First-year biglaw associate-question about responsiveness? Forum

[Anonymous User]

I just started working at a biglaw firm in a non-NYC major market, and I am overthinking everything. I have what I’m sure you all will think is a ridiculous question about responsiveness.

I know associate responsiveness is super important, but just how responsive do I need to be? Do I need to check my phone at stoplights during my commute (obviously post pandemic)? Do I need to bring my phone into the shower or with me every time I take my dog out for two minutes to pee? Or is it acceptable to generally respond within say, 15-20 minutes? 30 minutes? Do y’all refresh emails on walks/jogs? What if I’m at a doctor’s appointment? Is it acceptable to say “I’m at the doctor, I’ll start on this ASAP”?

When is it acceptable to go to bed if you’re not actively working on a matter? 11 pm? (I’m at an early-ish to bed, early-ish to rise firm). Do I need to leave my phone on loud all night?

I’m sorry if this is a ridiculous question. I’m just really nervous about this issue for some reason.

[deference]

I think responding within 15-20 min of receiving the email during your typical facetime work hours is reasonable and typical for a first year. I won't expect that type of response during early morning, evening (say past 8 p.m.) or the wee hours. Yes, you are a highly paid workhorse, but I still expect you to pee, poop, eat, sleep and try to stay healthy, all done within a reasonable framework.

For any fire drill or urgent matters that requires a response, you'll either have already expected it or your senior would have found a way to let you know about it. Obviously, you'll be expected to be responsive during active deals/litigation and I'd expect you to sleep with your buzzer on.

The more you work, really in any high stress white collar industry, the more you realize learn which matters can wait. Degree of responsiveness is a time management and critical thinking skill that is obtained through experience. This instinct you'll have to learn to pick up, especially if you're a naturally anxious person. Also, any well managed team would have a safety net just in case something falls through the cracks.

[PrinterInk]

Think about the golden rule—if you were asking someone to do the work, how quickly would you want someone to respond?

If the work needs to be done in the next hour, you should respond immediately. If you have a week to do it, not as urgent.

[wanderinglawyer]

I think it's worth establishing a reputation for responsiveness early - you can back off later once you have people's trust. But also you will naturally develop relationships and patterns with those you work with over time so you will learn what they expect and they can learn your preferred schedule. Also it's not always the worst to have a night owl associate turn drafts later to an early rise partner who can review and turn back by the time the associate is up. But for other partners, they may prefer associates who are on their schedule and go to bed early. You can also preemptively say I'm out of pocket for an hour/until X time but will be available to handle anything that comes up afterwards. Also note the difference between acknowledging a task ("Got it" "Will do") within a reasonable period of time (say 30 min - hour in the evening when there is no fire drill) and actually doing it - the acknowledgement is low stress but makes you look responsive, and it very well may be a thing that can wait to be done until the next day -- the partner just might want it out of their brain and on your plate. Unless there is urgency (which you will probably know about anyways), you should generally be able to finish your run or spin class or whatever before responding and not be constantly worried about your phone.

[emc91]

Thank you for the responses.

For things like doctor’s appointments, is that something one should put on their calendar and let people know about ahead of time? I know there are times where I might have to reschedule, but I have a chronic health condition that requires fairly regular checkups and tests. It’s well managed and doesn’t interfere with my work at all, but for some reason I have this horrible fear about being not responding for a bit because I’m mid-MRI and getting yelled at.

[emc91]

Think about the golden rule—if you were asking someone to do the work, how quickly would you want someone to respond?

If the work needs to be done in the next hour, you should respond immediately. If you have a week to do it, not as urgent.

I guess I’m more asking for a definition of “immediately.” If I have to respond truly within seconds, well that would mean I should take my phone into the shower and into the bathroom, which seems like a bit much?

[Anonymous User]

I'm also a first year, and we were told to at least acknowledge emails within 15-20 minutes of getting them (even if it's just a "got it" email). I bring my phone with me when I'm walking my dog or cooking dinner (or generally doing anything away from my home office) so that I can check emails as they come in and respond if needed. Definitely do not check your phone when you're driving (even at a stoplight)—there will never, ever be an email that is worth risking your life or those of other drivers.

