Debevoise vs. S&C Forum

[Anonymous User]

Planning on going into corporate work. I think I'm most interested in M&A but appreciate the freedom of the "generalist" model at S&C on the off chance I end up interested in something else.

Literally have only ever heard incredible things about the people at Debevoise and it feels like that stands in sharp contrast to all the "sharp elbows" criticisms I hear about S&C. Deb is also highly selective at my school, which is a horrible reason to consider them desirable but ah human nature. Feels like maybe I dodge the whole awful sweatshop type vibe at Deb.

Most important for me are the quality/amount of work, the training, exit opps and, admittedly, a little bit of prestige.

[Anonymous User]

if you care most about prestige and quality of work and you want corporate then ... I think it's SullCrom and not close

[Anonymous User]

This is not close for public M&A. IMO "culture" differences between firms exist but are overplayed. You're talking about firms with 100+ classes. There will be cool people, insane people, and weird people in every firm's class and partnership. What matters more is how work is assigned, the group's reputation for ruining ur life, and exit ops.

[Anonymous User]

This is not close for public M&A. IMO "culture" differences between firms exist but are overplayed. You're talking about firms with 100+ classes. There will be cool people, insane people, and weird people in every firm's class and partnership. What matters more is how work is assigned, the group's reputation for ruining ur life, and exit ops.

How "not close" is not close? I know S&C has fairly strong public M&A but don't know comparatively. Feels like chambers can only say so much.

Also how do exit opps look? Mostly industry based?

[Anonymous User]

How "not close" is not close? I know S&C has fairly strong public M&A but don't know comparatively. Feels like chambers can only say so much.

Also how do exit opps look? Mostly industry based?

Not OP, but I'm the type to pay attention to M&A press releases and league tables.

I can recall seeing Deb. M&A PRs maybe 3 times in the last year. I don't track S&C M&A PRs because they're so numerous. I wouldn't bat an eye if Deb. didn't make an appearance in the league tables but would associate S&C not being there with a fundamental shift in the U.S. economy (may have actually happened in the initial aftermath of COVID).

Exit opportunities are probably about as good as any other top NYC shop and not limiting in terms of industry.

It's also not close in that FIG, an area where Deb. stands out, S&C stands out more.

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

[Penn3141]

How "not close" is not close? I know S&C has fairly strong public M&A but don't know comparatively. Feels like chambers can only say so much.

Also how do exit opps look? Mostly industry based?

Not OP, but I'm the type to pay attention to M&A press releases and league tables.

I can recall seeing Deb. M&A PRs maybe 3 times in the last year. I don't track S&C M&A PRs because they're so numerous. I wouldn't bat an eye if Deb. didn't make an appearance in the league tables but would associate S&C not being there with a fundamental shift in the U.S. economy (may have actually happened in the initial aftermath of COVID).

Exit opportunities are probably about as good as any other top NYC shop and not limiting in terms of industry.

It's also not close in that FIG, an area where Deb. stands out, S&C stands out more.

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

Off topic but looking to learn more about M&A. Goings-ons and substance. Any tips? You seem to be a decent person to ask

[Anonymous User]

How "not close" is not close? I know S&C has fairly strong public M&A but don't know comparatively. Feels like chambers can only say so much.

Also how do exit opps look? Mostly industry based?

Not OP, but I'm the type to pay attention to M&A press releases and league tables.

I can recall seeing Deb. M&A PRs maybe 3 times in the last year. I don't track S&C M&A PRs because they're so numerous. I wouldn't bat an eye if Deb. didn't make an appearance in the league tables but would associate S&C not being there with a fundamental shift in the U.S. economy (may have actually happened in the initial aftermath of COVID).

Exit opportunities are probably about as good as any other top NYC shop and not limiting in terms of industry.

It's also not close in that FIG, an area where Deb. stands out, S&C stands out more.

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

Can you clarify how so/in what way?

[Anonymous User]

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

Can you clarify how so/in what way?

S&C folks generally wanted Biglaw and to thrive there so they spent their free-time discussing those things and associated activities (grades, clerkships, etc.). Deb. folks generally were luke-warm about Biglaw and spent their free-time promoting social causes and partying.

It seems to me that the former would've really mellowed the latter's buzz, and the latter would find the former too gunnery to their liking. Again, small sample size from a random person. Don't read too much into it.

[Anonymous User]

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

Can you clarify how so/in what way?

S&C folks generally wanted Biglaw and to thrive there so they spent their free-time discussing those things and associated activities (grades, clerkships, etc.). Deb. folks generally were luke-warm about Biglaw and spent their free-time promoting social causes and partying.

It seems to me that the former would've really mellowed the latter's buzz, and the latter would find the former too gunnery to their liking. Again, small sample size from a random person. Don't read too much into it.

lol. This is pretty accurate at my t14.

[Anonymous User]

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

Can you clarify how so/in what way?

S&C folks generally wanted Biglaw and to thrive there so they spent their free-time discussing those things and associated activities (grades, clerkships, etc.). Deb. folks generally were luke-warm about Biglaw and spent their free-time promoting social causes and partying.

It seems to me that the former would've really mellowed the latter's buzz, and the latter would find the former too gunnery to their liking. Again, small sample size from a random person. Don't read too much into it.

lol. This is pretty accurate at my t14.

same

[Anonymous User]

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

Can you clarify how so/in what way?

S&C folks generally wanted Biglaw and to thrive there so they spent their free-time discussing those things and associated activities (grades, clerkships, etc.). Deb. folks generally were luke-warm about Biglaw and spent their free-time promoting social causes and partying.

