inclined to get our own shit together and get everything done ourselves without any help from the CSO, instead of relying on their empty promises.

Thoughts? Questions?

I might have to take this back...with a qualification.

It really just depends on who you talk to and deal with at the CSO. Each person is an individual. I just happened that initially, I got assigned a very disorganized and non-conscientious adviser to begin with.

My advice (targeted to the 0Ls that have been reading this thread and messaging me) is to talk and network with everybody you can at the school. The professors themselves are an excellent resource for jobs around the city. Some of them have some pretty incredible connections, and most love helping out students. Certain other people in the CSO will also really work hard for you. Don't just rely on one person or expect the CSO to do things alone, though.

As it is, I have a pretty awesome internship this summer...one that I'd never expected I'd be doing. It came as a complete surprise, but my resume was perfect for it. One of the assistant deans simply had a personal connection here and alerted the CSO to collect resumes for those that were interested. It doesn't pay any money, but it's a good one to put on my resume. I am happy.

This is a sharp turnaround. I worry that someone is holding some type of loaded weapon to your temple at the moment. Cougs, should I be concerned?

"he realized he had won the victory over himself. He loved Big Brother."

[PSUFB1114]

Good to know JC, thanks. What about the rest of c/o 2013? Did anyone get paid internships? What is everyone doing this summer?

[fl0w]

Good to know JC, thanks. What about the rest of c/o 2013? Did anyone get paid internships? What is everyone doing this summer?

some people did. but most didn't. It's nice to get something paid but it is more critical to get something LAW RELATED to put on your resume.

Some got firm stuff.
A lot of people are doing public interest.
Some are doing judicial externships for State, District or Circuit level courts.

[JCougar]

Proposition:

We convert the CSO into a student lounge with pool tables, pinball machines, and a whiskey bar. The fact that the CSO has completely gone away will actually benefit us. Getting rid of it will make us more likely to find a job, since its mere existance conveys the impression that there is something that it is doing that we don't have to do ourselves. However, it, in fact, does nothing. If the impression that it does something did not occupy a spot in our minds, we would all be more inclined to get our own shit together and get everything done ourselves without any help from the CSO, instead of relying on their empty promises.

Thoughts? Questions?

I might have to take this back...with a qualification.

It really just depends on who you talk to and deal with at the CSO. Each person is an individual. I just happened that initially, I got assigned a very disorganized and non-conscientious adviser to begin with.

My advice (targeted to the 0Ls that have been reading this thread and messaging me) is to talk and network with everybody you can at the school. The professors themselves are an excellent resource for jobs around the city. Some of them have some pretty incredible connections, and most love helping out students. Certain other people in the CSO will also really work hard for you. Don't just rely on one person or expect the CSO to do things alone, though.

As it is, I have a pretty awesome internship this summer...one that I'd never expected I'd be doing. It came as a complete surprise, but my resume was perfect for it. One of the assistant deans simply had a personal connection here and alerted the CSO to collect resumes for those that were interested. It doesn't pay any money, but it's a good one to put on my resume. I am happy.

This is a sharp turnaround. I worry that someone is holding some type of loaded weapon to your temple at the moment. Cougs, should I be concerned?

Haha...Dean Spivey is holding my mother hostage until I blow smoke up the 0L's asses.

But for real, it was a sharp turnaround. I got kind of screwed out of where I really wanted to work due in large part to my advisor's incompetence, but this thing kind of came out of nowhere at the last minute, and it's probably even better than where I initially wanted to work. I'm probably a perfect fit for where I'm working right now, and vice versa.

[Oban]

Good to know JC, thanks. What about the rest of c/o 2013? Did anyone get paid internships? What is everyone doing this summer?

I only know of a handful of people who got big lawl SA jobs, but there are quite a few people working in small firms(personal injury and other plaintiff work). Most people seem to be working in unpaid internships for which the school gives you 3K for summer expenses, or as research assistants, for which you get paid.

[ms9]

Haha...Dean Spivey is holding my mother hostage until I blow smoke up the 0L's asses.

I've released her, per the terms of our agreement.

[fl0w]

Haha...Dean Spivey is holding my mother hostage until I blow smoke up the 0L's asses.

I've released her, per the terms of our agreement.

epic.

On another note, I still don't understand why no stipend exists for positions with the court. Working a full time job + a part time job so i can live this summer is... how you say... painful. But everyone says I'm being paid in experience and prestige. Those things, however, are less filling than ramen.

[stratocophic]

I've released her, per the terms of our agreement.

Beautifully executed.

[romothesavior]

Good to know JC, thanks. What about the rest of c/o 2013? Did anyone get paid internships? What is everyone doing this summer?

some people did. but most didn't. It's nice to get something paid but it is more critical to get something LAW RELATED to put on your resume.

This. Getting legal work on the resume is very crucial. Obviously paid work is nice (especially if there are post-grad employment opportunities), but that should not be your focus.

