Which partners at your firms are notoriously terrible to work for? Forum

[Anonymous User]

Robbie Kaplan (of Kaplan Hecker) is very tough to work with (or, more accurately, for). She's well connected and brings in amazing cases, but they take a toll on associates. Like, a physically grueling toll slash heartburn. In retrospect, not worth it.

I heard this too, but I have no first hand experience. I am also nowhere near her professional or social circle, so this reputation must be really widespread. Is this still true? Again, why are people flocking to her boutique and is the culture of her boutique bad, because of this?

No inside knowledge at all, but assuming this reputation is true, people work for her for the same reason the absolute top students at law schools willingly subjected themselves to people like Kozinski and Reinhardt for decades. Prestige, high-profile work, and access to immense political resources and power.

[lolwutpar]

Imagine grinding away your life for years and years only to have your name immortalized on TLS as a top asshole among an industry of assholes. Idk how these people don't have enormous regrets about how they've gone about their lives.

They probably look at their investment accounts and take a ride in their 911 Turbo to get groceries.

[Anonymous User]

Imagine grinding away your life for years and years only to have your name immortalized on TLS as a top asshole among an industry of assholes. Idk how these people don't have enormous regrets about how they've gone about their lives.

They probably look at their investment accounts and take a ride in their 911 Turbo to get groceries.

Sad to say, but this is it. They don't give a shit since they're set for life. I guarantee all of the aforementioned partners know that everyone hates working for them. But they don't give a shit since they're raking in the dough and the biglaw pipeline will always provide a fresh batch of associates to torment each year. I'd even bet that some even revel in the fact that they're a terrible boss like some kind of badge of honor

[Anonymous User]

Imagine grinding away your life for years and years only to have your name immortalized on TLS as a top asshole among an industry of assholes. Idk how these people don't have enormous regrets about how they've gone about their lives.



On an unrelated note, who are the screamers at S&C? Everyone shits on S&C as having one of the worst cultures surprised to not see much mention ITT

There are plenty of shitty partners to work with at S&C but none of them are so *uniquely* bad that I’d feel comfortable outing them here. Although some people are more obnoxious than others, the problem is more the pervasive culture of bending over backwards for whoever is above you no matter how unreasonable they’re being. Client wants something on an objectively absurd and unnecessary timeline that will require weekend all-nighters? We would love to! Partner wants a team meeting to discuss a non-urgent project on a Saturday morning? Of course! Senior associate didn’t get around to reviewing something when you sent it two weeks ago and now wants you to go through it with him line by line on a call on Memorial Day? No problem!

These things are obviously problems at a lot of firms, but S&C seems to take it to a new level of stupidity/pointless suffering.

[Anonymous User]

Since Dennis Block left, who are the reigning terrible partners at Cadwalader?

[thisismytlsuername]

Client wants something on an objectively absurd and unnecessary timeline that will require weekend all-nighters? We would love to! Partner wants a team meeting to discuss a non-urgent project on a Saturday morning? Of course! Senior associate didn’t get around to reviewing something when you sent it two weeks ago and now wants you to go through it with him line by line on a call on Memorial Day? No problem!

This is just biglaw. This is why you get paid literally hundreds of thousands of dollars to push paper with no substantive experience. Availability.

But I agree with the poster in the 2021 Spring Bonuses thread who said that junior associates recently seemingly push back harder / more often than I've seen in my ten-year career.

[Anonymous User]

Client wants something on an objectively absurd and unnecessary timeline that will require weekend all-nighters? We would love to! Partner wants a team meeting to discuss a non-urgent project on a Saturday morning? Of course! Senior associate didn’t get around to reviewing something when you sent it two weeks ago and now wants you to go through it with him line by line on a call on Memorial Day? No problem!

This is just biglaw. This is why you get paid literally hundreds of thousands of dollars to push paper with no substantive experience. Availability.

But I agree with the poster in the 2021 Spring Bonuses thread who said that junior associates recently seemingly push back harder / more often than I've seen in my ten-year career.

