K&E Share Partner taking questions about K&E Forum

[Anonymous User]

I'll be happy to engage others on substance to try to keep this thread useful.

Don't worry, this exchange has been useful for the rest of us - confirms a lot of suspicions re: Kirkland culture!

No offense, but to the handful of people saying "oh, wow this spat about 401k contributions confirms a lot about KE culture" you sound totally childish and like you're just looking for a data point to support a preconceived notion.

Keep on going, people who have a preconceived notion about your firm are surely going to change their minds the more you insult them.

This isn't an argument you can win. It's not even an argument. That's your first mistake. If you cared about PR, you'd try to behave in public.

I'm not the other anon. KE has 3,000 attorneys in 16 offices and it's crazy to be like "oh, I've learned a lot about KE culture today" from a random exchange about DC benefits, come on. To echo the comment from the other NSP, most of the attorneys I've worked with have come across as normal decent human beings and I count some of my good friends among them. There is a culture at KE--to the extent any large firm has one across its offices and practice groups--and if people earnestly want to discuss it I'd be happy to offer my $.02 but these comments about "well, there's KE's culture" aren't fair or true.

This might be harsh, but when I do callback interviews for my firm and ask applicants why they want to work at our firm, I look unfavorably on responses like "everyone I met from your firm is great!".

First, it's a super generic answer you can spit out at any interview. What did you specifically learn from speaking to our associates that attract you to the firm?

Second, we have like 2000+ associates, and you've met what 10, max? That's a pretty poor sample size to draw conclusions from.

Same thing going on here in this thread lol. 2 random NSPs (with absolutely 0 confirmation whether they are NSPs or even work at K&E) got into a random argument about 401K match and people are drawing inferences on the culture and personality types of an entire firm of 3000 ppl. Lol it's so stupid - I'm not at K&E, but it looks like ppl will find any excuse to hate on them and L&W.

[Anonymous User]

The Permanent NSP comp is a bit of a black box, but I’ve heard numbers in excess of $1MM (depending on group, experience, etc.).

Do you have any more info about this? Is "permanent NSP" essentially the new version of "of counsel" for mid-career lawyers at KE?

Permanent NSP is not really a new version of "of counsel", but there are similarities. There are, however, some NSPs in specialized groups or who do good work but aren't going to have the business case to justify SP. These NSP slots can have a lot of benefits around not being pressured to develop business, etc. and they make more then they could at other firms.

[Anonymous User]

If someone laterals to K&E and they receive a big signing bonus (say, $250k), do they still receive their full (or a pro-rated) year-end bonus? Or is the signing bonus in lieu of any year-end bonus?

[Anonymous User]

quote="Anonymous User" post_id=10488409 time=1630004640 user_id=45852]
If someone laterals to K&E and they receive a big signing bonus (say, $250k), do they still receive their full (or a pro-rated) year-end bonus? Or is the signing bonus in lieu of any year-end bonus?
[/quote]

You should negotiate this in your offer, but I would say typically you will also get your year end bonus. The real negotiation is typically whether full or pro rated.

[Lawsohard99]

Thanks for answering this - one other question - one of the most attractive features of my current role is that I'm effectively 100% remote. I've heard K&E is friendly to remote working as well, but I'm not sure if that's a team/practice group thing or general policy.

We have corporate associates in Australia right now so I think you’re good.

[Anonymous User]

If someone laterals to K&E and they receive a big signing bonus (say, $250k), do they still receive their full (or a pro-rated) year-end bonus? Or is the signing bonus in lieu of any year-end bonus?

You should negotiate it in your letter, but I have not seen this as a total replacement for the year end. It is typically negotiated, however, whether you will get full year end or pro rated (and depends on time of year you onboard).

[CanadianWolf]

OP wrote in post #2 on page 2:

"Sometimes a weirdo slips through because of technical brilliance or expertise in a valuable niche."

I had read enough at this point.

[ChairmanKaga]

Don't worry, this exchange has been useful for the rest of us - confirms a lot of suspicions re: Kirkland culture!

Do you KE guys bickering and generally showing your asses know that the rest of us can see this? If the goal of this thread was to "clear up some misconceptions" well I guess it cleared stuff up all right.

Also agree your business model is doing fine, but if the goal is to change the perception of KE, harsh responses to legit questions probably aren't buying you a lot of currency.

telling a current Kirkland associate "tough shit" when s/he says work is being distributed unevenly, s/he's dying, and s/he's ready to quit is probably not gonna help Kirkland's image on this forum

lol nice clapback - I assume your goal in posting here is to re-affirm every bad perception ppl have about K&E?