You will almost certainly not get a paid firm job your 1L year. It doesn't matter if you're at Columbia, WUSTL, or Cooley. You're almost certainly not getting paid, so don't plan on it. Yes, there are exceptions. Some people are just really baller and great at networking. Some will get a paid 1L gig through a diversity program. Perhaps some people have well-connected parents. Maybe someone (and this is very rare) will get something through OCI, or can snag an in-house position. I do know some people getting paid for in-house work, although there is no opportunity for post-graduate employment. But yeah, bottom line is that you should be focused on getting a legal job, not a paid one.

That said, we do have a really good stipend program. I'm doing that and working a second job on the side and I'm doing just fine financially. If you take your 3k in stipend money and do a little work on the side (I'm waiting tables), you'll be more than fine. Don't worry about getting paid.

[romothesavior]

I've released her, per the terms of our agreement.

Beautifully executed.

That was absolutely brilliant. Good stuff.

On another note, I still don't understand why no stipend exists for positions with the court. Working a full time job + a part time job so i can live this summer is... how you say... painful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DksSPZTZES0

I got the stipend and I'm also working on the side. I'm looking at 60+ hours this week between my two jobs (in addition to 5 summer baseball games and 3 hours of CASA training). And my other job is basically waiting on all the scumbags that the Loop has to offer at 11:00 at night. So yeah, cry me a river.

That said, I am inclined to agree with you. It would nice if there were court stipends. My guess is that the money doesn't exist to pay for it, and they have to draw the line somewhere. They already do a lot of fundraising for the stipend and it is probably hard to cover just the PI/government people, so I'm guessing it would be even more difficult to extend that to the judicial folks.

[Oban]

I've released her, per the terms of our agreement.

Beautifully executed.

That was absolutely brilliant. Good stuff.

On another note, I still don't understand why no stipend exists for positions with the court. Working a full time job + a part time job so i can live this summer is... how you say... painful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DksSPZTZES0

I got the stipend and I'm also working on the side. I'm looking at 60+ hours this week between my two jobs (in addition to 5 summer baseball games and 3 hours of CASA training). And my other job is basically waiting on all the scumbags that the Loop has to offer at 11:00 at night. So yeah, cry me a river.

That said, I am inclined to agree with you. It would nice if there were court stipends. My guess is that the money doesn't exist to pay for it, and they have to draw the line somewhere. They already do a lot of fundraising for the stipend and it is probably hard to cover just the PI/government people, so I'm guessing it would be even more difficult to extend that to the judicial folks.

I doubt this. Woostl is very well endowed, and the law school basically bribes people to come here. Plus we have lots of wealthy alumni sponsoring tons of stuff. The school is just very cheap on somethings such as paying some of the admin staff, RA wages(half of schools like UCLA) and grants. Honestly if the schools spent more money on grants for students it would a be nice way of gaming the rankings.

When we pay 45k for tution, mang, i think griping about lack of grants for court positions is credited.

[stratocophic]

I've released her, per the terms of our agreement.

Beautifully executed.

That was absolutely brilliant. Good stuff.

On another note, I still don't understand why no stipend exists for positions with the court. Working a full time job + a part time job so i can live this summer is... how you say... painful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DksSPZTZES0

I got the stipend and I'm also working on the side. I'm looking at 60+ hours this week between my two jobs (in addition to 5 summer baseball games and 3 hours of CASA training). And my other job is basically waiting on all the scumbags that the Loop has to offer at 11:00 at night. So yeah, cry me a river.

That said, I am inclined to agree with you. It would nice if there were court stipends. My guess is that the money doesn't exist to pay for it, and they have to draw the line somewhere. They already do a lot of fundraising for the stipend and it is probably hard to cover just the PI/government people, so I'm guessing it would be even more difficult to extend that to the judicial folks.

I doubt this. Woostl is very well endowed, and the law school basically bribes people to come here. Plus we have lots of wealthy alumni sponsoring tons of stuff. The school is just very cheap on somethings such as paying some of the admin staff, RA wages(half of schools like UCLA) and grants. Honestly if the schools spent more money on grants for students it would a be nice way of gaming the rankings.

When we pay 45k for tution, mang, i think griping about lack of grants for court positions is credited.

Srsly - pretty sure SLU pays better for RAs. WTF is that all about.

[fl0w]

I got the stipend and I'm also working on the side. I'm looking at 60+ hours this week between my two jobs (in addition to 5 summer baseball games and 3 hours of CASA training). And my other job is basically waiting on all the scumbags that the Loop has to offer at 11:00 at night. So yeah, cry me a river.

Yeah man I'm banging my head on 40hrs / wk at court and then another 20+hrs / wk doing contracting work. They are even shipping me out to dallas to do full time work for a week after my court externship is over. Then full time in StL for another week right before school starts, working around interviews.
Full time = 50-60hrs / wk.

I'm complaining, but at $35/hr I guess I should just put my head down and do it.
Erryday I'm wustlin'

[romothesavior]

I'm complaining, but at $35/hr I guess I should just put my head down and do it.

