Rutgers-Camden Class of 2013 Forum

[Joe Biden]

Not looking at the posts above. If my own grades/job search in law school fail me... thank god for Nepotism .

ETA: That's the guy who went to Seton Hall!!! Hahahahahahaha .
Newsflash, everyone knows SHU sucks.

Seton Hall is a good school, but there is a LOT of competition for jobs in the north Jersey/NYC market. That is a brutal market with a very high cost of living.

Be aware, the job market is very tough right now, however, the cost of attending RU-Camden is not that bad, students from here do get jobs and things will be OK. Because of the economy, it makes even more sense to attend a school with a relatively low tuition cost, like RU-Camden.

There is more to law school than just getting a job. First of all, I learned more in my first year of law school than the rest of my educational career combined. You will have a chance to learn a lot about business, philosophy, life, etc. You will make some of the best friends of your life. You will have a chance to learn from a world class faculty. Things might be tough your first couple years out of law school. You may struggle only making 60k/year. That is a reality people have to deal with. The thing is, the entire economy is hurting right now. There are a lot of people who would be grateful just to have a job. I can tell you this much for sure, having a legal degree is not going to hurt you during the job hunt.

[Joe Biden]

the SHU c/o 2013 thread is all about how SHU is the top-ranked school in the state now.

Seton Hall is a fine school, however, it is in another market. The difference between five places on the USNews rankings is irrelevant. No employer is going to say, "OK, USNews ranked you guys five places higher, therefore, I am hiring you," Give me a break. Outside of T14 rankings really start to become irrelevant. Look at employment statistics on LSAC.org. RU-Camden places as well, if not better, than anyone in Philly or Jersey, with the exception of Penn. I know people who got into Penn and opted for RU-Camden, because of the cost. Look through the attorney profiles of any V100 firm and RU-Camden is represented at every one of them.

[Joe Biden]

Hi, here is a Picasa link to my pictures. I didn't want to img them into this post cuz there are a few. I stopped taking pictures towards the end of Dean's Day because I just got tired (we flew from CA) so no pictures of the build-a-bear or the lunch.

--LinkRemoved--

If i get the descriptions wrong, please feel free to comment on those pictures.

Questions about living at the Victor: I'm a female, so do you think the security will escort me back to the apts?

Security will always escort you from the Victor to the law school, anytime of the day or night. However, once you move in, you will realize that is unnecessary for a couple of reasons. It is really not that dangerous. The Waterfront area is not that bad. Not to mention, there are always groups of people walking back and forth between the law school and the Victor.

If I were a female, and alone at night, I would probably ask for an escort. That is not a problem. Security will always respond within a few minutes and give you an escort. With that being said, if I were a female I would not walk around at night, anywhere.

Remember guys, the federal courthouse is right next to the campus, so is the main post office. There are lawyers and judges constantly walking around the Waterfront area, by themselves, The Waterfront area is safe! Again, anytime you want an escort the campus police or security will escort you. They respond for requests within a few minutes. Just like any city, if you are a female and alone at night, you should probably ask for an escort.

Someone said there are a lot of cops around. That is for a couple of reasons. First of all, Rutgers has a ton of cops on their police force. They just drive around the same six blocks all day and night patrolling. Literally, every corner around the school has Rutgers security people standing on the corner. You will always be safe. The only way something bad will happen is if you do something really stupid. People will ask you for change, that is about the worst that will happen.

[Joe Biden]

Hi, here is a Picasa link to my pictures. I didn't want to img them into this post cuz there are a few. I stopped taking pictures towards the end of Dean's Day because I just got tired (we flew from CA) so no pictures of the build-a-bear or the lunch.

--LinkRemoved--

If i get the descriptions wrong, please feel free to comment on those pictures.

Questions about living at the Victor: I'm a female, so do you think the security will escort me back to the apts?

I saw a picture of the federal courthouse. That is really cool. We got to do oral arguments in Legal Writing in a federal courtroom, which is a really cool experience. Plus, we have had other classes that meet in the federal courthouse, and we are shown various procedural motions and stuff, live. It is really a neat experience.

