Summer Class Expansion? Forum

[Anonymous User]

Heard several people talking about larger summer class size than the previous years, have people received any information on that front?

Heard both Weil and Paul Weiss have larger class size than last year, wonder if anyone could confirm.

[Anonymous User]

I think the summer classes shrank overall across the V100, but increased for some V10 firms which saw their business pick up last year. My V10 firm is expanding its summer class size but we were one of the firm that saw its business pick up last year. I think most of the firms outside the V10 reduced its class..

[Anonymous User]

Latham NY also increased their class size.

[Anonymous User]

My V30 is expanding its summer class as well, by about 25-30% probably.

[Anonymous User]

Partner I interviewed with at a V20 said their class size increased as well.

[Anonymous User]

Partner I interviewed with at a V20 said their class size increased as well.

[Anonymous User]

Yeah I think its really firm specific, not the overall trend. If I had to guess, it would depend on the firm's strength in practice areas

[Anonymous User]

I think the summer classes shrank overall across the V100, but increased for some V10 firms which saw their business pick up last year. My V10 firm is expanding its summer class size but we were one of the firm that saw its business pick up last year. I think most of the firms outside the V10 reduced its class..

Interesting, bc what I have picked up so far is a lot of the law firms are doing well during the pandemic - they are actually having a phenomenal year, contrary to what OCS believes.

[Anonymous User]

As a side-anecdote, I know of at least one NYC v10 that had a lot more acceptances than predicted and so their class size is going to be larger than expected/planned.

[Anonymous User]

As a side-anecdote, I know of at least one NYC v10 that had a lot more acceptances than predicted and so their class size is going to be larger than expected/planned.

Which firm? Also: does more-than-expected acceptances = higher rate of no-offers?

[Anonymous User]

As an associate of one of the above mentioned firms with an expanded class, this is simply a necessity at this point. It seems that, at least for firms in the V10, there is simply too much work to go around and everyone is underwater and busier than they have ever been in their careers. The number of new lateral hires is also crazy as there simply isn't enough mid levels which has caused a combination of juniors working up and seniors working down.

[Anonymous User]

As an associate of one of the above mentioned firms with an expanded class, this is simply a necessity at this point. It seems that, at least for firms in the V10, there is simply too much work to go around and everyone is underwater and busier than they have ever been in their careers. The number of new lateral hires is also crazy as there simply isn't enough mid levels which has caused a combination of juniors working up and seniors working down.

I don't understand why a firm being ranked on an arbitrary list would have any correlation with work during a pandemic. I think whether a firm is expanding class size will be very firm dependent based on firm group strengths (for example, strong restructuring groups, etc.).

Regardless, it's very interesting to be hearing about how well firms are doing. I wonder if that will result in another salary increase

[Anonymous User]

GDC increased their class size

[popcorn123]

As a side-anecdote, I know of at least one NYC v10 that had a lot more acceptances than predicted and so their class size is going to be larger than expected/planned.

Can you share which firm?

[Anonymous User]

.

[avenuem]

As an associate of one of the above mentioned firms with an expanded class, this is simply a necessity at this point. It seems that, at least for firms in the V10, there is simply too much work to go around and everyone is underwater and busier than they have ever been in their careers. The number of new lateral hires is also crazy as there simply isn't enough mid levels which has caused a combination of juniors working up and seniors working down.

I don't understand why a firm being ranked on an arbitrary list would have any correlation with work during a pandemic. I think whether a firm is expanding class size will be very firm dependent based on firm group strengths (for example, strong restructuring groups, etc.).

Regardless, it's very interesting to be hearing about how well firms are doing. I wonder if that will result in another salary increase

Your post radiates V80-V100 energy.

The firms that rank highly in the V10 are almost always doing better financially than lower ranked firms. Since you want a non-arbitrary list that proves the point, the 2020 AM 100 top 10 firms by the non-arbitrary measure of profits per partner were Wachtell (V3), K&E (V6), PW (V10), S&C (V5), Quinn (V-Idk-too-far-from-the-top-10-so-doesnt-matter), DPW (V7), STB (v8), Cravath (V1), Weil (V12), Skadden (V2).

A whopping 80% of the V10 are in the top 10 firms by profits per partner and by revenue per lawyer, and 30% of the V10 make up the top 10 firms by gross revenue. They make the prestige list for a reason, whether you like it or not.

And to keep this relevant to OP's question my V5 hasn't finished recruiting, so I know it's too soon to say across the board.

[Anonymous User]

At V5. The recruiting head told us in official channels that we're downsizing the class size this year.

[Anonymous User]

As an associate of one of the above mentioned firms with an expanded class, this is simply a necessity at this point. It seems that, at least for firms in the V10, there is simply too much work to go around and everyone is underwater and busier than they have ever been in their careers. The number of new lateral hires is also crazy as there simply isn't enough mid levels which has caused a combination of juniors working up and seniors working down.

I don't understand why a firm being ranked on an arbitrary list would have any correlation with work during a pandemic. I think whether a firm is expanding class size will be very firm dependent based on firm group strengths (for example, strong restructuring groups, etc.).

Regardless, it's very interesting to be hearing about how well firms are doing. I wonder if that will result in another salary increase

Your post radiates V80-V100 energy.

The firms that rank highly in the V10 are almost always doing better financially than lower ranked firms. Since you want a non-arbitrary list that proves the point, the 2020 AM 100 top 10 firms by the non-arbitrary measure of profits per partner were Wachtell (V3), K&E (V6), PW (V10), S&C (V5), Quinn (V-Idk-too-far-from-the-top-10-so-doesnt-matter), DPW (V7), STB (v8), Cravath (V1), Weil (V12), Skadden (V2).

