K&E Bonus

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K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:04 am

What’s the highest above-market bonus ratio one has ever seen for K&E associates? The hours have just been crazy…

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Jun 12, 2021 10:20 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:04 am
What’s the highest above-market bonus ratio one has ever seen for K&E associates? The hours have just been crazy…
2.0x is the highest I recall seeing in the bonus presentations in the last 4-5 years.

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Jun 12, 2021 12:11 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:04 am
What’s the highest above-market bonus ratio one has ever seen for K&E associates? The hours have just been crazy…
Have hours been crazy for litigation as well as corporate?

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by NYto202.5 » Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:00 pm

There are still associates left at K&E? My firm shares a mutual client with K&E. There are five different associates I work with at K&E for that client. They have all left this year. We had to email the relationship partner at K&E recently to ask about a minor document we needed drafted because there was no one else left to email.

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Joachim2017 » Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:10 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 12:11 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:04 am
What’s the highest above-market bonus ratio one has ever seen for K&E associates? The hours have just been crazy…
Have hours been crazy for litigation as well as corporate?
I believe the answer is "No". And not just for K&E. Corporate is still going fast, litigation is not. But I would be interested to be corrected or to hear otherwise from other people in Big Law and/or boutiques.

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 10:20 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:04 am
What’s the highest above-market bonus ratio one has ever seen for K&E associates? The hours have just been crazy…
2.0x is the highest I recall seeing in the bonus presentations in the last 4-5 years.
Recall seeing 2.7 once

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm

Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:58 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
I have no idea other than to say that even for an average associate billing around 2,000 hours (even less), the bonus will be better than whatever the market scale is. Based on the friends I have in cap mkts my answer would be "you're going to work a lot" and "you're going to get paid a lot." So if you're already busting your ass somewhere else you may as well come to KE and do it for more money.

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sun Jun 13, 2021 9:51 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:58 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
I have no idea other than to say that even for an average associate billing around 2,000 hours (even less), the bonus will be better than whatever the market scale is. Based on the friends I have in cap mkts my answer would be "you're going to work a lot" and "you're going to get paid a lot." So if you're already busting your ass somewhere else you may as well come to KE and do it for more money.
Different anon here. Also in process of possibly lateraling because my sub group is slow at current firm and the step up in firms is big.

Curious what sort of signing bonuses you hear about for finance people.

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sun Jun 13, 2021 9:55 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
Hi, I'm an associate staffed on a CapM deal at KE. I would not join KE CapM if I were you (this isn't true for all groups at KE but...). I am looking to quit as soon as possible because of this experience. The hours are unbearable and the culture is not great. I did 15 hours day/billing over the last week. From my experience, this group is an abusive work environment and I would exhaust every other job opportunity before I joined this group permanently. They cannot staff deals appropriately because junior and midlevel associates keep quitting -- that should be sign enough that working in this group is not good. It's not a great experience and I cry every day because of the pressure to be available 24-7 including weekends. It's destroying my mental health. Don't do it. Not worth it. Wish I had made a different decision.

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Sun Jun 13, 2021 10:01 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 9:55 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
Hi, I'm an associate staffed on a CapM deal at KE. I would not join KE CapM if I were you (this isn't true for all groups at KE but...). I am looking to quit as soon as possible because of this experience. The hours are unbearable and the culture is not great. I did 15 hours day/billing over the last week. From my experience, this group is an abusive work environment and I would exhaust every other job opportunity before I joined this group permanently. They cannot staff deals appropriately because junior and midlevel associates keep quitting -- that should be sign enough that working in this group is not good. It's not a great experience and I cry every day because of the pressure to be available 24-7 including weekends. It's destroying my mental health. Don't do it. Not worth it. Wish I had made a different decision.
Thanks for the info. I'm one of the anons above considering an offer. Which office are you in? NYC?

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
On track to 4000 this year. No idea what people who had habitually padded their hours are billing now

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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:52 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
On track to 4000 this year. No idea what people who had habitually padded their hours are billing now
Come on dude. That's ridiculous. Even in a sweatshop environment no one wants an associate pacing to 4,000 hours. That's the sort of crap that gets firms on the front page of ATL / amlaw / the new york times for killing people. You realize all you'd have to do is go to the managing partner and say "I've currently billed [1200] hours in 3 months" and they'd change your situation.

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:55 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
On track to 4000 this year. No idea what people who had habitually padded their hours are billing now
Come on dude. That's ridiculous. Even in a sweatshop environment no one wants an associate pacing to 4,000 hours. That's the sort of crap that gets firms on the front page of ATL / amlaw / the new york times for killing people. You realize all you'd have to do is go to the managing partner and say "I've currently billed [1200] hours in 3 months" and they'd change your situation.
4000 hours would mean billing 11+ client hours a day for 365 days LMAOOOO. My v5 would legit 1. think I was faking hours 2. get pissed I was inefficient and 3. immediately pull me off and get me to 3000 or below. There's no way u can work well if you're actually doing that.