For that kinda money, you should just shut your damn mouth. Sounds like a pretty baller gig (and I know your internship is as well).

[romothesavior]

I doubt this. Woostl is very well endowed, and the law school basically bribes people to come here. Plus we have lots of wealthy alumni sponsoring tons of stuff. The school is just very cheap on somethings such as paying some of the admin staff, RA wages(half of schools like UCLA) and grants. Honestly if the schools spent more money on grants for students it would a be nice way of gaming the rankings.

More money on grants to game the rankings? We're already known as gaming the rankings for this, and we're probably one of the most generous schools in the country with fin aid.

I'm also pretty sure the stipend is its own separate fund (for example, the auction in the spring goes towards the stipends). I could be totally wrong, but I don't think it comes from the general fund.

[fl0w]

I'm complaining, but at $35/hr I guess I should just put my head down and do it.

For that kinda money, you should just shut your damn mouth. Sounds like a pretty baller gig (and I know your internship is as well).

Yeah, it's a lot of work but also very good pay for what I'm actually doing.
I can't imagine what it might be like to make a firm salary. I don't even know what I'd do with all that scrilla.

[stratocophic]

I'm complaining, but at $35/hr I guess I should just put my head down and do it.

For that kinda money, you should just shut your damn mouth. Sounds like a pretty baller gig (and I know your internship is as well).

Yeah, it's a lot of work but also very good pay for what I'm actually doing.
I can't imagine what it might be like to make a firm salary. I don't even know what I'd do with all that scrilla.

Well, we'll all know this time next summer, amirite??? NYTO190

God I wish it was October. I don't even care all that much about the outcome, I'll live. Just quit with the waiting already.

[Oban]

I doubt this. Woostl is very well endowed, and the law school basically bribes people to come here. Plus we have lots of wealthy alumni sponsoring tons of stuff. The school is just very cheap on somethings such as paying some of the admin staff, RA wages(half of schools like UCLA) and grants. Honestly if the schools spent more money on grants for students it would a be nice way of gaming the rankings.

More money on grants to game the rankings? We're already known as gaming the rankings for this, and we're probably one of the most generous schools in the country with fin aid.

I'm also pretty sure the stipend is its own separate fund (for example, the auction in the spring goes towards the stipends). I could be totally wrong, but I don't think it comes from the general fund.

I don't care what fund it comes from. Schools have been playing the "Oh financial aid/campus upgrades/etc all come from special funds."

Money is money yo. At the end of the day, yes Woostl is generous with the aid monies, and I appreciate the scholarship, but man alive are they cheap and stingy in other areas.

[romothesavior]

Many schools do not even have stipend programs, or it is very minimal. Compared to my other friends and colleagues on TLS at other peer schools, I think ours is pretty good. And do any schools give stipends for judicial internships? I'm not aware of any that do, but I certainly don't know a lot about stipend programs.

[fl0w]

Many schools do not even have stipend programs, or it is very minimal. Compared to my other friends and colleagues on TLS at other peer schools, I think ours is pretty good. And do any schools give stipends for judicial internships? I'm not aware of any that do, but I certainly don't know a lot about stipend programs.

i'm not sure our stipend program is any better or worse than other schools. i think it's just typical. might actually be a little less money.

i don't think any schools give one for judicial positions. i have a small $1500 one for mine because i applied to a program through the ABA and won an award.

[Oban]

Sounds like a good reason for wustl to start providing them, it would make the school more attractive and increase money spent per student.

Sounds like a win win situation.

[JCougar]

I'm complaining, but at $35/hr I guess I should just put my head down and do it.

For that kinda money, you should just shut your damn mouth. Sounds like a pretty baller gig (and I know your internship is as well).

Yeah, it's a lot of work but also very good pay for what I'm actually doing.
I can't imagine what it might be like to make a firm salary. I don't even know what I'd do with all that scrilla.

Pay off your loans?

If I miraculously get a biglaw job, I'm going to try and put about half my salary toward loan repayment for the first 2 years or so. Putting a big dent in this early is a good way to avoid a ton of compounding interest.

On a depressing note, I calculated what my repayment schedule would be like if I get a federal government job out of this internship and do the 10-year loan forgiveness plan (the one where you pay 15% of your income to your loans for 10 years, and then they are forgiven after that). But if I start at a federal government job at the GS-11 level (it's what the EEOC attorneys start out at, which in DC, equates to $62K/year), 15% of my income won't even cover the interest accruing. So after 9 years, I'll owe more on my loans than I will when I graduate, unless I get a couple promotions along the way. Basically, it means that if I go the government route, I'd have to lock myself in to working 10 years there at a minimum...otherwise I'm completely screwed.

Just another sign of how nuts the law school system is these days. Less than 25% of graduates are going to be able to get jobs that give them a legitimate chance of paying off the price of tuition. Indentured servitude is back in style.

[Oban]

How good is the LRAP?

At most top schools, LRAP + IBR = not doomsday