Firm Culture vs Practice Areas Forum

[Anonymous User]

I am deciding between two NYC firms right now. Debevoise is known for having a great culture and Latham has an emerging companies group which lends to itself better to start up exit options. I cannot decide which factor is more important in this decision. Debevoise seems great and has NYC prestige but I'm not sure how much of an issue working in fund formation, PE, or M&A is going to be for my preferred exit options. Latham also seems nice but isn't known as a lifestyle firm and the EC group is relatively small so I don't know how easy it would be to break into the group. Should I be prioritizing firm culture and then lateral from Deb later or go with Latham because they have the practice area that could get the exit options I want?

Edit: I should also note that I'm a first gen law student so I'm not entirely sure what work I would like doing the most. I have interned at a start up and thought it was interesting though.

[bajablast]

DO NOT pick a firm on lifestyle (it's big law, they're all sweat shops, just different varieties of sweat shops lol), pick the firm that has the best reputation in the practice group you're going to join

[Anonymous User]

DO NOT pick a firm on lifestyle (it's big law, they're all sweat shops, just different varieties of sweat shops lol), pick the firm that has the best reputation in the practice group you're going to join

In certain firms you likely will work more than other firms (look at simple PEP/RPL metrics vs billable hourly rates) and you should absolutely take that into account.

Though between these two firms, if I had to guess, things would be pretty close.

[Anonymous User]

neither of those firms are lifestyle firms lol

you will work hard at both. that is just the reality of NYC corporate law if your practice group is good at what you do. there is too much work to live and smell the roses, unless you luck into a really decent specialist group (but that's outside of all the core corporate groups you named)

unless you found the people exhausting and wholly incompatible, you should just go with the best reputation/exit ops. most of us only last so long in biglaw anyways. I like my firm's "culture", but I don't think culture should be dispositive unless you really think you wouldn't be able to last even a few years with the people in another firm or group on a fit basis. also, maybe if someone is legitimately agnostic about what they want to do within lit/corp, in which case group distinctions are w/e if the firms are generally equivalent.

don't go anywhere with the intention of lateraling. if you want to end up somewhere (assuming they're all just nyc corporate), start there from day 1.

[Anonymous User]

I tend to disagree -- how you mesh with the partners in your group is so incredibly important and probably the biggest factor in determining how long you will last in biglaw and how much you learn. That being said, it's incredibly difficult to determine based on call backs and interviews (not to mention each firm has varying personalities within) -- but it's so important it's probably still worth deciding.

[Sackboy]

I tend to disagree -- how you mesh with the partners in your group is so incredibly important and probably the biggest factor in determining how long you will last in biglaw and how much you learn. That being said, it's incredibly difficult to determine based on call backs and interviews (not to mention each firm has varying personalities within) -- but it's so important it's probably still worth deciding.

It's not very difficult. It's impossible, outside of interviewing with a literal screamer who puts it on display. Most groups, even many specialist groups, are 20+ people in many big firms these days. That's a lot of folks to work with. When you start approaching 50-60 people, you probably won't even know everyone in your group, and you'll definitely have ample opportunities to dodge the bad ones if you're remotely proactive.

[bajablast]

DO NOT pick a firm on lifestyle (it's big law, they're all sweat shops, just different varieties of sweat shops lol), pick the firm that has the best reputation in the practice group you're going to join

In certain firms you likely will work more than other firms (look at simple PEP/RPL metrics vs billable hourly rates) and you should absolutely take that into account.

Though between these two firms, if I had to guess, things would be pretty close.

That metric won't tell you the lifestyle/culture of a firm bub, it will tell you how much you bill (which could represent many things, like the volume of work the firm has, not whether the firm allows you to work from home or other lifestyle factors).

[bajablast]

I tend to disagree -- how you mesh with the partners in your group is so incredibly important and probably the biggest factor in determining how long you will last in biglaw and how much you learn. That being said, it's incredibly difficult to determine based on call backs and interviews (not to mention each firm has varying personalities within) -- but it's so important it's probably still worth deciding.

It's not very difficult. It's impossible, outside of interviewing with a literal screamer who puts it on display. Most groups, even many specialist groups, are 20+ people in many big firms these days. That's a lot of folks to work with. When you start approaching 50-60 people, you probably won't even know everyone in your group, and you'll definitely have ample opportunities to dodge the bad ones if you're remotely proactive.

TCR. Culture/lifestyle matters of course, but determining the culture can be difficult/impossible + the expectations of the partner you work for have a bigger impact on your life than the culture of your firm as a whole