It seems to me that the former would've really mellowed the latter's buzz, and the latter would find the former too gunnery to their liking. Again, small sample size from a random person. Don't read too much into it.

lol. This is pretty accurate at my t14.

Same at CLS.

[Anonymous User]

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

Can you clarify how so/in what way?

S&C folks generally wanted Biglaw and to thrive there so they spent their free-time discussing those things and associated activities (grades, clerkships, etc.). Deb. folks generally were luke-warm about Biglaw and spent their free-time promoting social causes and partying.

It seems to me that the former would've really mellowed the latter's buzz, and the latter would find the former too gunnery to their liking. Again, small sample size from a random person. Don't read too much into it.

lol. This is pretty accurate at my t14.

Same at CLS.

Just did S&C summer - went in expecting a gunner class and there were def a bunch but also a bunch going out 3-4x nights a week. I think it's silly to pigeonhole classes of 120+ people into a bucket. I would guess S&C has more gunner types than Deb but you can still easily find your people in a class of that size to the point where I didn't end up finding a problem I expected to find.

[Anonymous User]

Off topic but looking to learn more about M&A. Goings-ons and substance. Any tips? You seem to be a decent person to ask

I don't have the capability to discuss its individual aspects without discussing every other aspect, and I just don't have the time for that. I'm sorry. I would Google "m&a site:top-law-schools.com" and just start reading.

[Anonymous User]

How "not close" is not close? I know S&C has fairly strong public M&A but don't know comparatively. Feels like chambers can only say so much.

Also how do exit opps look? Mostly industry based?

Not OP, but I'm the type to pay attention to M&A press releases and league tables.

I can recall seeing Deb. M&A PRs maybe 3 times in the last year. I don't track S&C M&A PRs because they're so numerous. I wouldn't bat an eye if Deb. didn't make an appearance in the league tables but would associate S&C not being there with a fundamental shift in the U.S. economy (may have actually happened in the initial aftermath of COVID).

Exit opportunities are probably about as good as any other top NYC shop and not limiting in terms of industry.

It's also not close in that FIG, an area where Deb. stands out, S&C stands out more.

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

How do you source your M&A PR for the most part?

[Anonymous User]

To question from law student re how to research: when I was in law school I checked law360 when I was curious which firms were working on recent deals bc my school had a subscription. You can search firm names in the search bar. TheDeal is good too if you have a subscription in school, I’ve only used it after I started working though so I don’t know if schools pay for it. If you’re looking for a specific deal just check the press release and it’s often there. with that said, I wouldn’t concern yourself much with any of this when you’re in law school.

As for Deb vs S&C, I think Deb is a firm that law students at every law school view very highly but once you’re working in NY biglaw you don’t see them nearly as much on major deals as other “top” NY firms. They’re still a good firm for m&a, but S&C will do a lot more public m&a deals if that’s what you’re interested in.

[jbagelboy]

I’ve wavered on questions like this over the years, but I’m pretty confident now in where I’d come out. S&C for general corporate. And I wouldn’t feel that conflicted about it. There are scenarios where Debevoise might make sense — a focus on arbitration comes to mind — but for this OP, head downtown.

[Anonymous User]

I’ve wavered on questions like this over the years, but I’m pretty confident now in where I’d come out. S&C for general corporate. And I wouldn’t feel that conflicted about it. There are scenarios where Debevoise might make sense — a focus on arbitration comes to mind — but for this OP, head downtown.

that's what I'm thinking, especially since I am not particularly interested in arbitration work! If I may ask, what has led you to waver over time on these sorts of questions?

[Anonymous User]

How "not close" is not close? I know S&C has fairly strong public M&A but don't know comparatively. Feels like chambers can only say so much.

Also how do exit opps look? Mostly industry based?

Not OP, but I'm the type to pay attention to M&A press releases and league tables.

I can recall seeing Deb. M&A PRs maybe 3 times in the last year. I don't track S&C M&A PRs because they're so numerous. I wouldn't bat an eye if Deb. didn't make an appearance in the league tables but would associate S&C not being there with a fundamental shift in the U.S. economy (may have actually happened in the initial aftermath of COVID).

Exit opportunities are probably about as good as any other top NYC shop and not limiting in terms of industry.

It's also not close in that FIG, an area where Deb. stands out, S&C stands out more.

I won't make any value judgments on personality types, but I will say that S&C folks at my school would've had an awful time hanging out with the Deb. folks and vice versa. Take from that what you wish (or don't since it's just a random sampling of personalities).

what is a league table and how can i learn more

[Anonymous User]

what is a league table and how can i learn more

cmon dawg, don’t make us break out the LMGTFY links

[Anonymous User]

This is not close for public M&A. IMO "culture" differences between firms exist but are overplayed. You're talking about firms with 100+ classes. There will be cool people, insane people, and weird people in every firm's class and partnership. What matters more is how work is assigned, the group's reputation for ruining ur life, and exit ops.

Yeah this culture thing is really overplayed. I'm a midlevel that switched firms in the course of my career and can confirm that top tier law firms are all similar. All really similar just different names and some other differences that aren't all that important.

[Anonymous User]

what is a league table and how can i learn more

cmon dawg, don’t make us break out the LMGTFY links

I did google it - there’s a few different pdfs, I just wanted to know how people view the tables. Looks like it’s a good way to see which firms have good volume vs. size of deal etc. Is there something to note about it?