[wanderinglawyer]

Thank you for the responses.

For things like doctor’s appointments, is that something one should put on their calendar and let people know about ahead of time? I know there are times where I might have to reschedule, but I have a chronic health condition that requires fairly regular checkups and tests. It’s well managed and doesn’t interfere with my work at all, but for some reason I have this horrible fear about being not responding for a bit because I’m mid-MRI and getting yelled at.

If I were you, once I was integrated into a case/team/group/partner, I would probably just let them know exactly this - you have a chronic health condition that is well managed but does require regular checkups, including MRIs where you are unable to answer for a somewhat extended period, and you will do your best to schedule around work commitments and/or reschedule as necessary. Then ask them if there is anything else they would like you to do to help manage the workflow - like let their assistant know if it's a long appointment or create a special calendar invite so they are aware etc.

[Elston Gunn]

Thank you for the responses.

For things like doctor’s appointments, is that something one should put on their calendar and let people know about ahead of time? I know there are times where I might have to reschedule, but I have a chronic health condition that requires fairly regular checkups and tests. It’s well managed and doesn’t interfere with my work at all, but for some reason I have this horrible fear about being not responding for a bit because I’m mid-MRI and getting yelled at.

If I were you, once I was integrated into a case/team/group/partner, I would probably just let them know exactly this - you have a chronic health condition that is well managed but does require regular checkups, including MRIs where you are unable to answer for a somewhat extended period, and you will do your best to schedule around work commitments and/or reschedule as necessary. Then ask them if there is anything else they would like you to do to help manage the workflow - like let their assistant know if it's a long appointment or create a special calendar invite so they are aware etc.

This is the ideal way to handle it, but if you’re uncomfortable, you may be able to get away with just not saying anything. Depending on how dispersed your workflow is—ie whether you’re working for one or two partners who fully understand what you “should” be up to or not—people understand that there are meetings and you cant necessarily respond immediately during all times of the day. I had a regular therapist’s appointment for 4 years in big law and never told anyone about it except to put that I was busy on my calendar. Of course your situation is a little different because you can’t glance at your phone while getting an MRI. How long do they normally take?

[emc91]

Thank you for the responses.

For things like doctor’s appointments, is that something one should put on their calendar and let people know about ahead of time? I know there are times where I might have to reschedule, but I have a chronic health condition that requires fairly regular checkups and tests. It’s well managed and doesn’t interfere with my work at all, but for some reason I have this horrible fear about being not responding for a bit because I’m mid-MRI and getting yelled at.

If I were you, once I was integrated into a case/team/group/partner, I would probably just let them know exactly this - you have a chronic health condition that is well managed but does require regular checkups, including MRIs where you are unable to answer for a somewhat extended period, and you will do your best to schedule around work commitments and/or reschedule as necessary. Then ask them if there is anything else they would like you to do to help manage the workflow - like let their assistant know if it's a long appointment or create a special calendar invite so they are aware etc.

This is the ideal way to handle it, but if you’re uncomfortable, you may be able to get away with just not saying anything. Depending on how dispersed your workflow is—ie whether you’re working for one or two partners who fully understand what you “should” be up to or not—people understand that there are meetings and you cant necessarily respond immediately during all times of the day. I had a regular therapist’s appointment for 4 years in big law and never told anyone about it except to put that I was busy on my calendar. Of course your situation is a little different because you can’t glance at your phone while getting an MRI. How long do they normally take?

They usually take 40 minutes or so, but with check in and such, I’m out of pocket for 60 minutesish. My doctor’s building has basically no cell service.

[Elston Gunn]

Thank you for the responses.

