Unhappy Lawyers -- Why are you unhappy? Forum

[WilliamFaulkner]

As I plan for my future career, I want to hear from unhappy lawyers and learn what makes you unhappy with your career, life, etc. What choices did you make in your career that led you to be unhappy with your current role? Why are you still doing what you are doing if it makes you unhappy? Do you have any big regrets?

With love,

WF

[Anonymous User]

This doesn't apply to me, but I know many unhappy lawyers who are unhappy because they blindly decided to take the highest paying and/or most "prestigious" job(s) without seriously thinking about whether they would enjoy or be fulfilled by the work. So don't do that.

[Anonymous User]

As I plan for my future career, I want to hear from unhappy lawyers and learn what makes you unhappy with your career, life, etc. What choices did you make in your career that led you to be unhappy with your current role? Why are you still doing what you are doing if it makes you unhappy? Do you have any big regrets?

With love,

WF

When I started, the office was a different place full of outgoing, friendly people. Most of them have left or were pushed out and those who joined since then are weirdos and gunners, in particular those at the (junior) partner level. I could lateral but I will probably be in the same situation elsewhere. No real regrets, just things out of my control.

[WilliamFaulkner]

This doesn't apply to me, but I know many unhappy lawyers who are unhappy because they blindly decided to take the highest paying and/or most "prestigious" job(s) without seriously thinking about whether they would enjoy or be fulfilled by the work. So don't do that.

This sort of describes me. I am clerking, and though I would not describe myself as totally unhappy, I am not very fulfilled. As I reflect, I realize that I clerked largely because it is (1) prestigious and (2) educational. I did not consider whether I would be happy living where I am living and performing the work of a clerk. So I identify with this.

[Anonymous User]

Cognitive dissonance; plus fundamental lack of introspection & honesty with self regarding goals, aspirations, interests, etc.

“…I would think how words go straight up in a thin line, quick and harmless, and how terribly doing goes along the earth, clinging to it, so that after a while the two lines are too far apart for the same person to straddle from one to the other…”

[WilliamFaulkner]

Cognitive dissonance; plus fundamental lack of introspection & honesty with self regarding goals, aspirations, interests, etc.

“…I would think how words go straight up in a thin line, quick and harmless, and how terribly doing goes along the earth, clinging to it, so that after a while the two lines are too far apart for the same person to straddle from one to the other…”

Care to say more? How is what you are doing now misaligned with your goals, aspirations, interests? Why did you initially enter whatever position you are in now?

[Anonymous User]

As I plan for my future career, I want to hear from unhappy lawyers and learn what makes you unhappy with your career, life, etc. What choices did you make in your career that led you to be unhappy with your current role? Why are you still doing what you are doing if it makes you unhappy? Do you have any big regrets?

With love,

WF

When I started, the office was a different place full of outgoing, friendly people. Most of them have left or were pushed out and those who joined since then are weirdos and gunners, in particular those at the (junior) partner level. I could lateral but I will probably be in the same situation elsewhere. No real regrets, just things out of my control.

Are you in Houston?

[Anonymous User]

I really like research and writing and putting together stories, and I'm in lit, so there are a lot of things I like about my job. I also kind of like getting up and arguing in court. But I'm also a people-pleaser in an adversarial system, so I find dealing with opposing counsel really stressful. The other thing that makes me unhappy is that since I'm representing others, not just my interests, potential screwups feel way more ominous and terrible because they affect others and would be letting other people down (and sometimes it feels like law is just a million different little ways that you can screw something up). It's not clear to me, though, how much of this is law and how much is just my own neuroses and I'd feel like this in any job that felt meaningful enough to be satisfying.

Less psychoanalytically, my hours aren't that bad overall but there are times when it's just way too much work and I miss being able just to clock out when office hours are over, rather than having to work whatever's required to get the work done. But that's not really specific to law.

Edit: meant to add that I'd leave this job if I could for something more policy/big picture focused and less trial/individual-case focused, but I'm geographically limited and all the jobs I can identify as potentially more enjoyable are elsewhere.

