Is Tax LLM from NYU with $ Worth it? Forum

[LucaTooly]

I was wondering what everyone's thoughts about whether Tax LLM from NYU was worth it. I have been accepted to NYU with a $45,000 a year scholarship (putting tuition around $22,000) but am still scared whether it is worth the investment.

I am a graduating 3L from TT/TTT, top 4% of my class, with strong tax experience. I currently have a large regional law firm offer (300+ attorneys). The pay is not very good (less than $90,000 with 1700 billable), but the area is extremely cheap. I originally applied to tax LLMs in hopes that it could potentially give me more mobility to different regions and possibly another shot at Biglaw (preferably non-NYC) or Big4. I was planning on deferring my offer or re-applying to NYU after working a year or two, but the scholarship has made me rethink that.

Thanks!

[BrainsyK]

You should do it. NYU tax LLM has like 75%+ Big4/Biglaw outcomes, either of which is likely to materially improving your income (current and future). Especially with COVID, Schools are likely to offer another virtual year. You could live somewhere cheap to save on COL and possible even work after Jan., when most people will have gotten an offer. If you can keep costs down, it'd probably be a pretty good investment.

From what I know, which admittedly is relatively little, people often shut themselves out of Biglaw by insisting on generalist tax practices in NY/CA. If you're flexible on practice area and geography, your odds of landing up Biglaw probably increase materially.

[Anonymous User]

If you want Big 4 the NYU LLM is going to help out a lot and open doors. More than half of the Biglaw opportunities is mostly if you go into exec comp or a non tax law group. However, there are still many transactional and general tax positions and I anticipate there will be many positions next year after COVID clears up. A Tax LLM from NYU is still extremely helpful whether you go in house or jump around firms after getting experience. I would get the Tax LLM OP it's just one year and then you're done. You always have the safety net of returning to your firm after the LLM.

[CanadianWolf]

Earning a tax llm degree from NYU will certainly give you mobility & almost certainly lead to offers with more than one Big 4 accounting firm and, possibly, interviews with biglaw firms through TIP.

What type of tax experience do you have ?

Undergraduate major ?

What area of tax law is of most interest to you (M&A , SALT, tax controversy, executive compensation, ERISA/Qualified Retirement Plans/employee benefits, transfer pricing, international, estate and succession planning, federal government IRS/Treasury Dept., undecided, or ?) ?

What area of law will you practice under your current law firm offer ?

Law Review ? Editor ? Published ?

Big 4 should be in play throughout the country with an NYU tax llm. The issue that remains is whether or not a few years in a specific Big 4 practice area will facilitate a move to biglaw.

An NYU tax LLM degree for $22,000 in tuition costs is an incredible opportunity, but, of course, everything is relative. Did you apply to any other tax llm programs such as Georgetown which offer full scholarships ?

Do you plan to sit for the New York bar exam in July ?

[LucaTooly]

I do not have an undergraduate degree related to tax (I was a political science major) but have gotten A's in all the available tax classes, have completed a tax clinic, and have interned with the federal government doing tax work during a semester of law school.

I would preferably like to work in M & A but am pretty flexible to any area. My current firm offer has me in civil litigation.

[Trout et al]

If you want to be a tax lawyer you should go. That is a good discount for NYU. A year or two doing civil litigation isn't going to improve your resume for tax positions, it will just be something annoying you have to explain when you interview for tax positions. The salary isn't really good enough to advise stacking cash for a few years either. Now if this was tax litigation it would be a different story...it may make sense to work a few years.

If you don't want to actually be a tax lawyer and you just want another bite at the recruiting apple you should not go. You could very likely end up in big 4 doing something you don't care for for low-100s starting pay.

[CanadianWolf]

If you want to be a tax lawyer you should go. That is a good discount for NYU. A year or two doing civil litigation isn't going to improve your resume for tax positions, it will just be something annoying you have to explain when you interview for tax positions. The salary isn't really good enough to advise stacking cash for a few years either. Now if this was tax litigation it would be a different story...it may make sense to work a few years.

If you don't want to actually be a tax lawyer and you just want another bite at the recruiting apple you should not go. You could very likely end up in big 4 doing something you don't care for for low-100s starting pay.

Excellent advice.

Unless the litigation focuses on tax controversy matters, then 2 years of litigation is not helpful for one seeking a career in tax matters.

[CanadianWolf]

I do not have an undergraduate degree related to tax (I was a political science major) but have gotten A's in all the available tax classes, have completed a tax clinic, and have interned with the federal government doing tax work during a semester of law school.

I would preferably like to work in M & A but am pretty flexible to any area. My current firm offer has me in civil litigation.

Working in mergers & acquisitions (M&A) tax for a Big 4 is unlikely to lead to employment in biglaw. Big 4 M&A is highly specialized and complex; biglaw M&A is much more of a generalized practice which anyone can do. Big 4 M&A tax requires several years of oversight & tutoring by experienced co-workers as there are few, if any, prototype forms. Nevertheless, biglaw pays more than Big 4--significantly more.