For things like doctor’s appointments, is that something one should put on their calendar and let people know about ahead of time? I know there are times where I might have to reschedule, but I have a chronic health condition that requires fairly regular checkups and tests. It’s well managed and doesn’t interfere with my work at all, but for some reason I have this horrible fear about being not responding for a bit because I’m mid-MRI and getting yelled at.

If I were you, once I was integrated into a case/team/group/partner, I would probably just let them know exactly this - you have a chronic health condition that is well managed but does require regular checkups, including MRIs where you are unable to answer for a somewhat extended period, and you will do your best to schedule around work commitments and/or reschedule as necessary. Then ask them if there is anything else they would like you to do to help manage the workflow - like let their assistant know if it's a long appointment or create a special calendar invite so they are aware etc.

This is the ideal way to handle it, but if you’re uncomfortable, you may be able to get away with just not saying anything. Depending on how dispersed your workflow is—ie whether you’re working for one or two partners who fully understand what you “should” be up to or not—people understand that there are meetings and you cant necessarily respond immediately during all times of the day. I had a regular therapist’s appointment for 4 years in big law and never told anyone about it except to put that I was busy on my calendar. Of course your situation is a little different because you can’t glance at your phone while getting an MRI. How long do they normally take?

They usually take 40 minutes or so, but with check in and such, I’m out of pocket for 60 minutesish. My doctor’s building has basically no cell service.

If you’re comfortable telling people—and I don’t think you would face any negative consequences at all—you’re better off being transparent. But if you don’t want to, being out of pocket for an hour really shouldn’t be that big a deal, especially if you have your secretary getting your calls. May depend on your practice and the people you work with though.

[glitched]

Any legit firm has an internal clock on their emails and phone that tracks the associates (and even some junior partners) responsiveness times. If it ever hits midnight, you're going to automatically get the talk.

[attorney589753]

Think about the golden rule—if you were asking someone to do the work, how quickly would you want someone to respond?

If the work needs to be done in the next hour, you should respond immediately. If you have a week to do it, not as urgent.

I guess I’m more asking for a definition of “immediately.” If I have to respond truly within seconds, well that would mean I should take my phone into the shower and into the bathroom, which seems like a bit much?

Sometimes you will be staffed on a big deal that is signing or closing, or a major project, and all team members are working around the clock. In that situation people would expect 100% focus and you should basically be sitting at your computer and monitoring the emails/messages/phone calls that come in.

I guess otherwise is a huge YMMV depending on firm and practice group (maybe providing details will help you get answers) but in general, I think ordinary course emails with ordinary course deadlines (days, not hours) can get a "Will do" and that's fine. Doesn't need to happen within 5 or even 20 minutes.

[UnassumingUsername]

Any legit firm has an internal clock on their emails and phone that tracks the associates (and even some junior partners) responsiveness times. If it ever hits midnight, you're going to automatically get the talk.

What on Earth do you mean by "midnight."

Regardless of your presumed inside knowledge, I wouldn't be surprised at all about what the firm(s) track(s). But I doubt someone would be canned if they do not respond within 15 minutes to every email. Do you know how inefficient it is to constantly respond to emails while in the middle of working?

I say the gold standard to shoot for is 5 minutes. If the email is addressed to you, no more than 15 minutes unless the sender knows you are "busy." Otherwise, 30 minutes might be fine depending on the email. But if you're not busy, you better respond before that or perhaps anticipate what the next steps are with respect to non-urgent emails and do that prior to responding.

[Definitely Not North]

Any legit firm has an internal clock on their emails and phone that tracks the associates (and even some junior partners) responsiveness times. If it ever hits midnight, you're going to automatically get the talk.

What on Earth do you mean by "midnight."

Regardless of your presumed inside knowledge, I wouldn't be surprised at all about what the firm(s) track(s). But I doubt someone would be canned if they do not respond within 15 minutes to every email. Do you know how inefficient it is to constantly respond to emails while in the middle of working?

pretty sure it was a joke

[Performance1]

I just started working at a biglaw firm in a non-NYC major market, and I am overthinking everything. I have what I’m sure you all will think is a ridiculous question about responsiveness.

