Columbia Law WIP/EIP Jan 2021 Forum

[Anonymous User]

Just a cautionary word; don't urge the firms that you have an exploding offer if you are in the "wait-list" pile; I told Ropes/Cleary I have an expiring offer yesterday and got dinged today. Given their very high CB-offer ratio from previous years, I think this is a good warning.

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

[Anonymous User]

Just a cautionary word; don't urge the firms that you have an exploding offer if you are in the "wait-list" pile; I told Ropes/Cleary I have an expiring offer yesterday and got dinged today. Given their very high CB-offer ratio from previous years, I think this is a good warning.

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

They don't seem to have their shit together. They've taken forever on everything.

[Anonymous User]

.

[Anonymous User]

Just a cautionary word; don't urge the firms that you have an exploding offer if you are in the "wait-list" pile; I told Ropes/Cleary I have an expiring offer yesterday and got dinged today. Given their very high CB-offer ratio from previous years, I think this is a good warning.

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

They don't seem to have their shit together. They've taken forever on everything.

Yep. I had to send them multiple emails to get them to send me my list of interviewers & link (which I finally got one or two hours before the interview). Also exclusively interested in lit and they had me interviewing with almost entirely transactional people. Little things, but man.

[Anonymous User]

Just a cautionary word; don't urge the firms that you have an exploding offer if you are in the "wait-list" pile; I told Ropes/Cleary I have an expiring offer yesterday and got dinged today. Given their very high CB-offer ratio from previous years, I think this is a good warning.

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

They don't seem to have their shit together. They've taken forever on everything.

Yep. I had to send them multiple emails to get them to send me my list of interviewers & link (which I finally got one or two hours before the interview). Also exclusively interested in lit and they had me interviewing with almost entirely transactional people. Little things, but man.

Agreed, Cleary seemed to be all over the place this year. Honestly wasn't the best look.

[Anonymous User]

Just a cautionary word; don't urge the firms that you have an exploding offer if you are in the "wait-list" pile; I told Ropes/Cleary I have an expiring offer yesterday and got dinged today. Given their very high CB-offer ratio from previous years, I think this is a good warning.

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

They don't seem to have their shit together. They've taken forever on everything.

Yep. I had to send them multiple emails to get them to send me my list of interviewers & link (which I finally got one or two hours before the interview). Also exclusively interested in lit and they had me interviewing with almost entirely transactional people. Little things, but man.

Agreed, Cleary seemed to be all over the place this year. Honestly wasn't the best look.

honestly I would probably pick Freshfields over Cleary at this point

[Anonymous User]

Just a cautionary word; don't urge the firms that you have an exploding offer if you are in the "wait-list" pile; I told Ropes/Cleary I have an expiring offer yesterday and got dinged today. Given their very high CB-offer ratio from previous years, I think this is a good warning.

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

They don't seem to have their shit together. They've taken forever on everything.

Yep. I had to send them multiple emails to get them to send me my list of interviewers & link (which I finally got one or two hours before the interview). Also exclusively interested in lit and they had me interviewing with almost entirely transactional people. Little things, but man.

Agreed, Cleary seemed to be all over the place this year. Honestly wasn't the best look.

I also met with people in practice groups I wasn't interested in. They didn't send me who I was interviewing with until about an hour and a half before. Them and Debevoise were the two most disorganized firms I dealt with this process.

[Anonymous User]

Just a cautionary word; don't urge the firms that you have an exploding offer if you are in the "wait-list" pile; I told Ropes/Cleary I have an expiring offer yesterday and got dinged today. Given their very high CB-offer ratio from previous years, I think this is a good warning.

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

They don't seem to have their shit together. They've taken forever on everything.

Yep. I had to send them multiple emails to get them to send me my list of interviewers & link (which I finally got one or two hours before the interview). Also exclusively interested in lit and they had me interviewing with almost entirely transactional people. Little things, but man.

Agreed, Cleary seemed to be all over the place this year. Honestly wasn't the best look.

I also met with people in practice groups I wasn't interested in. They didn't send me who I was interviewing with until about an hour and a half before. Them and Debevoise were the two most disorganized firms I dealt with this process.

Agreed re: Cleary (I didn't know who I was interviewing with, and it took forever to contact recruiting), but I had the opposite experience with Debevoise (received an email before my CB, invited to a pre-CB zoom meeting, received an email post-CB, and I was assigned to exactly who I wanted to interview with). I'm sure the firms are totally swamped this year, especially with the remote nature of things, so I'm not holding it against Cleary.