Did any of you see the moot courtroom? It is one of the coolest moot courtrooms I have seen. It is very realistic.

The bridge is pretty cool. It connects the old law school, which is still used, and the new law school. I am sure if you were able to see, but there are multiple levels to the library, so the library is huge. The law school building itself is pretty awesome. The new law school building is larger than the old one. So basically, they took a law school that was already adequate and doubled the size of it. It was something like a $40 million project. It is really incredible.

[Joe Biden]

Hey Joe, thanks for answering all these questions.

So you don't live in the Victor? Where did you live your 1L year?

During my 1L year I lived in the dorms. After that I moved to a suburb off of the Patco line. I am probably going to live in the Victor for my 3L year. After experiencing living on campus, and then a suburb, I would definitely say living in the dorms or the Victor is the best. It is the most convenient, makes it easy to get to class and that is where a majority of students live, so it is nice for social reasons. It is also very convenient for going to Philly. The Patco stop is right next to teh dorms, Victor and law school. The first stop is Old City in Philly. It literally takes less than five minutes to get from the Victor or dorms to downtown Philly.

[Joe Biden]

Hi, here is a Picasa link to my pictures. I didn't want to img them into this post cuz there are a few. I stopped taking pictures towards the end of Dean's Day because I just got tired (we flew from CA) so no pictures of the build-a-bear or the lunch.

--LinkRemoved--

If i get the descriptions wrong, please feel free to comment on those pictures.

Questions about living at the Victor: I'm a female, so do you think the security will escort me back to the apts?

i like the "1/2 a mile away picture"

I would like to throw something in here. Camden has some pretty crappy parts, but there is a very heavy police presence. If you are not out doing things you shouldn't, you are not going to have a problem. Use common sense. I don't know any law students who are not mature enough to already know these things, but If a bum asks you for a ride, say no.

The area you took pictures of is actually an area where there are warehouses. The docs used to be very active in Camden, but not anymore. That area is actually being redeveloped and turned into a nursing school for RU-Camden.

Here is the deal with Camden. Outside of the Waterfront there is a lot of poverty in Camden. There are a lot of poor people in the community. That does not make them bad people. With the Waterfront redevelopment, the new hospital (Cooper Memorial), etc. there are more jobs, so Camden has slowly started to turn around. Just because people are poor, that does not make them dangerous. Sure, there are some dangerous parts of Camden, but law students really have no business going to those areas.

I have not heard of a single law student getting robbed, attacked, beaten up, raped, etc. since I came to law school. I have not heard one story of that happening before I came here. I am not saying it has never happened, I am not saying that it couldn't happen, but if you use common sense you will be fine. Camden is not even depressing, because you will be living on the Waterfront. The view is absolutely gorgeous. The campus is beautiful, the Waterfront is beautiful, there is a marina, the Camden Riversharks baseball stadium is extremely nice.

There is an amphitheater in Camden. It seats like 20,000 people. People from all over come to Camden to see various bands play. Since I have been here they have had every kind of act there from Jimmy Buffett to Lil Wayne to Phish. No one gets hassled when they come to shows. The amphitheater is there because it is safe. The marina is a really cool area to walk around, take a run to or go for a picnic lunch. It sounds kind of cheesy, but I have gone on picnic lunches there and the view is beautiful. The aquarium is absolutely awesome, and everyone should check that out while they are in law school. Another really cool attraction is the Battleship New Jersey. It is really fun to check out.

There are tons of family things to do in Camden. The amphitheater, the aquarium, the Riversharks, the marina, etc. These attractions get tourists in Camden from Philly, Cherry Hill, Haddonfield, etc. Cooper Memorial Hospital is a state of the art, regional hospital. Not to mention the undergrad has 6,000 students, there is a decent business school there (which is another option for people MBA/JD, as well as the other dual programs MBA/MPA, etc.). These attractions would not survive unless the Waterfront area was safe. Families come to Camden to visit these attractions all of the time and never have a problem. There are a lot of lawyers offices, etc. in Camden because of the federal and county courthouse. Not to mention, Kraft's headquarters is in Camden. Camden really is not that bad. Stay out of North Camden, stay out of the bad neighborhoods and you will be fine. The Waterfront is an area all by itself. It is no different than living in Collingswood, etc. There are some bad parts in Camden, but those areas are isolated and law students have no business going to them.