I know associate responsiveness is super important, but just how responsive do I need to be? Do I need to check my phone at stoplights during my commute (obviously post pandemic)? Do I need to bring my phone into the shower or with me every time I take my dog out for two minutes to pee? Or is it acceptable to generally respond within say, 15-20 minutes? 30 minutes? Do y’all refresh emails on walks/jogs? What if I’m at a doctor’s appointment? Is it acceptable to say “I’m at the doctor, I’ll start on this ASAP”?

When is it acceptable to go to bed if you’re not actively working on a matter? 11 pm? (I’m at an early-ish to bed, early-ish to rise firm). Do I need to leave my phone on loud all night?

I’m sorry if this is a ridiculous question. I’m just really nervous about this issue for some reason.

Step back and ask yourself, is this worth it? Seriously, this is making you completely neurotic. Was law school worth it for this? You're young and this is still America. You can still do something that will make you happy.

[Anonymous User]

I just started working at a biglaw firm in a non-NYC major market, and I am overthinking everything. I have what I’m sure you all will think is a ridiculous question about responsiveness.

I know associate responsiveness is super important, but just how responsive do I need to be? Do I need to check my phone at stoplights during my commute (obviously post pandemic)? Do I need to bring my phone into the shower or with me every time I take my dog out for two minutes to pee? Or is it acceptable to generally respond within say, 15-20 minutes? 30 minutes? Do y’all refresh emails on walks/jogs? What if I’m at a doctor’s appointment? Is it acceptable to say “I’m at the doctor, I’ll start on this ASAP”?

When is it acceptable to go to bed if you’re not actively working on a matter? 11 pm? (I’m at an early-ish to bed, early-ish to rise firm). Do I need to leave my phone on loud all night?

I’m sorry if this is a ridiculous question. I’m just really nervous about this issue for some reason.

Step back and ask yourself, is this worth it? Seriously, this is making you completely neurotic. Was law school worth it for this? You're young and this is still America. You can still do something that will make you happy.

Seriously. I'm only 6 weeks in myself and already know this wasn't worth it. You know it's bad when you miss bar prep.

[gregfootball2001]

I have my cell phone set so only my work email is "pushed" (is that the correct term?) to my phone automatically, so if my phone dings, I know it's a work email. This means I don't have to constantly refresh and look if new emails have come in.

[Anonymous User]

Thank you for the responses.

For things like doctor’s appointments, is that something one should put on their calendar and let people know about ahead of time? I know there are times where I might have to reschedule, but I have a chronic health condition that requires fairly regular checkups and tests. It’s well managed and doesn’t interfere with my work at all, but for some reason I have this horrible fear about being not responding for a bit because I’m mid-MRI and getting yelled at.

If I were you, once I was integrated into a case/team/group/partner, I would probably just let them know exactly this - you have a chronic health condition that is well managed but does require regular checkups, including MRIs where you are unable to answer for a somewhat extended period, and you will do your best to schedule around work commitments and/or reschedule as necessary. Then ask them if there is anything else they would like you to do to help manage the workflow - like let their assistant know if it's a long appointment or create a special calendar invite so they are aware etc.

This is the ideal way to handle it, but if you’re uncomfortable, you may be able to get away with just not saying anything. Depending on how dispersed your workflow is—ie whether you’re working for one or two partners who fully understand what you “should” be up to or not—people understand that there are meetings and you cant necessarily respond immediately during all times of the day. I had a regular therapist’s appointment for 4 years in big law and never told anyone about it except to put that I was busy on my calendar. Of course your situation is a little different because you can’t glance at your phone while getting an MRI. How long do they normally take?

Was actually wondering about this. I just started therapy through an online service with a therapist I really like. I’ll be starting as a first year at a biglaw firm in a non-NYC major market.

Do you have any other tips for how to balance therapy with a biglaw schedule? I really don’t want to have to give it up because of my job, and I am honestly a little apprehensive about blocking out an hour in my schedule as “busy” just after starting. Any help would be much appreciated!

