Federal Public Defenders Forum

[Anonymous User]

Any current or former AFPDs out there? Is there a typical path? Is there a "purity" test of any kind, or can you come from a biglaw firm? Any thoughts welcome.

[CanadianWolf]

A "typical path" to a position as an attorney in the Federal Public Defenders Office = working at least 5 years as a state or local public defender.

P.S. Over the past couple of decades, I have read that job postings for FPDO in different cities as requiring or strongly preferring 5 years of experience as a PD at the state level. However, this "requirement/preference" might vary by office.

[gottagetouttahere]

Looking into this as a long-term option myself and would echo the state/local PD advice. I've also seen some JAG folks go into it (guessing the vet preference hiring and significant trial/direct legal service experience some JAs get helps).

New grad hiring is very rare (believe only San Diego and maybe AL do it?). You'll have to do some time in a PD office to get the resume; depending on which one you end up in, it may no longer be worth leaving after those ~5 years, should the opportunity arise.


another edit: for any worthwhile PD office, there is going to be a "purity" test.

[nixy]

Also a lot of JAGs get directly relevant experience doing criminal defense in military tribunals (ofc military law isn't the same as state/federal, but otherwise same basic thing).

Some offices require Spanish fluency. I also do know people who've gone to the FPD after working in private criminal defense, but I think the PD route is much more common (in part, a lot of private criminal defense firms want to see PD experience as well). The vast majority of FPDs I've known got into it from state PD work. I think going direct from biglaw would be tough because even if you do a lot of criminal pro bono, it's not quite the same as general indigent defense experience.

[Anonymous User]

Also a lot of JAGs get directly relevant experience doing criminal defense in military tribunals (ofc military law isn't the same as state/federal, but otherwise same basic thing).

Some offices require Spanish fluency. I also do know people who've gone to the FPD after working in private criminal defense, but I think the PD route is much more common (in part, a lot of private criminal defense firms want to see PD experience as well). The vast majority of FPDs I've known got into it from state PD work. I think going direct from biglaw would be tough because even if you do a lot of criminal pro bono, it's not quite the same as general indigent defense experience.

Would the calculus change at all if you're talking about a lit boutique that does a lot of criminal defense versus biglaw?

[nixy]

Oh yeah, that would be different from biglaw and while it's not quite indigent defense, you'd get pretty good experience.

The other thing to keep in mind that FPDs are expected to do a lot of writing, so you do want to show that you can do that, so presumably biglaw is helpful in that respect.

But again, the vast majority of FPDs I know came from state PD gigs.

[gottagetouttahere]

I'd be curious to hear how choosy one can be with respect to location. Barring familial or other ties, I can't imagine E.D. Mo. is going to be anywhere nearly as heavily applied to as S.D. Cal. or somewhere like that.

I would look into state/local PDs in areas you would like to live. You will find fantastic attorneys and decent pay in many places, although administration may leave a bit to be desired.

Regardless, an awesome and admirable gig

[Anonymous User]

Bumping this thread. Will time at a firm negatively impact one's chances at an FPD job in a significant way? I am trying to figure out what to do for a year between clerkships and I wondered whether it would be a mistake to take a big law position to fill the gap.

[Anonymous User]

Bumping this thread. Will time at a firm negatively impact one's chances at an FPD job in a significant way? I am trying to figure out what to do for a year between clerkships and I wondered whether it would be a mistake to take a big law position to fill the gap.

All I have are anecdotes. I interned at an FPD office and there were a couple of attys with biglaw experience, one of whom had worked biglaw for x < 3 years prior to being hired and had no other post-law school legal experience. That said, anything that doesn't show a commitment to indigent defense (and criminal law) is going to negatively impact one's chances at an FPD job. Significantly? Hard to say. Depends on where you're applying, what the job market is like when you apply, whether the federal government is in the middle of a hiring freeze etc. It also depends on whether you have other ways to "prove" that you actually want to do the work.

Many federal public defender office websites have a list of the attorneys who work there. It wouldn't hurt to browse the site of the office(s) in which you're most interested and look up the names on linkedin to see what their backgrounds are like.

[Anonymous User]

Yes, anecdotally, I know FPDs with biglaw credentials but none with actual biglaw backgrounds. That said, most of the ones I know are in small-ish markets where there isn’t a ton of biglaw anyway. The vast majority came from the county public defender.

I do know one FPD who didn’t start as a local PD, and did work for a firm, but it was a boutique criminal defense firm in LA. I also know one who was in-house for an insurance company before moving to the local public defender and then ultimately the FPD. I don’t know any who’ve done traditional biglaw, but I certainly can’t say it’s never happened.

FWIW I haven’t come across any who’ve done two federal clerkships, either, although that may tell you more about where I’ve worked than whether it’s atypical.

[ninthcircuitattorney]

BigLaw background may vary by district. In N.Dist.Ill. and S.D.N.Y. FDP Office (no slouches), a significant number had some BigLaw experience. These folks may have been able to play the card, "I can work anywhere, but I WANT to work here."