I agree (see my last paragraph), but my point was that S&C seems to be on the worse end of the spectrum in this respect based on both comparisons with friends’ experiences at other firms and my own experience after lateraling. I should add, however, that I’m speaking about litigation - corporate work obviously has different expectations.

I’m not sure I’m following how the junior associate points ties in, but I’m not one, FWIW.

[Anonymous User]

Client wants something on an objectively absurd and unnecessary timeline that will require weekend all-nighters? We would love to! Partner wants a team meeting to discuss a non-urgent project on a Saturday morning? Of course! Senior associate didn’t get around to reviewing something when you sent it two weeks ago and now wants you to go through it with him line by line on a call on Memorial Day? No problem!

This is just biglaw. This is why you get paid literally hundreds of thousands of dollars to push paper with no substantive experience. Availability.

But I agree with the poster in the 2021 Spring Bonuses thread who said that junior associates recently seemingly push back harder / more often than I've seen in my ten-year career.

I agree with your point that a large part of our "value" is in being available, but there's obviously a limit to this. Sure, we should be generally available and responsive, and especially when a deal is closing/case is going to trial, we'll have to really burn the midnight oil. But I don't think weekend all-nighters for random non-major projects are reasonable (or a whole team being locked in a windowless room for 75 hours per week for months). I don't think it's accurate or beneficial to frame it as "this is just biglaw" when looking at genuinely toxic behavior.

[Excellent117]

Client wants something on an objectively absurd and unnecessary timeline that will require weekend all-nighters? We would love to! Partner wants a team meeting to discuss a non-urgent project on a Saturday morning? Of course! Senior associate didn’t get around to reviewing something when you sent it two weeks ago and now wants you to go through it with him line by line on a call on Memorial Day? No problem!

This is just biglaw. This is why you get paid literally hundreds of thousands of dollars to push paper with no substantive experience. Availability.

But I agree with the poster in the 2021 Spring Bonuses thread who said that junior associates recently seemingly push back harder / more often than I've seen in my ten-year career.

A fantastic development in my opinion.

[Anonymous User]

I think between the pandemic and workload, this is an exceptionally shitty time to be a junior. When I left Kirkland I knew multiple people who had billed multiple 300+ hour months in a row. It's bad.

[Anonymous User]

Imagine grinding away your life for years and years only to have your name immortalized on TLS as a top asshole among an industry of assholes. Idk how these people don't have enormous regrets about how they've gone about their lives.

They probably look at their investment accounts and take a ride in their 911 Turbo to get groceries.

Sad to say, but this is it. They don't give a shit since they're set for life. I guarantee all of the aforementioned partners know that everyone hates working for them. But they don't give a shit since they're raking in the dough and the biglaw pipeline will always provide a fresh batch of associates to torment each year. I'd even bet that some even revel in the fact that they're a terrible boss like some kind of badge of honor

It's precisely because the partners are set for life why I don't understand at all what drives them to be little demons and terrorize everyone around them. After a few years as a partner at a top firm you should have "fuck you" money and could easily retire early and do whatever you want.

But these people seemingly willingly choose to grind away 70hrs/week as a partner and behave horribly to everyone around them. Idk, I just cannot fathom being in their position and making the choices they do each day.

[Anonymous User]

I always kind of wonder if the senior partners working across from me that seem super competent and have their shit together are actually cool or are monsters irl. Richard Truesdell at dpw seems fantastic but I can’t tell how his associates view him. Any DPW lurkers care to chime in?

I heard from a friend that DPW asks secretaries to keep track of attorneys' time of arrival everyday pre-covid, is that true?

[Anonymous User]

I always kind of wonder if the senior partners working across from me that seem super competent and have their shit together are actually cool or are monsters irl. Richard Truesdell at dpw seems fantastic but I can’t tell how his associates view him. Any DPW lurkers care to chime in?

I heard from a friend that DPW asks secretaries to keep track of attorneys' time of arrival everyday pre-covid, is that true?

