Relationships in Big Law Forum

[Anonymous User]

I am still in law school but already have a big law career lined up for when I graduate. I am married and have been happily married for six years. I was curious if anyone could give feedback on how big law has affected your relationship. My wife used to work 12 hours a day 7 days a week for over a year then it cooled down when she got promoted. She works permanently remote though so I still see her everyday. We were hoping we would at least have a little time together at night during the week and be able to spend some time together on the weekends. Realistically, how much time have you found you are actually able to spend with your partner?

[Anonymous User]

I am still in law school but already have a big law career lined up for when I graduate. I am married and have been happily married for six years. I was curious if anyone could give feedback on how big law has affected your relationship. My wife used to work 12 hours a day 7 days a week for over a year then it cooled down when she got promoted. She works permanently remote though so I still see her everyday. We were hoping we would at least have a little time together at night during the week and be able to spend some time together on the weekends. Realistically, how much time have you found you are actually able to spend with your partner?

This is going to vary significantly among firms, practice groups, and individuals. It would be helpful to get some intel on where you'll land post-grade (city, practice, firm, etc.).

Anecdotally, I'm in IP lit and have a wife at a midlaw firm in litigation. We see each other every night for dinner and some TV downtime, though often only for a couple hours. We get a good amount of time on the weekends together (takeout dinner date, watching movies, running errands together, etc.), though one of us has a substantial amount of work over the weekend about 75% of the time.

Because we are in lit, rather than transactional, we don't field as many random 11th hour asks that interfere with our plans. If we truly plan, work rarely gets in the way of the big things we want to do together and with our families (though we may have to burn the candle at both ends before and after). With that said, during big litigation milestones (e.g., expert reports, close of discovery, trial, etc.), we hardly see each other for days or weeks at a time. I had an two week trial in another state last year during which I spoke to my wife for maybe 1-2 hours total. To be fair, we are both very type A when it comes to work, so we tend to work more and harder than we need to.

[Anonymous User]

I am still in law school but already have a big law career lined up for when I graduate. I am married and have been happily married for six years. I was curious if anyone could give feedback on how big law has affected your relationship. My wife used to work 12 hours a day 7 days a week for over a year then it cooled down when she got promoted. She works permanently remote though so I still see her everyday. We were hoping we would at least have a little time together at night during the week and be able to spend some time together on the weekends. Realistically, how much time have you found you are actually able to spend with your partner?

This is going to vary significantly among firms, practice groups, and individuals. It would be helpful to get some intel on where you'll land post-grade (city, practice, firm, etc.).

Anecdotally, I'm in IP lit and have a wife at a midlaw firm in litigation. We see each other every night for dinner and some TV downtime, though often only for a couple hours. We get a good amount of time on the weekends together (takeout dinner date, watching movies, running errands together, etc.), though one of us has a substantial amount of work over the weekend about 75% of the time.

Because we are in lit, rather than transactional, we don't field as many random 11th hour asks that interfere with our plans. If we truly plan, work rarely gets in the way of the big things we want to do together and with our families (though we may have to burn the candle at both ends before and after). With that said, during big litigation milestones (e.g., expert reports, close of discovery, trial, etc.), we hardly see each other for days or weeks at a time. I had an two week trial in another state last year during which I spoke to my wife for maybe 1-2 hours total. To be fair, we are both very type A when it comes to work, so we tend to work more and harder than we need to.

I’ll be working at Kirkland in the DC branch. I haven’t decided on a practice group. I’ll have a better idea after this summer. Thank you for the feedback though. I’m excited to hear that you have a fair amount of quality time available. I am strange in that I actually love working a lot and can live off very little sleep so I think if I have time to spend with my wife it will help to relieve a lot of the stress that comes with working in Big Law.

[Anonymous User]

It must be hard to be single working in Big Law. I have single friends from all over and I’ve heard that the current dating life is very difficult due to dating apps etc. I think it is very helpful to have someone to go home to after a stressful day. I can’t imagine dealing with the stress of the job and any unstable relationships.