As a former KE NSP, I'm enjoying seeing an SP come on here to talk up how much money SPs make while shitting on current associates. Pretty solid summary of KE in a nutshell tbh.

LOL
"Here to correct misinformation and set things straight."
"Yeah we continue to pile on people billing 200 a month and it's "up to them" to say no knowing full well we self-selected for people terrified to stand up for themselves, even at the expense of their mental and physical health. As you can see, this has been a very profitable strategy for us!"

Numerous other posters have already hit the nail on the head.

Kirkland is a very successful firm. Nobody could seriously argue with that. It's probably the industry's biggest success story of the last 20 years.

However, the external perception of the place is terrible. It's perceived that the hours are brutal, the equity partners are intense, and the clients are demanding, all to a greater degree than other firms. The churn of associates and non-equity partners is remarkable, many only last a year or less before moving on or being moved on, everyone else in the market can see that and the legal press has reported on it.

The firm is seen as almost a legal equivalent to 80s investment bank where doing deals and making money are the only things that matter. While the reality may be different, and it usually is with these sort of things, the negative perception is fairly widespread in my opinion. If the original goal of this thread was to combat that perception, it has at best failed and at worst had the opposite effect.

[lurkinassociate]

Good post ^

What are the median hours in groups like M&A/PE, capital markets, and debt finance at K&E?

[Anonymous User]

Quality Kirkland material: https://reddit.com/r/LawSchool/comments ... ror_story/

[Anonymous User]

Another anon Lateral from the last few months, I think my pay per hour is less here atm than my old firm. I’m being ground to dust.

[Anonymous User]

Don't worry, this exchange has been useful for the rest of us - confirms a lot of suspicions re: Kirkland culture!

Do you KE guys bickering and generally showing your asses know that the rest of us can see this? If the goal of this thread was to "clear up some misconceptions" well I guess it cleared stuff up all right.

Also agree your business model is doing fine, but if the goal is to change the perception of KE, harsh responses to legit questions probably aren't buying you a lot of currency.

telling a current Kirkland associate "tough shit" when s/he says work is being distributed unevenly, s/he's dying, and s/he's ready to quit is probably not gonna help Kirkland's image on this forum

lol nice clapback - I assume your goal in posting here is to re-affirm every bad perception ppl have about K&E?

As a former KE NSP, I'm enjoying seeing an SP come on here to talk up how much money SPs make while shitting on current associates. Pretty solid summary of KE in a nutshell tbh.

LOL
"Here to correct misinformation and set things straight."
"Yeah we continue to pile on people billing 200 a month and it's "up to them" to say no knowing full well we self-selected for people terrified to stand up for themselves, even at the expense of their mental and physical health. As you can see, this has been a very profitable strategy for us!"

Numerous other posters have already hit the nail on the head.

Kirkland is a very successful firm. Nobody could seriously argue with that. It's probably the industry's biggest success story of the last 20 years.

However, the external perception of the place is terrible. It's perceived that the hours are brutal, the equity partners are intense, and the clients are demanding, all to a greater degree than other firms. The churn of associates and non-equity partners is remarkable, many only last a year or less before moving on or being moved on, everyone else in the market can see that and the legal press has reported on it.

The firm is seen as almost a legal equivalent to 80s investment bank where doing deals and making money are the only things that matter. While the reality may be different, and it usually is with these sort of things, the negative perception is fairly widespread in my opinion. If the original goal of this thread was to combat that perception, it has at best failed and at worst had the opposite effect.

Really funny you mention the 80's investment bank thing. In my KE summer they had some miserable looking old timer partner (no wedding ring) come talk to our entire class and he said we were all joining what was similar to Goldman Sachs in the 80's.

[Anonymous User]

Another anon Lateral from the last few months, I think my pay per hour is less here atm than my old firm. I’m being ground to dust.

Sorry to hear : (
Is this like averaging 230+/month? Is your plan to leave after a year?

[Anonymous User]

I'll be happy to engage others on substance to try to keep this thread useful.

Don't worry, this exchange has been useful for the rest of us - confirms a lot of suspicions re: Kirkland culture!

No offense, but to the handful of people saying "oh, wow this spat about 401k contributions confirms a lot about KE culture" you sound totally childish and like you're just looking for a data point to support a preconceived notion.

Keep on going, people who have a preconceived notion about your firm are surely going to change their minds the more you insult them.

This isn't an argument you can win. It's not even an argument. That's your first mistake. If you cared about PR, you'd try to behave in public.