[Joe Biden]

i like the "1/2 a mile away picture"

I gotta say, the city was pretty crappy opposite waterfront. I actually wanted to take more pictures, but i got a LOT of stares by people hanging out on the street just from driving by. Lots of cops, lots of thug looking people - but hey, they could be nice people, i don't know...

Lots of cops, that is a good thing. The city just received a huge federal grant and hired like another 100 cops. There is a lot of poverty in Camden, but remember, just because people are poor, they are not necessarily bad or dangerous. There are parts of Camden I would never go to, but the Waterfront area is very safe.

Remember, if you ever do get scared to walk at night, which may happen when first get to the area, you can ALWAYS get a police or security escort. They will walk you to the dorms, the Victor Apartments, etc. anytime you want, 24/7. They will respond to an escort request with minutes.

[Joe Biden]

If I choose to live in the Victor, will I most likely have to move in early August?


How big are most of the 1L classes?


Does the school have a list of people looking for roommates? (no offense but I don't really want to find a roommate on TLS)


Also, I noticed that the main floor of the library was impressive, but the other floors were not. Is there enough room to study on the nice floor of the library?


Lastly, is there a student association that organizes weekly bar parties?

You can work with the Victor on a move in date. If you want to move in the 10th of August, I am sure they will work with you. I was going to move there, but my roommates wanted to live in the suburbs instead. That was a mistake, I wish I had lived in the Victor, and I will be moving there when my lease is up, but they will work with you on move in dates.

The 1L classes vary in size depending on the class. Torts or Contracts may have 60 people in it. However, LAWR classes have less than 20 students. 2 and 3L classes are usually pretty small, some with as few as 15 students (there are also some limited enrollment courses that max out at like 12-15 students).

I have never had a problem finding a place to study in the library. There are all kinds of little nooks and crannies you can find, where you are all by yourself. I personally like to find areas that are isolated in the library, by myself, so I do not get distracted. I have never had a problem finding a place.

I don't know if there are weekly bar parties, but there are events at least once a month. The various student organizations have parties at Hanks, The Victor Pub or in Philly. Because so many students live in the Victor or the dorms, you will always find other law students at Hanks or the Victor Pub if you want to grab a bite to eat or a drink. There are always people around to socialize with. That is one cool thing about having all of your classmates living in such a close vicinity. Within a few weeks of classes starting there will be at least 3-4 social events, and you will get to know your entire class very well. Socializing is not a problem.

[Joe Biden]

I gotta say, the city was pretty crappy opposite waterfront. I actually wanted to take more pictures, but i got a LOT of stares by people hanging out on the street just from driving by. Lots of cops, lots of thug looking people - but hey, they could be nice people, i don't know...

Well, yeah it's Camden. After the waterfront/law school area... it is what it is.

Not trying to be redundant...but you guys REALLY need to come to the south. We have entire cities that look like that "1/2 mile away" picture. Go to Liberty in Miami or Bankhead in Atlanta...its like a bomb hit. I was expecting a war-zone, the way people described Camden; now, I'm not worried at all.

Now watch me get mugged as soon as I step on campus...

It's not a war zone, but it's a poor city with a ton of gang activity and a high murders-per-capita rate (mostly related to the gang activity).

There have been articles in the Philadelphia Inquirer and South Jersey Courier Post about this. Most of the violence in Camden is drug related. So long as you stay away from the "bad" areas, where there is a lot of drug activity, you will never have a problem. There is not a lot of random violence in Camden.