A whopping 80% of the V10 are in the top 10 firms by profits per partner and by revenue per lawyer, and 30% of the V10 make up the top 10 firms by gross revenue. They make the prestige list for a reason, whether you like it or not.

And to keep this relevant to OP's question my V5 hasn't finished recruiting, so I know it's too soon to say across the board.

Different poster, but I fully understand that the V10 makes more profits per partner/lawyer and more gross revenue than almost all of the other firms. But the discussion was about expanding class sizes and being relatively busier than in other years. Wouldn't the matter of whether or not the firms are comparatively busier during the pandemic be a function of how much of the work is consolidating at those top firms vs. the rest of the V100? I interviewed with over 30 firms at OCI, and almost all of them reported having one of their best years in 2020 or just generally being much busier than usual. So yeah, the V10 is getting more work as a result of the pandemic, but so are a lot of firms outside of the V10.

[avenuem]

I don't understand why a firm being ranked on an arbitrary list would have any correlation with work during a pandemic. I think whether a firm is expanding class size will be very firm dependent based on firm group strengths (for example, strong restructuring groups, etc.).

Regardless, it's very interesting to be hearing about how well firms are doing. I wonder if that will result in another salary increase

Your post radiates V80-V100 energy.

The firms that rank highly in the V10 are almost always doing better financially than lower ranked firms. Since you want a non-arbitrary list that proves the point, the 2020 AM 100 top 10 firms by the non-arbitrary measure of profits per partner were Wachtell (V3), K&E (V6), PW (V10), S&C (V5), Quinn (V-Idk-too-far-from-the-top-10-so-doesnt-matter), DPW (V7), STB (v8), Cravath (V1), Weil (V12), Skadden (V2).

A whopping 80% of the V10 are in the top 10 firms by profits per partner and by revenue per lawyer, and 30% of the V10 make up the top 10 firms by gross revenue. They make the prestige list for a reason, whether you like it or not.

And to keep this relevant to OP's question my V5 hasn't finished recruiting, so I know it's too soon to say across the board.

Different poster, but I fully understand that the V10 makes more profits per partner/lawyer and more gross revenue than almost all of the other firms. But wouldn't the matter of whether or not the firms are comparatively busier during the pandemic be a function of how much of the work is consolidating at those top firms vs. the rest of the V100? I interviewed with over 30 firms at OCI, and almost all of them reported having one of their best years in 2020 or just generally being much busier than usual. So yeah, the V10 is getting more work as a result of the pandemic, but so are a lot of firms outside of the V10.

Back in my day we called that corporate puffery.

My point is that the V10 make a lot of money relative to everyone else (as proven by the AM Law reports), at least in part because they have a lot of profitable work relative to everyone else. So it is not surprising that they would continue to have a lot of work and money during the pandemic, relative to everyone else.

[Anonymous User]

I don't understand why a firm being ranked on an arbitrary list would have any correlation with work during a pandemic. I think whether a firm is expanding class size will be very firm dependent based on firm group strengths (for example, strong restructuring groups, etc.).

Regardless, it's very interesting to be hearing about how well firms are doing. I wonder if that will result in another salary increase

Your post radiates V80-V100 energy.

The firms that rank highly in the V10 are almost always doing better financially than lower ranked firms. Since you want a non-arbitrary list that proves the point, the 2020 AM 100 top 10 firms by the non-arbitrary measure of profits per partner were Wachtell (V3), K&E (V6), PW (V10), S&C (V5), Quinn (V-Idk-too-far-from-the-top-10-so-doesnt-matter), DPW (V7), STB (v8), Cravath (V1), Weil (V12), Skadden (V2).

A whopping 80% of the V10 are in the top 10 firms by profits per partner and by revenue per lawyer, and 30% of the V10 make up the top 10 firms by gross revenue. They make the prestige list for a reason, whether you like it or not.

And to keep this relevant to OP's question my V5 hasn't finished recruiting, so I know it's too soon to say across the board.

Different poster, but I fully understand that the V10 makes more profits per partner/lawyer and more gross revenue than almost all of the other firms. But wouldn't the matter of whether or not the firms are comparatively busier during the pandemic be a function of how much of the work is consolidating at those top firms vs. the rest of the V100? I interviewed with over 30 firms at OCI, and almost all of them reported having one of their best years in 2020 or just generally being much busier than usual. So yeah, the V10 is getting more work as a result of the pandemic, but so are a lot of firms outside of the V10.

Back in my day we called that corporate puffery.

My point is that the V10 make a lot of money relative to everyone else (as proven by the AM Law reports), at least in part because they have a lot of profitable work relative to everyone else. So it is not surprising that they would continue to have a lot of work and money during the pandemic, relative to everyone else.

Breaking News: COVID-19 actually killed every partner that didn't have the prestigious V10 immune-shield. Therefore, firms outside the V10 did not see any increase in work, leaving their worthless deals for the paralegals at the V10s to handle themselves during their lunch break.

P.S. Your post radiates napoleon complex energy.

[Anonymous User]

At V5. The recruiting head told us in official channels that we're downsizing the class size this year.

Sullivan?

[Anonymous User]

Accepted offer for Greenberg Traurig Miami. Was told that the firm-wide summer class shrunk from 90-100 last year to 45-50 this summer, so take that as you will

[Anonymous User]

Quinn (V-Idk-too-far-from-the-top-10-so-doesnt-matter)

Weil: gets a V12 mention
Quinn: *Angry V13 noises*

[Anonymous User]

As a side-anecdote, I know of at least one NYC v10 that had a lot more acceptances than predicted and so their class size is going to be larger than expected/planned.

Which firm? Also: does more-than-expected acceptances = higher rate of no-offers?

UGH. No idea but this almost gave me a heart attack