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Definitely Not North

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Definitely Not North » Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:52 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
On track to 4000 this year.
yeah I know I sure believe it. DTE screenshot or gtfo.

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:49 pm

Definitely Not North wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:52 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
On track to 4000 this year.
yeah I know I sure believe it. DTE screenshot or gtfo.
This honestly just sounds like FUD from a Paul Weiss associate or a 2L or whatever to scare people. I'd believe--barely--a 3k pace given how crazy things are right now but 4k is bullshit. Unless he means he had a single insane month of 330 hours / 2 months of 660.

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Anonymous User
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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:14 pm

To people who find it hard to believe, show some compassion. This review year still has a few months left so it may or may not happen.

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:55 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
On track to 4000 this year. No idea what people who had habitually padded their hours are billing now
Come on dude. That's ridiculous. Even in a sweatshop environment no one wants an associate pacing to 4,000 hours. That's the sort of crap that gets firms on the front page of ATL / amlaw / the new york times for killing people. You realize all you'd have to do is go to the managing partner and say "I've currently billed [1200] hours in 3 months" and they'd change your situation.
4000 hours would mean billing 11+ client hours a day for 365 days LMAOOOO. My v5 would legit 1. think I was faking hours 2. get pissed I was inefficient and 3. immediately pull me off and get me to 3000 or below. There's no way u can work well if you're actually doing that.
Imagine having dozens of projects to handle

Anonymous User
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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:40 pm

I hit 2700+ hours a few years ago and it was hellacious. 4000 is inhuman.

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:52 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
On track to 4000 this year. No idea what people who had habitually padded their hours are billing now
Come on dude. That's ridiculous. Even in a sweatshop environment no one wants an associate pacing to 4,000 hours. That's the sort of crap that gets firms on the front page of ATL / amlaw / the new york times for killing people. You realize all you'd have to do is go to the managing partner and say "I've currently billed [1200] hours in 3 months" and they'd change your situation.
Not the 4,000+ hours OP, but poster above who shared their opinion on the level of toxicity in the environment. As a KE associate, I do 100% believe this individual. There are very few mid-levels and junior associates in this practice group right now. I watched an entire team of people quit together without so much as a place to land. The associates are staffed to numerous deals, sometimes as many as 8-12. Nobody knows what they are doing with SPAC work because it is so new -- every assignment takes 2x the time because you have to learn what you're doing.

Many associates are crossed staffed to capital markets to preserve the deals/get them out the door regardless of their level of competence and just left there to do what they can WHILE working in their own practice groups. It's hellish right now. Coming to a close on one deal alone my hours have been insane every day. Being staffed across multiple deals? I would quit because the workload is sweatshop/unbearable level. I'm so sorry for OP. I hope that he/she gets a vacation and some time to decompress the abuse they're experiencing.

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Re: K&E Bonus

Post by 2013 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:54 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
On track to 4000 this year. No idea what people who had habitually padded their hours are billing now
Come on dude. That's ridiculous. Even in a sweatshop environment no one wants an associate pacing to 4,000 hours. That's the sort of crap that gets firms on the front page of ATL / amlaw / the new york times for killing people. You realize all you'd have to do is go to the managing partner and say "I've currently billed [1200] hours in 3 months" and they'd change your situation.
Not the 4,000+ hours OP, but poster above who shared their opinion on the level of toxicity in the environment. As a KE associate, I do 100% believe this individual. There are very few mid-levels and junior associates in this practice group right now. I watched an entire team of people quit together without so much as a place to land. The associates are staffed to numerous deals, sometimes as many as 8-12. Nobody knows what they are doing with SPAC work because it is so new -- every assignment takes 2x the time because you have to learn what you're doing.

Many associates are crossed staffed to capital markets to preserve the deals/get them out the door regardless of their level of competence and just left there to do what they can WHILE working in their own practice groups. It's hellish right now. Coming to a close on one deal alone my hours have been insane every day. Being staffed across multiple deals? I would quit because the workload is sweatshop/unbearable level. I'm so sorry for OP. I hope that he/she gets a vacation and some time to decompress the abuse they're experiencing.
Is some of this a product of Kirkland promoting 7th years to partner? You end up having fewer associates. I’m assuming junior partners are glorious seniors, but still.

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:20 am

2013 wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:54 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
On track to 4000 this year. No idea what people who had habitually padded their hours are billing now
Come on dude. That's ridiculous. Even in a sweatshop environment no one wants an associate pacing to 4,000 hours. That's the sort of crap that gets firms on the front page of ATL / amlaw / the new york times for killing people. You realize all you'd have to do is go to the managing partner and say "I've currently billed [1200] hours in 3 months" and they'd change your situation.
Not the 4,000+ hours OP, but poster above who shared their opinion on the level of toxicity in the environment. As a KE associate, I do 100% believe this individual. There are very few mid-levels and junior associates in this practice group right now. I watched an entire team of people quit together without so much as a place to land. The associates are staffed to numerous deals, sometimes as many as 8-12. Nobody knows what they are doing with SPAC work because it is so new -- every assignment takes 2x the time because you have to learn what you're doing.