[Anonymous User]

I am still in law school but already have a big law career lined up for when I graduate. I am married and have been happily married for six years. I was curious if anyone could give feedback on how big law has affected your relationship. My wife used to work 12 hours a day 7 days a week for over a year then it cooled down when she got promoted. She works permanently remote though so I still see her everyday. We were hoping we would at least have a little time together at night during the week and be able to spend some time together on the weekends. Realistically, how much time have you found you are actually able to spend with your partner?

This is going to vary significantly among firms, practice groups, and individuals. It would be helpful to get some intel on where you'll land post-grade (city, practice, firm, etc.).

Anecdotally, I'm in IP lit and have a wife at a midlaw firm in litigation. We see each other every night for dinner and some TV downtime, though often only for a couple hours. We get a good amount of time on the weekends together (takeout dinner date, watching movies, running errands together, etc.), though one of us has a substantial amount of work over the weekend about 75% of the time.

Because we are in lit, rather than transactional, we don't field as many random 11th hour asks that interfere with our plans. If we truly plan, work rarely gets in the way of the big things we want to do together and with our families (though we may have to burn the candle at both ends before and after). With that said, during big litigation milestones (e.g., expert reports, close of discovery, trial, etc.), we hardly see each other for days or weeks at a time. I had an two week trial in another state last year during which I spoke to my wife for maybe 1-2 hours total. To be fair, we are both very type A when it comes to work, so we tend to work more and harder than we need to.

I’ll be working at Kirkland in the DC branch. I haven’t decided on a practice group. I’ll have a better idea after this summer. Thank you for the feedback though. I’m excited to hear that you have a fair amount of quality time available. I am strange in that I actually love working a lot and can live off very little sleep so I think if I have time to spend with my wife it will help to relieve a lot of the stress that comes with working in Big Law.

Previous poster again. I'm the same way re: sleep (only got 4 hours last night and am doing fine). That will serve you well in biglaw with a family. Just keep your work stress away from your family life (admittedly easier said than done).

KE is known for being a sweatshop, though. You're probably going to get less free time there than at some other similar DC shops. Nobody there is going to tell you you're working too much. Worst case you can lateral elsewhere for more of a balance.

[Anonymous User]

It must be hard to be single working in Big Law. I have single friends from all over and I’ve heard that the current dating life is very difficult due to dating apps etc. I think it is very helpful to have someone to go home to after a stressful day. I can’t imagine dealing with the stress of the job and any unstable relationships.

Single NYC biglaw associate in a specialist group. Can confirm, being single in biglaw sucks.

[Anonymous User]

I am still in law school but already have a big law career lined up for when I graduate. I am married and have been happily married for six years. I was curious if anyone could give feedback on how big law has affected your relationship. My wife used to work 12 hours a day 7 days a week for over a year then it cooled down when she got promoted. She works permanently remote though so I still see her everyday. We were hoping we would at least have a little time together at night during the week and be able to spend some time together on the weekends. Realistically, how much time have you found you are actually able to spend with your partner?

This is going to vary significantly among firms, practice groups, and individuals. It would be helpful to get some intel on where you'll land post-grade (city, practice, firm, etc.).

Anecdotally, I'm in IP lit and have a wife at a midlaw firm in litigation. We see each other every night for dinner and some TV downtime, though often only for a couple hours. We get a good amount of time on the weekends together (takeout dinner date, watching movies, running errands together, etc.), though one of us has a substantial amount of work over the weekend about 75% of the time.

Because we are in lit, rather than transactional, we don't field as many random 11th hour asks that interfere with our plans. If we truly plan, work rarely gets in the way of the big things we want to do together and with our families (though we may have to burn the candle at both ends before and after). With that said, during big litigation milestones (e.g., expert reports, close of discovery, trial, etc.), we hardly see each other for days or weeks at a time. I had an two week trial in another state last year during which I spoke to my wife for maybe 1-2 hours total. To be fair, we are both very type A when it comes to work, so we tend to work more and harder than we need to.

I'm in general lit and my wife is in finance, so it isn't a one-to-one, but this tracks with my experience very closely.