[WilliamFaulkner]

I really like research and writing and putting together stories, and I'm in lit, so there are a lot of things I like about my job. I also kind of like getting up and arguing in court. But I'm also a people-pleaser in an adversarial system, so I find dealing with opposing counsel really stressful. The other thing that makes me unhappy is that since I'm representing others, not just my interests, potential screwups feel way more ominous and terrible because they affect others and would be letting other people down (and sometimes it feels like law is just a million different little ways that you can screw something up). It's not clear to me, though, how much of this is law and how much is just my own neuroses and I'd feel like this in any job that felt meaningful enough to be satisfying.

Less psychoanalytically, my hours aren't that bad overall but there are times when it's just way too much work and I miss being able just to clock out when office hours are over, rather than having to work whatever's required to get the work done. But that's not really specific to law.

Edit: meant to add that I'd leave this job if I could for something more policy/big picture focused and less trial/individual-case focused, but I'm geographically limited and all the jobs I can identify as potentially more enjoyable are elsewhere.

Your post mentions a lot that makes you happy about your job. At the end of the day, are you unhappy in spite of these things?

[Anonymous User]

I could not care less that the deal I helped put together closed. I am essentially working only for the paycheck. The hours are a bit much at times but I would be significantly more content if I felt like I was building something I valued.

Maybe I will continue in biglaw and use the excess income to invest in or hire others to create things I appreciate -- or leave biglaw and work in those fields directly.

[Anonymous User]

Lack of novelty--every day feels like doing the Sisyphean task.

[Anonymous User]

I really like research and writing and putting together stories, and I'm in lit, so there are a lot of things I like about my job. I also kind of like getting up and arguing in court. But I'm also a people-pleaser in an adversarial system, so I find dealing with opposing counsel really stressful. The other thing that makes me unhappy is that since I'm representing others, not just my interests, potential screwups feel way more ominous and terrible because they affect others and would be letting other people down (and sometimes it feels like law is just a million different little ways that you can screw something up). It's not clear to me, though, how much of this is law and how much is just my own neuroses and I'd feel like this in any job that felt meaningful enough to be satisfying.

Less psychoanalytically, my hours aren't that bad overall but there are times when it's just way too much work and I miss being able just to clock out when office hours are over, rather than having to work whatever's required to get the work done. But that's not really specific to law.

Edit: meant to add that I'd leave this job if I could for something more policy/big picture focused and less trial/individual-case focused, but I'm geographically limited and all the jobs I can identify as potentially more enjoyable are elsewhere.

Your post mentions a lot that makes you happy about your job. At the end of the day, are you unhappy in spite of these things?

I’m not unhappy enough to uproot my life to find a different job. If the other jobs that look appealing were local I’d definitely have applied by now.

[WilliamFaulkner]

I could not care less that the deal I helped put together closed. I am essentially working only for the paycheck. The hours are a bit much at times but I would be significantly more content if I felt like I was building something I valued.

Maybe I will continue in biglaw and use the excess income to invest in or hire others to create things I appreciate -- or leave biglaw and work in those fields directly.

Are you in a position where you *need* the money (debt, family)? If you don't need the money, are you staying in Big Law for the time being in order to not worry about money later? If so, do you think that trade off is worth it

[Anonymous User]

I could not care less that the deal I helped put together closed. I am essentially working only for the paycheck. The hours are a bit much at times but I would be significantly more content if I felt like I was building something I valued.

Maybe I will continue in biglaw and use the excess income to invest in or hire others to create things I appreciate -- or leave biglaw and work in those fields directly.

Are you in a position where you *need* the money (debt, family)? If you don't need the money, are you staying in Big Law for the time being in order to not worry about money later? If so, do you think that trade off is worth it

I am a mid-level/senior so no longer need the money. I am staying so I do not need to worry about money when I eventually leave -- worse case scenario is I feel the exact same in another lower paying job.

