Working from home post COVID? Forum

[whats an updog]

What I resent most about this situation is how clear it has become that the entire system is built around extroverts or people who otherwise prefer to be in the office.

This is true of pretty much everything and it sucks

[basileus59]

What I resent most about this situation is how clear it has become that the entire system is built around extroverts or people who otherwise prefer to be in the office.

This is true of pretty much everything and it sucks

I’d add technical limitations that we’ve by-and-large surpassed. Obviously an office makes sense in the days of in-trays and everything done in hard copy. But now?

[Anonymous User]

At my LA office, at the beginning of WFH, the people eager to get back in were the partners who were notorious for dropping by your office to chat and insisted their associates be in their offices all day, and/or those with young children. Looks like the same group is still eager to get back now.

Associates who didn't work for those partners had flexible schedules and generally WFH a few days a week before the pandemic, and would probably continue to do so after.

[Anonymous User]

As a corporate lawyer, I would WFH forever if they let us.

Sleep more, eat better. Bill more hours too because I'm not commuting and being distracted by social loafing. We would come to the office once per month for a "retreat" where we focus on training and socializing together.

Personally, I think you would see more female partners or people with pre-existing health issues because they could have kids and not feel so out-of-the-loop.

[Anonymous User]

And I hate that now everyone and their mother has my cell number. I used to not give it out except to actual friends from work.

YES. There’s one partner in particular who just calls me on my cell phone anytime he feels like it now. 8 AM, 9 PM, Saturdays, apparently it’s all the same now.

[Anonymous User]

Don’t be concerned why I asked. Either you are working in a corporate group at one of those places and understand the various billing and face time requirements or you don’t.

I'm concerned because it's a dumb question that shows complete ignorance of how practice is. In reality, even if a firm had a policy, it's completely office/partner dependent. You work with a partner who's super into facetime? It doesn't matter whether the firm "allows" 2-3 days WFH. Your ass is going to be in the office every day.

I am not concerned about your concerns. There are people here qualified to give their input. They usually don't associate themselves with "dumb," "lmao," "who cares about xyzzy," "ass," "lolwuttpar" etc... Please move on and let the adults contribute. Thank you.

Says the kid who's never practiced a day in his life. Typical arrogant 1L who doesn't know shit LMAO

Some people have worked many years on a thing called a “PhD” that helped them successfully sit for the bar and spend several valuable years in Biglaw before even setting foot in law school. As I said you seem pretty immature. Just keep moving. Thanks.

[lolwutpar]

Don’t be concerned why I asked. Either you are working in a corporate group at one of those places and understand the various billing and face time requirements or you don’t.

I'm concerned because it's a dumb question that shows complete ignorance of how practice is. In reality, even if a firm had a policy, it's completely office/partner dependent. You work with a partner who's super into facetime? It doesn't matter whether the firm "allows" 2-3 days WFH. Your ass is going to be in the office every day.

I am not concerned about your concerns. There are people here qualified to give their input. They usually don't associate themselves with "dumb," "lmao," "who cares about xyzzy," "ass," "lolwuttpar" etc... Please move on and let the adults contribute. Thank you.

Says the kid who's never practiced a day in his life. Typical arrogant 1L who doesn't know shit LMAO

Some people have worked many years on a thing called a “PhD” that helped them successfully sit for the bar and spend several valuable years in Biglaw before even setting foot in law school. As I said you seem pretty immature. Just keep moving. Thanks.

I believe spending years to get a PhD only to go into biglaw is known as a "wasted life" or "huge career mistake".

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know how firms were re work from home pre-covid in Orange County? Any firms particularly known for being flexible or are they comparable to LA (facetime requirements).

I have no insights on OC. But k&e in Los Angeles (IP group) routinely worked 2-3 days from home pre-pandemic. I have heard of a similar arrangement being contemplated by a couple NYC firms (V20). This would be a long term decision, but they have not made an official announcement yet. Friends in SV and SF were already WFh pre-pandemic. OC I am assuming won’t be too far off.

[Anonymous User]

Don’t be concerned why I asked. Either you are working in a corporate group at one of those places and understand the various billing and face time requirements or you don’t.

I'm concerned because it's a dumb question that shows complete ignorance of how practice is. In reality, even if a firm had a policy, it's completely office/partner dependent. You work with a partner who's super into facetime? It doesn't matter whether the firm "allows" 2-3 days WFH. Your ass is going to be in the office every day.

I am not concerned about your concerns. There are people here qualified to give their input. They usually don't associate themselves with "dumb," "lmao," "who cares about xyzzy," "ass," "lolwuttpar" etc... Please move on and let the adults contribute. Thank you.