I'm not the other anon. KE has 3,000 attorneys in 16 offices and it's crazy to be like "oh, I've learned a lot about KE culture today" from a random exchange about DC benefits, come on. To echo the comment from the other NSP, most of the attorneys I've worked with have come across as normal decent human beings and I count some of my good friends among them. There is a culture at KE--to the extent any large firm has one across its offices and practice groups--and if people earnestly want to discuss it I'd be happy to offer my $.02 but these comments about "well, there's KE's culture" aren't fair or true.

This might be harsh, but when I do callback interviews for my firm and ask applicants why they want to work at our firm, I look unfavorably on responses like "everyone I met from your firm is great!".

First, it's a super generic answer you can spit out at any interview. What did you specifically learn from speaking to our associates that attract you to the firm?

Second, we have like 2000+ associates, and you've met what 10, max? That's a pretty poor sample size to draw conclusions from.

Same thing going on here in this thread lol. 2 random NSPs (with absolutely 0 confirmation whether they are NSPs or even work at K&E) got into a random argument about 401K match and people are drawing inferences on the culture and personality types of an entire firm of 3000 ppl. Lol it's so stupid - I'm not at K&E, but it looks like ppl will find any excuse to hate on them and L&W.

Currently a junior associate at K&E, and this thread has been incredibly insightful for outside associates and very accurate to what my experiences at Kirkland have been. FWIW I will likely be leaving shortly for another large law firm in my market.

[Anonymous User]

How does the lateral process work at K&E? I have heard that it's not really a formal interview process if you are a mid-level or senior and at a good firm, so you might just talk to one person and get an offer. Is that true?

[Anonymous User]

How does the lateral process work at K&E? I have heard that it's not really a formal interview process if you are a mid-level or senior and at a good firm, so you might just talk to one person and get an offer. Is that true?

I'm a mid level and interviewed with them when I lateraled. It was the same as pretty much everywhere else (one callback, skipped screener). Got dinged. Actually that was the only place that interviewed me and then dinged me lol

[Anonymous User]

How does the lateral process work at K&E? I have heard that it's not really a formal interview process if you are a mid-level or senior and at a good firm, so you might just talk to one person and get an offer. Is that true?

I work at KE and have interviewed plenty of potential laterals (who have normal, half-day callbacks). Idk if some shenanigans are happening for certain corporate folks given the insane market right now.

[Anonymous User]

How does the lateral process work at K&E? I have heard that it's not really a formal interview process if you are a mid-level or senior and at a good firm, so you might just talk to one person and get an offer. Is that true?

I work at KE and have interviewed plenty of potential laterals (who have normal, half-day callbacks). Idk if some shenanigans are happening for certain corporate folks given the insane market right now.

Even pre-covid I’ve seen some strange exceptions to normal recruiting practices (like fast tracking an offer based on the whims of a SP without formal interviews). I think the relative autonomy of offices and certain partners, combined with the results-focused vibe of the firm lends itself to bending procedure for the greater good. If someone with power thinks there’s a valid business case for some action and the normal channels are not sufficient, they’ll just fricken do it. Which can be good or bad.

[Anonymous User]

A couple of posters had mentioned NSPs having to pay state income taxes. I'm in a no state income tax state. How much taxes are we talking about?

[Anonymous User]

A couple of posters had mentioned NSPs having to pay state income taxes. I'm in a no state income tax state. How much taxes are we talking about?

It is around 5% of your overall Compensation in total.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone have info regarding the Austin office? I will be summering at a different TX office but was wondering what the culture is like.

[Anonymous User]

A couple of posters had mentioned NSPs having to pay state income taxes. I'm in a no state income tax state. How much taxes are we talking about?

It is around 5% of your overall Compensation in total.

That's not as bad as I thought. Thanks for the reply!

[Anonymous User]

Anyone have info regarding the Austin office? I will be summering at a different TX office but was wondering what the culture is like.

The Austin office is a mix of partners and associates from our Bay Area and other Texas offices (along with new hires). It’s building out quickly, but so far has a “young” vibe with a lot of ambitious attorneys. The office is doing a good mix of tech, renewables, traditional energy and other M&A. Would expect the office to grow quickly similar to the Houston and Dallas offices, especially given the growing Austin market.

[Anonymous User]

A couple of posters had mentioned NSPs having to pay state income taxes. I'm in a no state income tax state. How much taxes are we talking about?

It is around 5% of your overall Compensation in total.

If I'm making NSP in a HCOL area, does that mean my overall taxes could go down? (5% is less than I pay now in state/local taxes). Or is it 5%ish more regardless.

[Anonymous User]

. double post sorry