Working remotely as first year Forum

[Anonymous User]

I just joined my firm a few weeks ago and firm leadership has been telling everyone they want people to come in as much as possible, and that it’s especially beneficial for juniors to be in an in-person environment. The junior and senior associates I’ve spoken to have basically said that I should try to come in every day since I just started work and so people know I’m coming in. I’m only on two cases right now, but I don’t even think people would notice if I wasn’t in the office. I don’t work with anyone on my floor, and the cases I’m on rarely have in person meetings. I’ve been coming in 2-3 days a week maximum (when I do have scheduled meetings or Zoom calls), but am wondering if firms are checking how often our badges are being swiped to enter/exit the building. Should I be coming in more often?

[Definitely Not North]

You should go in.

[giggaman1228]

Yea...Obviously go in.

-Chris

[Sackboy]

If you remotely care about your professional development as a lawyer and building your reputation within the firm, the correct answer is to be in Tuesday-Thursday.

[Sad248]

I'd do Tuesday-Thursday at least. You can probably ease off of it after half a year or so. The idea among a lot of antiquated seniors is that juniors need to be around to learn (as you have already understood, this is based on nonsense, nobody will teach you anything unless you put in the effort yourself) and also that juniors do not have a solid grasp of when they need to be in the office and when not (as you will soon understand, you already have this grasp; after all, you can understand you don't need to be around if all you are doing is rote review work/there is no work at all).

It sucks, but you don't want to be the kid that works fully remote and on the off-chance they start firing, you're the one they want to let go, because they barely know who you are anyway.

[Res Ipsa Loquitter]

If you’re good it won’t matter, but on day 1 there’s no chance you’re good

[Anonymous User]

I think the benefit of being in the office is overblown, but I’ve come in every day since I started a month ago. No one is in on Fridays so within a few weeks I’m going to WFH on Fridays, but I’m still going to come in 4x a week after that. With the looming recession I’m taking the approach that coming to the office is a good way to be seen and make a good impression. You don’t want to be known as the first year who rarely comes in if layoffs start happening.

[Anonymous User]

Thanks everyone for input, I guess I was expecting this answer. I’m just a bit frustrated with this expectation because it’s supposed to be beneficial for juniors, but I legitimately don’t think any of the seniors have a clue when I’m in the office or not since we communicate almost solely by email (and during the one Zoom call we’ve had, I was the only person taking the call from the office). But I will start to come in more often.

[Anonymous User]

Thanks everyone for input, I guess I was expecting this answer. I’m just a bit frustrated with this expectation because it’s supposed to be beneficial for juniors, but I legitimately don’t think any of the seniors have a clue when I’m in the office or not since we communicate almost solely by email (and during the one Zoom call we’ve had, I was the only person taking the call from the office). But I will start to come in more often.

I will also add that coming into the office often feels like a relatively low cost way of scoring points with the minority of seniors/partners (including senior partners) who really like the office, and whose opinion of you will go up by a few points just on account of seeing you around so often. It’s less about the majority who don’t really care either way and more about this minority I think.

[Sackboy]

Thanks everyone for input, I guess I was expecting this answer. I’m just a bit frustrated with this expectation because it’s supposed to be beneficial for juniors, but I legitimately don’t think any of the seniors have a clue when I’m in the office or not since we communicate almost solely by email (and during the one Zoom call we’ve had, I was the only person taking the call from the office). But I will start to come in more often.

The benefit from being in the office assumes that you are actually attempting to make meaningful contact with other associates and partners in your group. If you just got sit in your office and wait for stuff to happen, it won't. If you go over to a partner's or associate's office with some redlines and ask to explain things, you'll get a lot of technical benefit and help your personal reputation.

As someone above said, if you're good, it won't matter, but nobody is good at this job right away. It's way easier to flag people down and much easier to have them explain things to you in person than over email/Zoom. This really shouldn't be a controversial take, but I think WFH diehards refuse to give an inch because they're scared they'd have to go back to the office, so they pretend it's a lie. WFH as a new associate is the easiest way to dodge work, disappear into the void, etc. If your goal is to do those things, that's great. If it's to actually pick up some skills at your firm, it's not a good idea. Obviously, if you're a major grinder/gunner, you'll probably make it work well in either case. But, most people don't have grinder/gunner tendencies and greatly benefit from having meaningful face-to-face interactions with more senior attorneys.

[papermateflair]

When you do go into the office, try and make it "count." Going into the office and only talking to other juniors or just billing in your office all day completely defeats the purpose. I think about the people I knew pre-pandemic who literally just sat in their offices and worked and didn't try and connect to any partners, anyone outside of their practice area, etc., and guess what? It didn't work for them. Being in the office with your door shut and not seeing people is likely not enough and not what the partners are looking for (although I'm sure some would rather you be there but never see you than have you work from home and never see people). But there's limited value in going into the office only to not make an effort to see people.

If there's someone you want to meet with, ask them if they'll be in the office on whatever day. Swing by people's offices who aren't on your floor, or who are on your floor but who aren't in your group. I know this is all really obvious stuff for some people, but "just being in the office" isn't actually what the partners are looking for, they're looking for associates who are engaged with their coworkers and trying to build relationships. You probably don't even need to be in 3 or 4 days a week IF you are actually using the time you are in constructively. It's a pain to have to do this in addition to billing, but if you're not that busy right now that's the perfect time to make connections.

I say all of this as if I would actually do any of this if I was in the office (I would not),but I'm also not a first year trying to get to know people. Even if you're an introvert or shy, you can make a list of people and just make a goal of connecting with one or two people every time you're in.

[Anonymous User]

Thanks everyone for input, I guess I was expecting this answer. I’m just a bit frustrated with this expectation because it’s supposed to be beneficial for juniors, but I legitimately don’t think any of the seniors have a clue when I’m in the office or not since we communicate almost solely by email (and during the one Zoom call we’ve had, I was the only person taking the call from the office). But I will start to come in more often.

There are some legitimate reasons for wanting juniors to be physically in the office, but there are also irrational and unreasonable ones, and as the junior it's just part of the quasi-hazing that continues to be part of biglaw training. I can remember being in the office on a Friday when a second year across the hallway came in in a huff, because he'd gotten an unforeseeable call from a senior about printing out something physically at the office for some reason or another. He'd been working from home without discussing it in advance, and got reamed out and had to trek into the office to do the task. Granted this was pre-pandemic, but there's just an element of "be in the office, because to show that level of dedication is to make a good impression, even if we all understand it has limited utility; I had to do it, so now so do you." It's facetime, but it's also just being willing to shoulder the inconvenience to be seen shouldering the inconvenience. This gets under some people's skin more than others, of course.

[Anonymous User]

Would this still apply in my situation, where I'm the only associate hired for a practice group in a satellite office?

[trebekismyhero]

Would this still apply in my situation, where I'm the only associate hired for a practice group in a satellite office?

If there are still partners in your practice group in the satellite office, then definitely yes.

If you don't work with anyone in your office, then probably not as important. But if firm policy is to be in the office, go in at least a couple days a week so that the people in the office don't say something to the partners and senior associates that you do work with. Once you had a good working relationship with the ppl you do work for it won't matter at all