[Anonymous User]

I am biglaw corporate, my wife is also biglaw corporate (different firms and subgroups).

Biglaw "busy" is a different than a lot of other careers out there. I know people in residencies, etc. who would work like dogs during their on-call times, but once they are off the clock, they are off the clock. That doesn't really happen in biglaw. There may be times where you aren't busy at all, there may be times where you literally feel like you don't have the hours in the day to get done what you need to even if you stay up all night and are in front of your computer every minute of the day. It isn't predictable, you can't plan when you are busy and when you aren't. It isn't a "I will sit down and work from 7 to 7 each day and my work will be even and consistent for me to meet my hours" type of job.

Where it gets hard for relationships is having a partner who can understand that you don't have control over your life's schedule. Want to plan fun events in the future? Better be prepared that a deal closing might be pushed and you are stuck cancelling all your plans (you can't tell a partner "hey I actually made a dinner date two months ago and I will send out signature pages for this closing in a few hours when I'm back").

Some firms and some partners are better at respecting pre-made plans and vacations than others. Honestly though sometimes it is harder to do everything to prepare for vacation than actually going on vacation. Finding willing and able coverage for your work while out, making sure everything on your plate is either done or handed off to someone else, making sure someone else has access to any docs you may have been working on, etc.

I can't tell you the number of times my wife and I have been out to places where one or both of us have to pause whatever we are doing for a few minutes to send out a few quick emails. It can be very hard to detach yourself from that mindset of being on-call and constantly waiting to hear the ding of new emails.

Neither of us mind working hard. But I feel like shit when I might be really busy for a few days and I feel like I can't take even a few minutes to help my wife clean up the house, walk the dogs, cook dinner, etc. We are working from home for now, and while I'm physically there, I'm not being "present" in her life at all when I'm busy. I feel like shit when we are out at a nice dinner and I feel my phone buzz in my pocket a few times and all I can think about for the next few minutes is "I should really check that quickly to make sure it isn't anything urgent" instead of being fully present with my wife. I feel like shit that the first thing I do in the morning isn't say good morning to her but it is to check whatever emails came in overnight to know if I need to start working immediately. These are all qualities that biglaw firms actively encourage you to have. They just phrase it under being "responsive" and "eager", but want they really mean is for you to act like you only exist to do this work for them and nothing else in your life matters, but don't complain because we pay you a boat load of money.

Sorry for the rant. I'm still mad because some f'ing asshole senior associate scheduled an hour and a half long call at 6pm on Valentine's Day.

[Anonymous User]

I am biglaw corporate, my wife is also biglaw corporate (different firms and subgroups).

Biglaw "busy" is a different than a lot of other careers out there. I know people in residencies, etc. who would work like dogs during their on-call times, but once they are off the clock, they are off the clock. That doesn't really happen in biglaw. There may be times where you aren't busy at all, there may be times where you literally feel like you don't have the hours in the day to get done what you need to even if you stay up all night and are in front of your computer every minute of the day. It isn't predictable, you can't plan when you are busy and when you aren't. It isn't a "I will sit down and work from 7 to 7 each day and my work will be even and consistent for me to meet my hours" type of job.

Where it gets hard for relationships is having a partner who can understand that you don't have control over your life's schedule. Want to plan fun events in the future? Better be prepared that a deal closing might be pushed and you are stuck cancelling all your plans (you can't tell a partner "hey I actually made a dinner date two months ago and I will send out signature pages for this closing in a few hours when I'm back").

Some firms and some partners are better at respecting pre-made plans and vacations than others. Honestly though sometimes it is harder to do everything to prepare for vacation than actually going on vacation. Finding willing and able coverage for your work while out, making sure everything on your plate is either done or handed off to someone else, making sure someone else has access to any docs you may have been working on, etc.

I can't tell you the number of times my wife and I have been out to places where one or both of us have to pause whatever we are doing for a few minutes to send out a few quick emails. It can be very hard to detach yourself from that mindset of being on-call and constantly waiting to hear the ding of new emails.