[Anonymous User]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

[WilliamFaulkner]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

What I find interesting about this is that what you report may be general to practicing law as opposed to a feature of Big Law or a particular practice.

[Anonymous User]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

What I find interesting about this is that what you report may be general to practicing law as opposed to a feature of Big Law or a particular practice.

I disagree, I don’t think it’s universal. I’m not in biglaw, and I have more work than I want much of the time, but I do have a lot of control over when I do it. I have significant autonomy over my matters and accordingly a lot of control over my time in that no one is dumping stuff on my desk and telling me it has to be dealt with immediately. Mind you, I do end up working late and sometimes on weekends, but that’s because I’ve looked at my schedule and that’s when I need to work to get everything done. Too much work/inability to get away from it continues to be a problem, but it feels different to get to decide when/how to handle that work than to get told what I’m going to do. I have occasionally chosen to duck out on plans because I need to work instead, but I get to make that decision. So I feel kind of overworked and stressed, but fully recognize that getting the work dumped on you by someone else just feels way worse. But that isn’t universal to all law practices.

[Anonymous User]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

What I find interesting about this is that what you report may be general to practicing law as opposed to a feature of Big Law or a particular practice.

I disagree, I don’t think it’s universal. I’m not in biglaw, and I have more work than I want much of the time, but I do have a lot of control over when I do it. I have significant autonomy over my matters and accordingly a lot of control over my time in that no one is dumping stuff on my desk and telling me it has to be dealt with immediately. Mind you, I do end up working late and sometimes on weekends, but that’s because I’ve looked at my schedule and that’s when I need to work to get everything done. Too much work/inability to get away from it continues to be a problem, but it feels different to get to decide when/how to handle that work than to get told what I’m going to do. I have occasionally chosen to duck out on plans because I need to work instead, but I get to make that decision. So I feel kind of overworked and stressed, but fully recognize that getting the work dumped on you by someone else just feels way worse. But that isn’t universal to all law practices.

Having been both in-house and outside counsel, the expectation for responsiveness is much higher for outside counsel. When in-house, you are a part of the org like everyone else and so people in other departments usually can’t just get what they want, when they want it. When outside, there is both the financial pressure to be worth the high fees and the internal law firm culture .

As a general matter, it doesn’t help that many lawyers are people pleasers and they are horrible at setting appropriate expectations. It’s important to work with more senior lawyers who can push back on clients and set proper expectations.

[Anonymous User]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

What I find interesting about this is that what you report may be general to practicing law as opposed to a feature of Big Law or a particular practice.

Yes exactly. I hope that was still helpful because you asked about unhappy lawyers in general. I think it’s hard to escape the type of stress I described unless you’re in a non-litigation government or public interest role. Possibly some in-house roles as well, but certainly not all. However, those jobs pay a lot less, so you may have financial stress as a trade off.

[Anonymous User]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

I disagree. Personally just because I am able to make and keep plans doesn't change the fact that the work is mind-numbingly boring, the people are difficult, and I am not in a position to make high level decisions. Those factors add up to a job that is just fundamentally misery inducing, even if I am only working a consistent 40 hour a week schedule. The job itself just sucks compared to people who are, for example, corporate executives.

[WilliamFaulkner]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

I disagree. Personally just because I am able to make and keep plans doesn't change the fact that the work is mind-numbingly boring, the people are difficult, and I am not in a position to make high level decisions. Those factors add up to a job that is just fundamentally misery inducing, even if I am only working a consistent 40 hour a week schedule. The job itself just sucks compared to people who are, for example, corporate executives.

Why are you working such a boring job? Do you think anything in the law could better fulfill you? If so, why aren't you doing that?

[Anonymous User]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

I disagree. Personally just because I am able to make and keep plans doesn't change the fact that the work is mind-numbingly boring, the people are difficult, and I am not in a position to make high level decisions. Those factors add up to a job that is just fundamentally misery inducing, even if I am only working a consistent 40 hour a week schedule. The job itself just sucks compared to people who are, for example, corporate executives.