Here is how a well known, South Jersey defense attorney explained it to me. There are a lot of people from the suburbs who drive to Camden to purchase their drugs (kind of like the movie Traffic). Because of that, the judges in Camden really crack the whip on people from outside of Camden who get caught buying drugs in Camden. Because people come to Camden to buy their drugs, there is a lot of money in the drug trade there. With money and drugs comes violence. So, there are drug related murders and violence. So long as you aren't out trying to buy drugs in the bad areas, you are never going to see this side of Camden. Most of the people in Camden are good people, they are just poor. The worst thing most law students ever have to put up with is a bum asking them for change. This happens in every city.

Just be careful. If you feel uncomfortable walking to the Victor Apartments at night, ask for a police or security escort. I personally don't know anyone who does this, but stay within your comfort zone. Camden really is not that bad. It is fun to rag on it, but the Riverfront is like a different world from the rest of Camden.

[Joe Biden]

Thank you Biden for clearing up the whole clerkship thing. It makes me all more excited to go to Rutgers. Also, sounds like quite a few good places to hang out in Philly! Great to know!

Philly is awesome and Old City is the first Patco stop away. Philadelphia is probably the most historic city in the United States, so there are tons of things to see. Philadelphia has world class museums, restaurants, awesome bars, you name it. Plus, RU-Camden offers discount tickets (super cheap) to Flyers games, Phillies games, the Aquarium and sometimes they even give away free tickets to Riversharks games (Rutgers owns the stadium). Plus, they offer discount tickets to concerts. It was really cool, because last summer I went to a couple of concerts where the face on the tickets was $120 and got them for $20. The tickets were awesome, plus they had VIP access. They go out of their way to hook up a lot of things like this.

The law school "ball" is really cool too. It is called the Barrister Ball. This year it was held at the Constitution Center in Philly. That was really awesome. Last year it was held in a ballroom at the Hyatt. The tickets are $60, everyone gets dressed up (semi-formal, so the men wear suits, the women wear evening gowns). For $60 there is an awesome catered dinner and an open bar all night. They go first class all the way, top shelf alcohol, imported beer, wine, you name it. The food was incredible too.

[Joe Biden]

So I know Joe Biden said that we do not need to worry about registering for classes but on the school's intranet it says that registering for Fall classes ends April 16th. I am assuming this is for students who are already attending the school, but maybe I am wrong? Can someone clear this up for me? Thanks.

Your 1L classes are assigned. You will be assigned to a section. You do not get to pick your 1L classes. If you have any questions about your section, etc. contact the registrar or admissions.




EDIT: Wow, I just saw how many posts I have.

If anyone has any questions, please feel free to PM me or ask in here. I had a lot of questions when I first came to law school, so I am more than happy to answer any questions anyone may have.

One other thing, if anyone is looking for a roommate let me know. I might need one more roommate for the fall. I am currently planning on living with another 3L, but we might opt for a larger place and need one more person.

[keg411]

Thanks for all of your help, Joe Biden!

[JuTMSY4]

Thanks for the info Joe Biden

Edited

[GoodToBeTheKing]

Thank you Biden for clearing up the whole clerkship thing. It makes me all more excited to go to Rutgers. Also, sounds like quite a few good places to hang out in Philly! Great to know!

Philly is awesome and Old City is the first Patco stop away. Philadelphia is probably the most historic city in the United States, so there are tons of things to see. Philadelphia has world class museums, restaurants, awesome bars, you name it. Plus, RU-Camden offers discount tickets (super cheap) to Flyers games, Phillies games, the Aquarium and sometimes they even give away free tickets to Riversharks games (Rutgers owns the stadium). Plus, they offer discount tickets to concerts. It was really cool, because last summer I went to a couple of concerts where the face on the tickets was $120 and got them for $20. The tickets were awesome, plus they had VIP access. They go out of their way to hook up a lot of things like this.

The law school "ball" is really cool too. It is called the Barrister Ball. This year it was held at the Constitution Center in Philly. That was really awesome. Last year it was held in a ballroom at the Hyatt. The tickets are $60, everyone gets dressed up (semi-formal, so the men wear suits, the women wear evening gowns). For $60 there is an awesome catered dinner and an open bar all night. They go first class all the way, top shelf alcohol, imported beer, wine, you name it. The food was incredible too.