It's a bigger thing in some groups more than others. This isn't the original thread, but it gives some more details: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=302113

[Anonymous User]

I always kind of wonder if the senior partners working across from me that seem super competent and have their shit together are actually cool or are monsters irl. Richard Truesdell at dpw seems fantastic but I can’t tell how his associates view him. Any DPW lurkers care to chime in?

I heard from a friend that DPW asks secretaries to keep track of attorneys' time of arrival everyday pre-covid, is that true?

It's a bigger thing in some groups more than others. This isn't the original thread, but it gives some more details: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=302113

Not surprising ... I know someone who used to work at a non-NY office, this seems to be their firm-wide practice. And from what I've heard, it was reviewed by some partners as well (a friend told me he was late for several days in a roll bc of the brutal hours in the CM team, and a partner reached out asking why he's late all the time)

[Anonymous User]

What's the word on STB's M&A team? Any partners to get close with, and any to avoid?

Seconding this.

[Monochromatic Oeuvre]

Imagine grinding away your life for years and years only to have your name immortalized on TLS as a top asshole among an industry of assholes. Idk how these people don't have enormous regrets about how they've gone about their lives.

Yeah I'm sure the first thing Marty Lipton does when he gets home is fire up the Legal Employment forum to get his pulse on what twentysomethings are thinking.

Plenty of asshole partners have been told they are the sole reason someone is quitting (if not by the associate themselves, then by HR after exit interviews). It doesn't matter. The nicest possible outcome is that they shrug it off as just being business and immediately move on to the next worker bee. You spend years of your life getting enraged at someone who barely thinks about you.

[thisismytlsuername]

Client wants something on an objectively absurd and unnecessary timeline that will require weekend all-nighters? We would love to! Partner wants a team meeting to discuss a non-urgent project on a Saturday morning? Of course! Senior associate didn’t get around to reviewing something when you sent it two weeks ago and now wants you to go through it with him line by line on a call on Memorial Day? No problem!

This is just biglaw. This is why you get paid literally hundreds of thousands of dollars to push paper with no substantive experience. Availability.

But I agree with the poster in the 2021 Spring Bonuses thread who said that junior associates recently seemingly push back harder / more often than I've seen in my ten-year career.

I agree (see my last paragraph), but my point was that S&C seems to be on the worse end of the spectrum in this respect based on both comparisons with friends’ experiences at other firms and my own experience after lateraling. I should add, however, that I’m speaking about litigation - corporate work obviously has different expectations.

I’m not sure I’m following how the junior associate points ties in, but I’m not one, FWIW.

You don't follow how discussing junior associate pushback ties in to unreasonable availability requests? You must be a corporate lawyer.

Anyway, let's get back to naming and shaming.

[Anonymous User]

Bryce Friedman at STB had a reputation of being a bit of a prick, though not a horrible one. Just snippy comments that made you feel stupid apparently. Otherwise every partner I worked for there had high expectations but were respectful.

I caught some shit from bill russell there as a junior but for objectively good reasons tbh, I half assed a project in a way which wouldn’t have been good enough for a two man slip and fall personal injury firm

[Anonymous User]

STB m&a - Sebastián tiller, Ben Schaye, Mike holick, marni Lerner, William Allen. The culture and group is generally horrific.

[Anonymous User]

This thread has incredible potential.

Any partners in the NY bankruptcy scene with a reputation? Or bankruptcy/RX generally. Would like to have a heads up as an incoming RX associate.

Garrett Fail at Weil
Andy Dietderich at S&C
Tom Lauria at White and Case
Everyone at Akin

Is Lauria known as a bad boss, or is that just stemming from his reputation as nasty (and dubiously ethical) opposing counsel?

I'm asking because I genuinely don't know, not because I disagree. I'm definitely well aware of how he's scene externally and his apparently shitty political views.