NYU tax llm program should expose you to at least a couple of other practice areas. This is not to suggest that M&A tax work at a Big 4 is not a good choice because it is a great choice if you want to work for a major accounting firm. Currently, there is very high demand by major accounting firms in M&A tax.

Based on the additional shared information, it seems as though earning an NYU tax LLM degree at a very significant discount is worthwhile if you would be content working for a Big 4 accounting firm or major regional accounting firm in addition to getting a shot at biglaw tax during TIP. Additionally, an llm in tax from NYU should result in federal government (IRS, Treasury Dept.) opportunities.

Another option with Big 4 accounting firms is consulting work.

[LucaTooly]

I do not have an undergraduate degree related to tax (I was a political science major) but have gotten A's in all the available tax classes, have completed a tax clinic, and have interned with the federal government doing tax work during a semester of law school.

I would preferably like to work in M & A but am pretty flexible to any area. My current firm offer has me in civil litigation.

Working in mergers & acquisitions (M&A) tax for a Big 4 is unlikely to lead to employment in biglaw. Big 4 M&A is highly specialized and complex; biglaw M&A is much more of a generalized practice which anyone can do. Big 4 M&A tax requires several years of oversight & tutoring by experienced co-workers as there are few, if any, prototype forms. Nevertheless, biglaw pays more than Big 4--significantly more.

NYU tax llm program should expose you to at least a couple of other practice areas. This is not to suggest that M&A tax work at a Big 4 is not a good choice because it is a great choice if you want to work for a major accounting firm. Currently, there is very high demand by major accounting firms in M&A tax.

Based on the additional shared information, it seems as though earning an NYU tax LLM degree at a very significant discount is worthwhile if you would be content working for a Big 4 accounting firm or major regional accounting firm in addition to getting a shot at biglaw tax during TIP. Additionally, an llm in tax from NYU should result in federal government (IRS, Treasury Dept.) opportunities.

Another option with Big 4 accounting firms is consulting work.

Thank you all for this great advice! I guess my overall hope in getting a tax LLM would be to be able to work biglaw in a non-NYC market (think Philly, Boston, Charlotte, Denver, etc.) I am pretty flexible to locations but grew up in NYC and know the craziness that comes with NY biglaw. However, I am totally content if I can only land a Big4 somewhere as a backup.

[CanadianWolf]

You will almost certainly receive multiple Big 4 offers with any reputable tax llm degree (NYU, Georgetown, Northwestern, Florida, & Boston University as well as a few tax llm programs on the west coast of the US).

If willing to go below the Big 4, accounting firms such as BDO, RSM, Andersen Tax, and a few others should offer you more than your current offer in upstate New York.

NYU at $22,000 is very attractive.

If you become barred before graduating NYU, then your job hunt becomes a bit easier & much less taxing psychologically.

[UnfrozenCaveman]

Do you have student loan debt already? If not, $22,000 ain't that bad and probably worth it. It should push you into consideration at the types of firms you are looking for and open up more opportunities down the road.

[LucaTooly]

Do you have student loan debt already? If not, $22,000 ain't that bad and probably worth it. It should push you into consideration at the types of firms you are looking for and open up more opportunities down the road.

I currently have about $60,000 in loans. I am very debt adverse so adding the debt from an LLM is definitely in my consideration of whether or not to attend.

[UnfrozenCaveman]

Do you have student loan debt already? If not, $22,000 ain't that bad and probably worth it. It should push you into consideration at the types of firms you are looking for and open up more opportunities down the road.

I currently have about $60,000 in loans. I am very debt adverse so adding the debt from an LLM is definitely in my consideration of whether or not to attend.

You know the biggest thing that gives me pause is the non-NYC thing. In a pure numbers game, that's where a lot of the jobs are and if you somehow got stuck without a better opportunity from the LLM. (I don't know how this will change post-pandemic). Otherwise, $82,000 still won't be that bad in the grand scheme of things.

[CanadianWolf]

What is the total COA for NYU ? (Your total out-of-pocket cost including $22,000 tuition, room & board, books, plus other expected expenses.)

Does the $22,000 include anything other than tuition ?

[LucaTooly]

What is the total COA for NYU ? (Your total out-of-pocket cost including $22,000 tuition, room & board, books, plus other expected expenses.)

Does the $22,000 include anything other than tuition ?

$22,000 is just tuition. I know the city pretty well and have a girlfriend who would likely move with me to split rent. So I estimate that the total cost will be around $32,000.

[CanadianWolf]

$32,000 -$36,000 total COA for an NYU tax LLM is a great deal.

Probably the lowest offer for a JD/LLM from a Big 4 for M&A tax in Boston, Philly, or Denver would be $95,000 base plus $5,000 signing bonus. As $100,000 is more than the total of all of your student loans, then the added debt of attending NYU LLM Tax Program is reasonable. (Of course, NYC & San Francisco should pay much higher--base of $125,000 plus $10,000 or $15,000 signing bonus.)