[Anonymous User]

Just a cautionary word; don't urge the firms that you have an exploding offer if you are in the "wait-list" pile; I told Ropes/Cleary I have an expiring offer yesterday and got dinged today. Given their very high CB-offer ratio from previous years, I think this is a good warning.

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

They don't seem to have their shit together. They've taken forever on everything.

Yep. I had to send them multiple emails to get them to send me my list of interviewers & link (which I finally got one or two hours before the interview). Also exclusively interested in lit and they had me interviewing with almost entirely transactional people. Little things, but man.

Agreed, Cleary seemed to be all over the place this year. Honestly wasn't the best look.

I also met with people in practice groups I wasn't interested in. They didn't send me who I was interviewing with until about an hour and a half before. Them and Debevoise were the two most disorganized firms I dealt with this process.

Agreed re: Cleary (I didn't know who I was interviewing with, and it took forever to contact recruiting), but I had the opposite experience with Debevoise (received an email before my CB, invited to a pre-CB zoom meeting, received an email post-CB, and I was assigned to exactly who I wanted to interview with). I'm sure the firms are totally swamped this year, especially with the remote nature of things, so I'm not holding it against Cleary.

Weil was very organized throughout this whole process. Their recruiting department was highly responsive, and they placed me with all my interviewers. Debevoise did the same. Cleary has been declining for the past few years and the way they handled recruitment reflects that. They were also, oddly, one of the few firms to not do any pre-OCI hiring.

[Anonymous User]

I told Cleary I had an expiring offer and they straight up never responded

They don't seem to have their shit together. They've taken forever on everything.

Yep. I had to send them multiple emails to get them to send me my list of interviewers & link (which I finally got one or two hours before the interview). Also exclusively interested in lit and they had me interviewing with almost entirely transactional people. Little things, but man.

Agreed, Cleary seemed to be all over the place this year. Honestly wasn't the best look.

I also met with people in practice groups I wasn't interested in. They didn't send me who I was interviewing with until about an hour and a half before. Them and Debevoise were the two most disorganized firms I dealt with this process.

Agreed re: Cleary (I didn't know who I was interviewing with, and it took forever to contact recruiting), but I had the opposite experience with Debevoise (received an email before my CB, invited to a pre-CB zoom meeting, received an email post-CB, and I was assigned to exactly who I wanted to interview with). I'm sure the firms are totally swamped this year, especially with the remote nature of things, so I'm not holding it against Cleary.

Weil was very organized throughout this whole process. Their recruiting department was highly responsive, and they placed me with all my interviewers. Debevoise did the same. Cleary has been declining for the past few years and the way they handled recruitment reflects that. They were also, oddly, one of the few firms to not do any pre-OCI hiring.

is it true that they forced lit associates into corp last year. also heard they offered some lit junior associates public interest fellowship for a year, because there werent enough cases going around

[Anonymous User]

Is this Cleary? And can someone confirm, please?

[Anonymous User]

Is this Cleary? And can someone confirm, please?

yes that is cleary. that was true. no idea if that's still true this year, so you better confirm with the firm

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

got 7 cbs and struck out. The pain is real.

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

got 7 cbs and struck out. The pain is real.

Sorry to hear this! Are the CBs all for big NYC firms? When is it too late to wait?

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

Same. I'm thinking it was because I didn't have very specific "why this firm" spiels or interview questions prepared, so maybe it seemed like I was using the firms as backups and wasn't very interested. Still a shock to go in with a 3.6+, bid almost entirely NYC, and almost strike out.

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

Wait, isn’t 3.6 a really good GPA?? Like at least top 20% right? As a 1L, I find this terrifying to hear because my grades are quite a bit lower...Do you guys know what is going on with firms this year? Is this hiring trend here to stay??

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

Wait, isn’t 3.6 a really good GPA?? Like at least top 20% right? As a 1L, I find this terrifying to hear because my grades are quite a bit lower...Do you guys know what is going on with firms this year? Is this hiring trend here to stay??

2L grades inflated by the upper year curve. We were p/f in spring.

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

Wait, isn’t 3.6 a really good GPA?? Like at least top 20% right? As a 1L, I find this terrifying to hear because my grades are quite a bit lower...Do you guys know what is going on with firms this year? Is this hiring trend here to stay??

2L grades inflated by the upper year curve. We were p/f in spring.

3.6, after inflated by upper-year curve, should still be top 35-40% at least.