YEAH! SOUNDS LIKE A BLAST!

[keg411]

Edited.

[JuTMSY4]

Edited

[SoCalStudent]

Did you guys catch Seton Hall's wikipedia page?

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit ... =306661799

Here's the page without revisions by a certian, cough, someone:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seton_Hall ... ool_of_Law

[keg411]

Edited

[JuTMSY4]

Edited

[lawschoolblows]

ID slopwork is now being outsourced to India. By the time you guys graduate this cut n' paste crap will all be churned in Bangalore:

--LinkRemoved--

The trend now is to send even more substantive work offshore. The ABA fully endorses this trend since their members are all Biglaw partners who realize huge profits by shipping the garbage out to 3rd worlders who do a great job for 1/100th the cost of an American associate.

I've had half a dozen friends lose ID jobs in the past year or two. There's little auto accident work left since meeting the serious injury threshold is now so difficult to prove as a plaintiff. Sadly, that crap (and doc review temp work at biglaw) were for years the only jobs really available to 2nd tier grads. Now that these jobs are going offshore, there's even more people fighintg over the $12 an hour craigslist gigs and traffic court clerkships, etc.

[keg411]

ETA: I'm taking everything off of here that talks about my family information. It's inappropriate to post about. I just want to get rid of some of the misconceptions because being a Trial Lawyer is different from being a document lawyer.

[dp73816]

???

This thread has lost its mind today...first Biden wrote a novel (which is much appreciated btw!), and then some guy with an obvious agenda came in, spewing gloom & doom to the tune of NWA's "Straight Outta Compton"; I think the chip on the guys shoulder can be seen from space. And then, there are massive edits all over the place - why?

I miss the days when everyone was actually excited to go to Rutgers (ahemm...three days ago)...damn you US News...

[inSouthAmerica]

i'm excited to go to rutgers!

[Joe Biden]

ID slopwork is now being outsourced to India. By the time you guys graduate this cut n' paste crap will all be churned in Bangalore:

--LinkRemoved--

The trend now is to send even more substantive work offshore. The ABA fully endorses this trend since their members are all Biglaw partners who realize huge profits by shipping the garbage out to 3rd worlders who do a great job for 1/100th the cost of an American associate.

I've had half a dozen friends lose ID jobs in the past year or two. There's little auto accident work left since meeting the serious injury threshold is now so difficult to prove as a plaintiff. Sadly, that crap (and doc review temp work at biglaw) were for years the only jobs really available to 2nd tier grads. Now that these jobs are going offshore, there's even more people fighintg over the $12 an hour craigslist gigs and traffic court clerkships, etc.

See, that is complete bullshit. I am the first person to warn people that the legal market is not good, but $12/hr jobs is nonsense. Everyone here will have a college degree, along with a law degree. Even if you do not choose to practice law, you are going to make far more than that. Hell, you can make triple that as a bartender at a decent spot. The really good BigLaw jobs are scarce now, but no one is going to be working for $12/hr. I can think of a dozen jobs off the top of my head people can get if they do not like the law and want to do something else. You are overdoing it bud.

[Joe Biden]

???

This thread has lost its mind today...first Biden wrote a novel (which is much appreciated btw!), and then some guy with an obvious agenda came in, spewing gloom & doom to the tune of NWA's "Straight Outta Compton"; I think the chip on the guys shoulder can be seen from space. And then, there are massive edits all over the place - why?

I miss the days when everyone was actually excited to go to Rutgers (ahemm...three days ago)...damn you US News...

The legal market is in the toilet, there is no doubt about it. However, people are still getting jobs. The world has not come to an end. The 150k/year starting jobs are still there, but they are very hard to get. If your goal was to make 150k/year straight out of law school it is still possible, but you better be in the top 5-10% of the class at RU-Camden. For everyone else, there are still jobs. Firms are still hiring. It isn't that there are no jobs, it is that people are not making what they had hoped for. You may have to tough it out in a 50-60k/year job for a few years, but it is not the end of the world. Just be grateful you have the chance to make that, because the entire economy tanked and people without advanced degrees are unemployed.