If it helps, I won’t be in a corporate/M&A practice either. I’ll be in a regulatory practice group.

[thenewguy]

Try not be neurotic though easier said than done. Just use judgment. If you are in the middle of a busy transaction you should give people a heads up if you need to be out of pocket. People will not be pleased if an urgent closing related task comes up and they hear for the first time that you are unavailable.

For ordinary course type days just give the "will do" as soon as you can. Given that you will be available most of the time and not out of pocket, that "will do" will be pretty quick and you will build a reputation for responsiveness.

But at the end of the day for most tasks no one will notice the difference between a "will do" that comes in in 20 minutes vs. 60 minutes. Once they fire off the email to you they are likely just on to the next thing of their busy day. If half the day goes by and you still haven't responded and they think their email went into a black hole, then that is a different story that may annoy some people.

[Elston Gunn]

Was actually wondering about this. I just started therapy through an online service with a therapist I really like. I’ll be starting as a first year at a biglaw firm in a non-NYC major market.

Do you have any other tips for how to balance therapy with a biglaw schedule? I really don’t want to have to give it up because of my job, and I am honestly a little apprehensive about blocking out an hour in my schedule as “busy” just after starting. Any help would be much appreciated!

If it helps, I won’t be in a corporate/M&A practice either. I’ll be in a regulatory practice group.

I’ll caveat this by saying everything in Biglaw will vary by firm and practice group. Some of the below may not be applicable, though you should also consider how much of your mental health you’re willing to sacrifice if you do end up working at a place where you can’t make this work.

In a regulatory group, which will have fewer all hands on deck emergencies, I really don’t think it will be a big deal. I just came into work late one day a week and no one ever mentioned it. I had good reviews all the time and no one ever suggested I was unresponsive or went AWOL unexpectedly. It should be even easier in a post-COVID world where facetime should be less important. While there are a lot of bad things about Biglaw, the nice thing is that — with notable exceptions! — people treat you like an adult and don’t worry about micromanaging your schedule so much as long as you’re doing your work. If they do notice you always being out/busy at a particular time each week, they probably will just assume you are in therapy tbh and not say anything. If you search around this board you’ll see that seeing a therapist is not at all uncommon in Biglaw.

Early on, before you’ve made a good reputation for yourself, I’d suggest keeping an eye on your notifications while in the session if possible, and even responding with some quick will dos if necessary. If there’s something urgent, you may need to cut short a meeting or two. But once you’ve established yourself, if people absolutely need you to respond to something in under an hour, they should be calling you.

[Anonymous User]

Was actually wondering about this. I just started therapy through an online service with a therapist I really like. I’ll be starting as a first year at a biglaw firm in a non-NYC major market.

Do you have any other tips for how to balance therapy with a biglaw schedule? I really don’t want to have to give it up because of my job, and I am honestly a little apprehensive about blocking out an hour in my schedule as “busy” just after starting. Any help would be much appreciated!

If it helps, I won’t be in a corporate/M&A practice either. I’ll be in a regulatory practice group.

I’ll caveat this by saying everything in Biglaw will vary by firm and practice group. Some of the below may not be applicable, though you should also consider how much of your mental health you’re willing to sacrifice if you do end up working at a place where you can’t make this work.

In a regulatory group, which will have fewer all hands on deck emergencies, I really don’t think it will be a big deal. I just came into work late one day a week and no one ever mentioned it. I had good reviews all the time and no one ever suggested I was unresponsive or went AWOL unexpectedly. It should be even easier in a post-COVID world where facetime should be less important. While there are a lot of bad things about Biglaw, the nice thing is that — with notable exceptions! — people treat you like an adult and don’t worry about micromanaging your schedule so much as long as you’re doing your work. If they do notice you always being out/busy at a particular time each week, they probably will just assume you are in therapy tbh and not say anything. If you search around this board you’ll see that seeing a therapist is not at all uncommon in Biglaw.