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

Same. I'm thinking it was because I didn't have very specific "why this firm" spiels or interview questions prepared, so maybe it seemed like I was using the firms as backups and wasn't very interested. Still a shock to go in with a 3.6+, bid almost entirely NYC, and almost strike out.

This is definitely why. You can't go into a job interview without being able to articulate why you even want the job in the first place. You also always need to have questions. Some interviews will be you asking more questions than they will be asking you.

[Anonymous User]

People really need to start breaking out their GPA by 1l/2L because the 2L curve really inflates it.

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

Same. I'm thinking it was because I didn't have very specific "why this firm" spiels or interview questions prepared, so maybe it seemed like I was using the firms as backups and wasn't very interested. Still a shock to go in with a 3.6+, bid almost entirely NYC, and almost strike out.

This is definitely why. You can't go into a job interview without being able to articulate why you even want the job in the first place. You also always need to have questions. Some interviews will be you asking more questions than they will be asking you.

Yep. I thought it was better to veer on the overly general rather than overly specific, out of fear of sounding weirdly gunnerish or putting my interviewer on the spot with a question - This was a HUGE mistake. FYI to 1Ls. (I was 3.6x after 1L as well.)

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

Same. I'm thinking it was because I didn't have very specific "why this firm" spiels or interview questions prepared, so maybe it seemed like I was using the firms as backups and wasn't very interested. Still a shock to go in with a 3.6+, bid almost entirely NYC, and almost strike out.

This is definitely why. You can't go into a job interview without being able to articulate why you even want the job in the first place. You also always need to have questions. Some interviews will be you asking more questions than they will be asking you.

Yep. I thought it was better to veer on the overly general rather than overly specific, out of fear of sounding weirdly gunnerish or putting my interviewer on the spot with a question - This was a HUGE mistake. FYI to 1Ls. (I was 3.6x after 1L as well.)

You don't need very specific "why XYZ firm answers" that involve in depth research into deals or your interviewer's life story. You just need good answers to the basics: Why this city, what practice groups are you interested in, and why whatever assignment system/summer program system appeals to you. Unless you are asking something very odd, you aren't going to put your interviewer on the spot.

The best interviews are natural conversations about the work you've done in law school or before law school and the work done at the firm. They aren't interrogations nor are they filled with non-sequiters about totally random things, as that usually means the interviewer has lost interest and made a decision already.

[Anonymous User]

Is anyone starting to panic with no job offers?

I mass mailed secondary markets I have any ties to, I applied through firms’ online portals, did WIP, got 8 callbacks, and still haven’t heard back from a single firm. 3.4GPA and thought I was safe to find at least some form of big law, but I’m thinking about looking for judicial internships now..

Definitely a tough cycle; I was rejected from all the less grade-sensitive NYC offices which I thought I had a shot, such as Ropes. I had a 3.6 GPA (not stellar but still decent); maybe this has to do with my non-citizen status.

Same. I'm thinking it was because I didn't have very specific "why this firm" spiels or interview questions prepared, so maybe it seemed like I was using the firms as backups and wasn't very interested. Still a shock to go in with a 3.6+, bid almost entirely NYC, and almost strike out.

This is definitely why. You can't go into a job interview without being able to articulate why you even want the job in the first place. You also always need to have questions. Some interviews will be you asking more questions than they will be asking you.

Yep. I thought it was better to veer on the overly general rather than overly specific, out of fear of sounding weirdly gunnerish or putting my interviewer on the spot with a question - This was a HUGE mistake. FYI to 1Ls. (I was 3.6x after 1L as well.)

You don't need very specific "why XYZ firm answers" that involve in depth research into deals or your interviewer's life story. You just need good answers to the basics: Why this city, what practice groups are you interested in, and why whatever assignment system/summer program system appeals to you. Unless you are asking something very odd, you aren't going to put your interviewer on the spot.

The best interviews are natural conversations about the work you've done in law school or before law school and the work done at the firm. They aren't interrogations nor are they filled with non-sequiters about totally random things, as that usually means the interviewer has lost interest and made a decision already.

Yeah, but you definitely need a solid amount of talking points about work the firm has done that won't also apply to another firm you talk to. I came in thinking having a solid narrative for myself, with a general understanding of practice areas, Vault rankings, and assignment systems was enough - From my experience at least, it definitely wasn't. Could have been something totally different, but from talking to career services & people on here, I think overly general answers were the most likely culprit. I've seen speculation that this year, specific answers were more important than in previous years. But I'd really advise 1Ls to make sure they are able to be specific and sell the firm that they are interested in *their firm* in particular.