M&A tax teams may or may not be located in all of your targeted cities (Charlotte, Philadelphia, Boston, & Denver). Likely to vary by firm. Lots of M&A in Houston & Dallas, Texas if those areas are of interest to you. Lots of M&A work in the San Francisco / SV area. Chicago & Seattle as well. Atlanta is another likely location.
Denver has activity. DC & No Virginia.

[Anonymous User]

When did you apply and when did you receive the scholarship decision? I was also admitted but did not hear anything re scholarship....

[Anonymous User]

when did you apply and when did you hearing about scholarship decision? I was also admitted but was not notified of scholarship yet ~~

[taxllmhopeful2022]

I’m not the OP, but I applied in late February, received a decision early March. I received a scholarship notification around 2 weeks after the acceptance.

[LucaTooly]

when did you apply and when did you hearing about scholarship decision? I was also admitted but was not notified of scholarship yet ~~

My application was "complete" in mid-February and I was accepted four days later (after a weekend). NYU was extremely quick acceptance for me but I think this is rare. For reference, I applied to Georgetown's program at the same time and just got accepted yesterday (3/26). I know people from my school who applied earlier than me and have still not heard anything from NYU. I received the scholarship notification from NYU on 3/25.

[Anonymous User]

when did you apply and when did you hearing about scholarship decision? I was also admitted but was not notified of scholarship yet ~~

My application was "complete" in mid-February and I was accepted four days later (after a weekend). NYU was extremely quick acceptance for me but I think this is rare. For reference, I applied to Georgetown's program at the same time and just got accepted yesterday (3/26). I know people from my school who applied earlier than me and have still not heard anything from NYU. I received the scholarship notification from NYU on 3/25.

Thanks!!! I was accepted early Feb. Guess I did not receive any $$$

[Anonymous User]

when did you apply and when did you hearing about scholarship decision? I was also admitted but was not notified of scholarship yet ~~

My application was "complete" in mid-February and I was accepted four days later (after a weekend). NYU was extremely quick acceptance for me but I think this is rare. For reference, I applied to Georgetown's program at the same time and just got accepted yesterday (3/26). I know people from my school who applied earlier than me and have still not heard anything from NYU. I received the scholarship notification from NYU on 3/25.

Thanks!!! I was accepted early Feb. Guess I did not receive any $$$

Are scholarships that hard to get? I was under the impression that everyone gets some $ to attend. Not to be rude, but OP is from a TTT and is getting a considerable scholarship.

[Anonymous User]

when did you apply and when did you hearing about scholarship decision? I was also admitted but was not notified of scholarship yet ~~

My application was "complete" in mid-February and I was accepted four days later (after a weekend). NYU was extremely quick acceptance for me but I think this is rare. For reference, I applied to Georgetown's program at the same time and just got accepted yesterday (3/26). I know people from my school who applied earlier than me and have still not heard anything from NYU. I received the scholarship notification from NYU on 3/25.

Thanks!!! I was accepted early Feb. Guess I did not receive any $$$

Are scholarships that hard to get? I was under the impression that everyone gets some $ to attend. Not to be rude, but OP is from a TTT and is getting a considerable scholarship.

I am not sure what is OP and the other anon's stats are; I went to Cardozo/Brooklyn, but my overall GPA is only 3.4 but tax gpa is 3.7 (five classes). I was accepted early Feb and have not heard anything re $$.

[CanadianWolf]

when did you apply and when did you hearing about scholarship decision? I was also admitted but was not notified of scholarship yet ~~

My application was "complete" in mid-February and I was accepted four days later (after a weekend). NYU was extremely quick acceptance for me but I think this is rare. For reference, I applied to Georgetown's program at the same time and just got accepted yesterday (3/26). I know people from my school who applied earlier than me and have still not heard anything from NYU. I received the scholarship notification from NYU on 3/25.

Thanks!!! I was accepted early Feb. Guess I did not receive any $$$

Are scholarships that hard to get? I was under the impression that everyone gets some $ to attend. Not to be rude, but OP is from a TTT and is getting a considerable scholarship.

According to an earlier post by OP, OP is/was at Syracuse law which is a Tier Two (US News rank #86) law school. OP is in the top 4% of class & has demonstrated interest in tax law.

[Anonymous User]

when did you apply and when did you hearing about scholarship decision? I was also admitted but was not notified of scholarship yet ~~

My application was "complete" in mid-February and I was accepted four days later (after a weekend). NYU was extremely quick acceptance for me but I think this is rare. For reference, I applied to Georgetown's program at the same time and just got accepted yesterday (3/26). I know people from my school who applied earlier than me and have still not heard anything from NYU. I received the scholarship notification from NYU on 3/25.

Thanks!!! I was accepted early Feb. Guess I did not receive any $$$

Are scholarships that hard to get? I was under the impression that everyone gets some $ to attend. Not to be rude, but OP is from a TTT and is getting a considerable scholarship.

According to an earlier post by OP, OP is/was at Syracuse law which is a Tier Two (US News rank #86) law school. OP is in the top 4% of class & has demonstrated interest in tax law.

I was just going on what OP said in this post, "I am a graduating 3L from TT/TTT". From what I know, NYU tends to give $ to most students that attend.