A common discussion among my friends these days is whether the title counsel is really a good thing or if there are negatives associated with it. We are all 6-8 years, and at firms that in the past 5 years or so have fully transitioned to “counsel as a sort of non share partner” step. None of us want to stay to make partner , but all are up for or soon to be up for counsel.
We often wonder if we should move before we get the counsel title hung around our necks. The “are senior associates more portable than counsels” kind of concern. But also maybe counsel opens up better opportunities in house in terms of title or comp, etc.?
Anyway, TLS hivemind thoughts?
Counsel career portability Forum
Forum rules
Anonymous Posting
Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are revealing sensitive employment related information about a firm, job, etc. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.
Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned.
Anonymous Posting
Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are revealing sensitive employment related information about a firm, job, etc. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.
Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned.
-
chruck
- Posts: 19
- Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:13 pm
Re: Counsel career portability
I feel like your concern is whether employers will view the counsel title as a failure to make partner/move to a permanent associate position. This could impact your ability to leave obtain employment outside the firm.
I think the first thing to note is that the general consensus seems to be the higher up you go the less positions their will be available simple because there are more open associate general counsel positions than deputy general counsel positions. So if you are try to match your seniority with an equivalent non-firm job the options may be slimmer but also better paying/higher up the ladder.
Second, I think the “counsel” title is highly dependent how well the market is familiar with your firm’s career progression. If most people know counsel = step between senior associate and partner, then I do not think it will matter. If the market is not aware, I do think there is a risk that counsel is still generally looked at in the “of counsel” sense - failure to move from senior associate to partner/brought in as a support specialist for a niche area to support a partner’s book of business.
May be worth talking to a recruiter in the area you are trying to lateral to. It would help provide a sense of how people view the counsel title.
I think the first thing to note is that the general consensus seems to be the higher up you go the less positions their will be available simple because there are more open associate general counsel positions than deputy general counsel positions. So if you are try to match your seniority with an equivalent non-firm job the options may be slimmer but also better paying/higher up the ladder.
Second, I think the “counsel” title is highly dependent how well the market is familiar with your firm’s career progression. If most people know counsel = step between senior associate and partner, then I do not think it will matter. If the market is not aware, I do think there is a risk that counsel is still generally looked at in the “of counsel” sense - failure to move from senior associate to partner/brought in as a support specialist for a niche area to support a partner’s book of business.
May be worth talking to a recruiter in the area you are trying to lateral to. It would help provide a sense of how people view the counsel title.
-
Anonymous User
- Posts: 432779
- Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am
Re: Counsel career portability
I had a conversation with a senior associate at a v5 recently. We were discussing how much of a pain it would be if they went all those years and didn't make partner. I asked if they would be comfortable being a career counsel. They basically said career counsel at v5 is still very lucrative and would probably be preferable to "lateraling down" to make partner (plus there's always a chance at partner at v5 after some years).
Not sure if this is factually accurate and I didn't press the point but it's something worth thinking about.
If salary is any indication of your value added, then counsel at a "better" firm is a great step for career portability plus partnership prospects elsewhere
Not sure if this is factually accurate and I didn't press the point but it's something worth thinking about.
If salary is any indication of your value added, then counsel at a "better" firm is a great step for career portability plus partnership prospects elsewhere