Early on, before you’ve made a good reputation for yourself, I’d suggest keeping an eye on your notifications while in the session if possible, and even responding with some quick will dos if necessary. If there’s something urgent, you may need to cut short a meeting or two. But once you’ve established yourself, if people absolutely need you to respond to something in under an hour, they should be calling you.

Anon whose question you answered here. Thanks much for this, it’s very helpful. Currently doing sessions in the afternoon, but I do think moving them to the morning may make it easier depending on the schedules of the people in my group. Reassuring to hear that it should be possible though—thanks again for the response!

[Elston Gunn]

Was actually wondering about this. I just started therapy through an online service with a therapist I really like. I’ll be starting as a first year at a biglaw firm in a non-NYC major market.

Do you have any other tips for how to balance therapy with a biglaw schedule? I really don’t want to have to give it up because of my job, and I am honestly a little apprehensive about blocking out an hour in my schedule as “busy” just after starting. Any help would be much appreciated!

If it helps, I won’t be in a corporate/M&A practice either. I’ll be in a regulatory practice group.

I’ll caveat this by saying everything in Biglaw will vary by firm and practice group. Some of the below may not be applicable, though you should also consider how much of your mental health you’re willing to sacrifice if you do end up working at a place where you can’t make this work.

In a regulatory group, which will have fewer all hands on deck emergencies, I really don’t think it will be a big deal. I just came into work late one day a week and no one ever mentioned it. I had good reviews all the time and no one ever suggested I was unresponsive or went AWOL unexpectedly. It should be even easier in a post-COVID world where facetime should be less important. While there are a lot of bad things about Biglaw, the nice thing is that — with notable exceptions! — people treat you like an adult and don’t worry about micromanaging your schedule so much as long as you’re doing your work. If they do notice you always being out/busy at a particular time each week, they probably will just assume you are in therapy tbh and not say anything. If you search around this board you’ll see that seeing a therapist is not at all uncommon in Biglaw.

Early on, before you’ve made a good reputation for yourself, I’d suggest keeping an eye on your notifications while in the session if possible, and even responding with some quick will dos if necessary. If there’s something urgent, you may need to cut short a meeting or two. But once you’ve established yourself, if people absolutely need you to respond to something in under an hour, they should be calling you.

Anon whose question you answered here. Thanks much for this, it’s very helpful. Currently doing sessions in the afternoon, but I do think moving them to the morning may make it easier depending on the schedules of the people in my group. Reassuring to hear that it should be possible though—thanks again for the response!

No problem. I do think the morning will likely be easier, especially if you’re in NY. You’re probably in DC if you’re regulatory, so earlier hours are a bit more typical, but even then IME it’s harder to dip out toward the end of the day if there’s a lot going on.

[Anonymous User]

I'm a second year at a big firm. Generally echoing other people that during work hours ~15-20 minutes is fine and I think on weekends/evenings that goes longer (but gets very context specific, are you in the middle of a signing? then that's basically 24/7 "work hours" for the busiest few days. And if it takes a couple hours some days that's fine as long as that's not the norm etc. and you shouldn't have known it was coming).


More value add I can give is probably that I have a chronic medical condition, that like yours is well managed but I require infusions every ~6 weeks (which are about 4 hours where I can kind of be available, but not really) and then occassional MRI/colonoscopy/etc. once or twice a year which are longer where I'm completely unavailable.

I've NEVER had a problem with any of this. If I'm actively working on a deal, I let the partners/other associates know in advance, they say "ok." I was willing to be completely transparent but literally couldn't, when I went to explain the infusions to the main partners in the group shortly after joining they literally cut me off and said they didn't want to know any details, and just let them know when I needed off. Even when we've been busy and I say I can do stuff during infusions (if slower than normal) or reschedule I almost universally get told not to and they will cover.

I think big law expects you to be willing to give up your free time when asked, but they still recognize what isn't free time.

[whats an updog]

On the flip side, I am not a big fan of first years who respond literally seconds after an email is sent. Just chill for like a minute.