I was at a hearing with all the big rx shops present. Lauria asked a junior on his team to confirm whether Lauria has the latest version of a doc. I could literally see sweat dropping from that junior’s forehead and his pupils were getting bigger the moment Lauria threw that question at him.

Lauria was actually pretty calm and that still made the junior almost pee his pants. That should tell you something.

[Anonymous User]

I've since left the firm but there was a particularly difficult associate at my V3 (in the flagship corporate group) who was notorious for not respecting the work/life balance of her juniors. She made partner a year or two after I left, and I've heard she's even more insufferable now. Multiple juniors left because they were staffed on her deals.

Typhoon June?

Ohh god I never had to work with her personally, but a couple of my friends left bc of her (I bet some of the juniors mentioned in the post above)

Lol at "v3." I simply googled "June partner Skadden" and found June Dipchand M&A partner in NYC.

I’m pretty sure she interviewed me during OCI

[Anonymous User]

Robbie Kaplan (of Kaplan Hecker) is very tough to work with (or, more accurately, for). She's well connected and brings in amazing cases, but they take a toll on associates. Like, a physically grueling toll slash heartburn. In retrospect, not worth it.

I heard this too, but I have no first hand experience. I am also nowhere near her professional or social circle, so this reputation must be really widespread. Is this still true? Again, why are people flocking to her boutique and is the culture of her boutique bad, because of this?

Anyone have any other insights on the top litigation boutiques? I know Kellogg, Susman, and Wilkinson are supposed to be meat grinders but associates on here seem to love working at Susman from other threads

Is Wilkinson a meat grinder? I’ve heard quite the opposite. Among other things, they don’t bill hours

[bodylikeatwizzler]

Imagine grinding away your life for years and years only to have your name immortalized on TLS as a top asshole among an industry of assholes. Idk how these people don't have enormous regrets about how they've gone about their lives.



On an unrelated note, who are the screamers at S&C? Everyone shits on S&C as having one of the worst cultures surprised to not see much mention ITT

They're probably proud, in a sadistic way. Imagine you're an old, chubby, bald and/or butt-ugly cretin of a human being, born with a horribly personality, your life essentially over (once you're in your 50s, you can give up any hope of achieving the dreams people have as a child, at the starting gate of life. I'm not saying everyone achieves their dreams, but at their age they can't even hope anymore), you don't have as much work as your fellow rainmaker partners (as far as I can tell, none of the partners named so far place on PBV's top fee earner chart, http://www.pbvdirectory.com/dirfeep.asp?ajr=7&opt=7), and you're finally in a position to take your anger and frustrations out on some kid who is essentially your 24-hour-a-day slave (I don't think you will find a superior-employee relationship with more potential for abuse than biglaw partner/non-partner).

[Anonymous User]

Bryce Friedman at STB had a reputation of being a bit of a prick, though not a horrible one. Just snippy comments that made you feel stupid apparently. Otherwise every partner I worked for there had high expectations but were respectful.

I caught some shit from bill russell there as a junior but for objectively good reasons tbh, I half assed a project in a way which wouldn’t have been good enough for a two man slip and fall personal injury firm

yea that's on you for producing shoddy work for an 11-time champion first ballot HOFer

[Anonymous User]

David Marriott from Cravath is also as notorious as others I believe.

Not quite what I expected from a Mormon

His rotation is almost always staffed with all women, always withs one asian woman, too, I believe.

ugh gross. this isn't an uncommon sight at a lot of the white shoe firms.

Hmm...this is odd. I worked with him (but not on his team), and didn’t notice this at all. Was friendly with me, and, at the very least, not “bad” enough that I think he should wind up on this list..

Ha, this response was either written by Dave/someone in Recruiting at Cravath, or by a very junior associate who knows little about the firm. Dave Marriott is a notorious nightmare to work with. It gives me palpitations just to hear his name. Anyone who has spent more than a few months at Cravath should, at a minimum, not find it "odd" to see his name on this list. It's near-universally known within the firm that anyone assigned to his team needs to find a new job ASAP.