Neither of us mind working hard. But I feel like shit when I might be really busy for a few days and I feel like I can't take even a few minutes to help my wife clean up the house, walk the dogs, cook dinner, etc. We are working from home for now, and while I'm physically there, I'm not being "present" in her life at all when I'm busy. I feel like shit when we are out at a nice dinner and I feel my phone buzz in my pocket a few times and all I can think about for the next few minutes is "I should really check that quickly to make sure it isn't anything urgent" instead of being fully present with my wife. I feel like shit that the first thing I do in the morning isn't say good morning to her but it is to check whatever emails came in overnight to know if I need to start working immediately. These are all qualities that biglaw firms actively encourage you to have. They just phrase it under being "responsive" and "eager", but want they really mean is for you to act like you only exist to do this work for them and nothing else in your life matters, but don't complain because we pay you a boat load of money.

Sorry for the rant. I'm still mad because some f'ing asshole senior associate scheduled an hour and a half long call at 6pm on Valentine's Day.

Wow, I never thought of the vacation thing. That would truly suck to plan out a vacation months ahead and have to cancel it if a partner insists you come into the office for something. My partner works insane hours but she has control over her hours and it’s not like she gets phone calls at 1AM. Well, hopefully we can figure it out, it sounds like it will definitely be a challenge

[Anonymous User]

Wow, I never thought of the vacation thing. That would truly suck to plan out a vacation months ahead and have to cancel it if a partner insists you come into the office for something. My partner works insane hours but she has control over her hours and it’s not like she gets phone calls at 1AM. Well, hopefully we can figure it out, it sounds like it will definitely be a challenge

To clarify, I've never had to cancel a true vacation that we've really wanted to go on because a partner wanted me in-office. I've always communicated my vacation plans to partners I am working with early and often (i.e., several reminders I will be out) and worked hard to either finish my projects or get coverage for what I can't close out before I leave.

The worst experience I had was working with a partner from another office and, despite frequently telling him beforehand I would be out the next week and working hard to finish off a draft of what I was doing for him, he completely ignored my out of office automatic replies to tell me I needed to flip revisions ASAP while I was gone. It took me about 2-3 hours and I just ended up doing it. I actively avoided working with that partner ever again and would tell him I was too busy when he wanted to put me on later projects.

[Anonymous User]

Wow, I never thought of the vacation thing. That would truly suck to plan out a vacation months ahead and have to cancel it if a partner insists you come into the office for something. My partner works insane hours but she has control over her hours and it’s not like she gets phone calls at 1AM. Well, hopefully we can figure it out, it sounds like it will definitely be a challenge

To clarify, I've never had to cancel a true vacation that we've really wanted to go on because a partner wanted me in-office. I've always communicated my vacation plans to partners I am working with early and often (i.e., several reminders I will be out) and worked hard to either finish my projects or get coverage for what I can't close out before I leave.

The worst experience I had was working with a partner from another office and, despite frequently telling him beforehand I would be out the next week and working hard to finish off a draft of what I was doing for him, he completely ignored my out of office automatic replies to tell me I needed to flip revisions ASAP while I was gone. It took me about 2-3 hours and I just ended up doing it. I actively avoided working with that partner ever again and would tell him I was too busy when he wanted to put me on later projects.

The night and day difference of vacation practices between different firms/practices/teams can be pretty jarring. At my first firm I was on a vacation with my spouse and her family multiple timezones away and was told (with no apology) to pull a string 11-hour days because of a deal blowing up. My spouse had a hell of a time explaining why this was happening to her family. When our head of group had an all-team quarterly check in a few months later, one of the things he said was that it would be better if people would stop complaining so much about messed up vacations - we're in a service industry, this is what you signed up for. At my second firm vacation was pretty sacrosanct and I mostly just sent e-mails where I knew would save people time and effort, but there was no expectation that I would do so. From a relationship perspective, when I went in-house, my spouse said it was one of the best things that ever happened to me, but it was also one of the best things that ever happened to her, because she felt like she got me and us back as a socializing matter for the first time in five years. Associates suffer in biglaw, but their partner/spouses do too.