Why are you working such a boring job? Do you think anything in the law could better fulfill you? If so, why aren't you doing that?

I think that the vast majority of legal jobs are either boring or low paying. There is very little scope, be it at a firm or in-house, for a legal job that is both interesting and lucrative. That makes law compare very unfavorably to jobs on the business side, which can be both interest/fun and highly lucrative. Also explains why so many lawyers are bored and miserable with the endless paper pushing and comma revisions.

[Anonymous User]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

I disagree. Personally just because I am able to make and keep plans doesn't change the fact that the work is mind-numbingly boring, the people are difficult, and I am not in a position to make high level decisions. Those factors add up to a job that is just fundamentally misery inducing, even if I am only working a consistent 40 hour a week schedule. The job itself just sucks compared to people who are, for example, corporate executives.

What do you mean by “corporate executives”? Pretty sure people have to work their way up in business before they’re making “high level decisions.” Getting a graduate degree doesn’t let you jump the queue on entry level positions.

(FWIW, “business” isn’t inherently more interesting than law. It bores me to tears. So while “law isn’t business” is a perfectly fair reason for you, personally, to be unhappy in law, it’s not a reason that law is inherently worse than business, which you seem to be suggesting.)

[WilliamFaulkner]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

I disagree. Personally just because I am able to make and keep plans doesn't change the fact that the work is mind-numbingly boring, the people are difficult, and I am not in a position to make high level decisions. Those factors add up to a job that is just fundamentally misery inducing, even if I am only working a consistent 40 hour a week schedule. The job itself just sucks compared to people who are, for example, corporate executives.

Why are you working such a boring job? Do you think anything in the law could better fulfill you? If so, why aren't you doing that?

I think that the vast majority of legal jobs are either boring or low paying. There is very little scope, be it at a firm or in-house, for a legal job that is both interesting and lucrative. That makes law compare very unfavorably to jobs on the business side, which can be both interest/fun and highly lucrative. Also explains why so many lawyers are bored and miserable with the endless paper pushing and comma revisions.

As a very new lawyer, that's my sense, too. I am hoping to avoid unhappiness by doing Big Law before transitioning to a public interest or government position, and am using this thread in part to gauge whether that would lead to unhappiness.

[Sackboy]

I think we are all unhappy sometimes. It’s the lack of flexibility and control over your life (think: having to cancel all your plans because documents came in early and need to be reviewed immediately) that really drains people. WFH improved this a bit for many, and I’ve noticed morale taking a nosedive since RTO. (Not trying to start another debate on the merits of WFH vs. RTO, just sharing my observations.)

I disagree. Personally just because I am able to make and keep plans doesn't change the fact that the work is mind-numbingly boring, the people are difficult, and I am not in a position to make high level decisions. Those factors add up to a job that is just fundamentally misery inducing, even if I am only working a consistent 40 hour a week schedule. The job itself just sucks compared to people who are, for example, corporate executives.

What do you mean by “corporate executives”? Pretty sure people have to work their way up in business before they’re making “high level decisions.” Getting a graduate degree doesn’t let you jump the queue on entry level positions.

(FWIW, “business” isn’t inherently more interesting than law. It bores me to tears. So while “law isn’t business” is a perfectly fair reason for you, personally, to be unhappy in law, it’s not a reason that law is inherently worse than business, which you seem to be suggesting.)

Some of this does definitely reek of people who have no experience with other professions. Almost all of these "corporate executives" spend 20yrs+ to get to that level, and a lot of them still have awfully boring jobs, even if they are making decisions. If anything, law is one of the best way to be a young corporate executive. I've seen tons of folks go into biglaw, make non-equity partner, leave after a couple of years (so, 10yrs total in a traditional system), and land a role as Deputy GC or GC of a Company. If you're a K-JD, that makes you a fairly senior corporate executive as the ripe old age of 35. Now, you're not going to be the DGC or GC of a Fortune 500, but I see people take this path with some sizeable and interesting private companies.