Many associates are crossed staffed to capital markets to preserve the deals/get them out the door regardless of their level of competence and just left there to do what they can WHILE working in their own practice groups. It's hellish right now. Coming to a close on one deal alone my hours have been insane every day. Being staffed across multiple deals? I would quit because the workload is sweatshop/unbearable level. I'm so sorry for OP. I hope that he/she gets a vacation and some time to decompress the abuse they're experiencing.
Is some of this a product of Kirkland promoting 7th years to partner? You end up having fewer associates. I’m assuming junior partners are glorious seniors, but still.
No. Every firm in the V25 with a serious transactional practice (so almost all of them this side of Williams & Connolly) is having a very, very hard time with retention right now. COVID + workload broke a lot of people and many attorneys are just leaving. I've seen people quitting left and right. We're trying to bring in new people as quickly as we can to fill the gaps but it's like a boat with a hole in it that you're bailing while water keeps coming in.

VentureMBA

New
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2019 4:34 pm

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by VentureMBA » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:30 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:20 am
2013 wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:54 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:51 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:05 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:08 pm
Going to anonymously respond to a few points ITT:

* Back in the day (at least 10 years back) it wasn't unheard of for above class high billers to reach or even exceed 3x market; there were rumors of "superstars" on the way to shares doing 4x. But KE back then was a very different firm than today, much smaller, different culture. Kirkland was reputedly a much weirder place in 2000, 2005, less of a profit maximizing death star.

* Litigation at KE is strong and stable from what I've heard. 2020 was better than 2019, which shocked everyone at first, 2021 is lining up to be better than 2020. Think 5-10% YoY gains. This is obviously broad brush and it's net of restructuring which went nuts last year. So litigation feels healthy although it's obviously the corporate side that's driving the nutty compensation wars right now. But keep in mind lit. was a major stabilizing force during the opening months of COVID.

* The guy above who said it feels like KE is shedding associates is right. We're also bringing them in like nuts. They've started doing a weekly "here's how many people we've brought in as laterals" newsletter presumably to try to assuage all the complaints about workload. I don't know what's going on but it seems like COVID and a KE workload while stuck in an apartment has broken a lot of people.
Thanks for the information. I am considering accepting a lateral offer from K&E. How exactly does the bonus formula work? Do you know how many hours the average capital markets associate in the busiest offices is billing?
On track to 4000 this year. No idea what people who had habitually padded their hours are billing now
Come on dude. That's ridiculous. Even in a sweatshop environment no one wants an associate pacing to 4,000 hours. That's the sort of crap that gets firms on the front page of ATL / amlaw / the new york times for killing people. You realize all you'd have to do is go to the managing partner and say "I've currently billed [1200] hours in 3 months" and they'd change your situation.
Not the 4,000+ hours OP, but poster above who shared their opinion on the level of toxicity in the environment. As a KE associate, I do 100% believe this individual. There are very few mid-levels and junior associates in this practice group right now. I watched an entire team of people quit together without so much as a place to land. The associates are staffed to numerous deals, sometimes as many as 8-12. Nobody knows what they are doing with SPAC work because it is so new -- every assignment takes 2x the time because you have to learn what you're doing.

Many associates are crossed staffed to capital markets to preserve the deals/get them out the door regardless of their level of competence and just left there to do what they can WHILE working in their own practice groups. It's hellish right now. Coming to a close on one deal alone my hours have been insane every day. Being staffed across multiple deals? I would quit because the workload is sweatshop/unbearable level. I'm so sorry for OP. I hope that he/she gets a vacation and some time to decompress the abuse they're experiencing.
Is some of this a product of Kirkland promoting 7th years to partner? You end up having fewer associates. I’m assuming junior partners are glorious seniors, but still.
No. Every firm in the V25 with a serious transactional practice (so almost all of them this side of Williams & Connolly) is having a very, very hard time with retention right now. COVID + workload broke a lot of people and many attorneys are just leaving. I've seen people quitting left and right. We're trying to bring in new people as quickly as we can to fill the gaps but it's like a boat with a hole in it that you're bailing while water keeps coming in.
Can confirm this is the case at my V50 also.

Source - am annualizing 3,100 hours.

Anonymous User
Posts: 375893
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: K&E Bonus

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:49 pm

I was also a senior associate at a V20 NYC corporate shop doing PE work. I quit 6 months ago and never looked back. Was billing 350-400 every month and from what I hear, the associates who remain are still on that pace. Nearly everyone I knew has quit and when I talk to them, they all discuss 400 hour months.

If you don’t believe it, that’s on you. But these busy corp practices are literally breaking not just individuals, but entire teams. I broke down several times during that time. So glad to be out.

Seriously? What are you waiting for?

Now there's a charge.
Just kidding ... it's still FREE!


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