Says the kid who's never practiced a day in his life. Typical arrogant 1L who doesn't know shit LMAO

Some people have worked many years on a thing called a “PhD” that helped them successfully sit for the bar and spend several valuable years in Biglaw before even setting foot in law school. As I said you seem pretty immature. Just keep moving. Thanks.

I believe spending years to get a PhD only to go into biglaw is known as a "wasted life" or "huge career mistake".

I know... A “wasted life” that a Biglaw firm is happy to 1) employ for several years and 2) fully sponsor for a JD. What a “huge career mistake.” An absolute tragedy
Anyway, no need to keep feeding the troll. Thanks for the good laugh.

[nixy]

Can anyone employed in a V5/10 corporate group chime in please? I am hearing from many firms V20+ that they may implement a 2-3 day in office schedule post covid19. (Of course subject to the preferences of the partner one is working with).

lmao who cares about these arbitrary distinctions? Why are you so concerned with what the v10 or v5 firms are doing? Skadden and Latham are going to approach it differently.

Pissing match aside, the wording of the question does make it sound like there's some kind of meaningful difference between the V5-10 and the V20 that would somehow be reflected in their approach to facetime/wfh. If it's just that you're interested in a particular V5-10 because you have a job lined up there but you're trying to keep it generic, it might have been clearer to post anon and just say that.

[Anonymous User]

Getting back on topic, any news? Looks like first vaccines could be distributed very soon

[sparty99]

Getting back on topic, any news? Looks like first vaccines could be distributed very soon

Hope you bought the Moderna stock when it was between $20 and $70.

[Sad248]

about to start V50 biglaw in a secondary market (Chicago, LA, Houston/Dallas). I haven't worked in biglaw yet but I did work before law school. I actually want to return to a world where daily in office is the norm. I like having a personal office, going out for coffee breaks and a short commute (~10-20 min max). I am single with no other obligations and working in a downtown area actually seems nice. For associates with 1-bedroom apartments, WFH doesn't seem automatically that great? I totally understand partners or senior associates that want WFH because they have big houses and families. Part of the biglaw perk is the personal office and facilities. If WFH become permanent and your salary stays the same, then you lose a benefit (sure the firm saves money, but who cares unless they pass that savings on to you). I am not an extrovert by any means, but I like going out each day and being in populated areas, walking, moving, and seeing.

This is an argument I've seen before, and it makes zero sense to me.
Firstly, people should just be allowed to do whatever they want. If you work better from home, do that. From the office? Do that. From the beaches of Normandy? Go for that. It makes sense to maximize output and happiness for any industry.
Secondly, how are you missing out on those perks by not going to the office? Is a desk that important? Buy a desk then. Or go to a coffee shop. You are aware that "going out" is impeded by working from home, right? So many of my colleagues are currently on holiday destinations, WFH. They are going out each day, exploring the world. Moving to your office every day is not the same.

[nixy]

I mean, different people have different preferences. Some people prefer not to work in the space where they live, especially when that space isn’t very big, and like to get out of their living space to work (and going to a coffee shop to do your biglaw job isn’t exactly feasible). It’s not that strange. No one’s saying that you have to feel that way, just that there are people who do feel that way.

[emc91]

Anyone hearing anything?

[blair.waldorf]

Bumping because I want to WFH forever. Anyone hear any updates?

[objctnyrhnr]

Bumping because I want to WFH forever. Anyone hear any updates?

All I’m hearing from my v30 rumor mill is that at some point, going to the office will be officially “voluntary.” What’s less clear is when that policy will morph or if that’s just gonna be it.

And then there’s the whole thing with working for a partner who loves the office too. Not sure how they’ll tackle that.

[Anonymous User]

I think WFH is great for individual tasks that require concentration, and catching up on emails. For meetings, collaborations, etc. it can work, but in my experience anything that involves a verbal interaction tends to be easier in-person. In-person is also better for training, team building, and so on.

My ideal scenario would be to come into the office semi-regularly: to kick off a deal, to have an important team meeting, do training, have office/practice social events, any other circumstances where personal interaction matters. In all other scenarios, have the option of WFH. Meaning if I have to just sit in a room and look through diligence (or write a brief, or whatever) all day, there’s no reason I can’t do that from home. If I’m in-between projects, I would also obviously rather sit at home.

That’s basically what my SO’s (non-law but white collar) company did pre-covid, and it worked just fine for them. Baseline in the office but with the extreme WFH flexibility on an individual basis as it made sense for your current workload.

[blair.waldorf]

I don’t want to debate whether WFH is ideal. I want to hear about what firms are doing going forward.

[Anonymous User]

Messaging from partners in my group (v10 transactional NYC) is that WFH will be frowned upon as a regular practice but far more okay for one-offs (e.g. sick kid, large delivery, etc). The tag I've heard is "2-4 days a month." FWIW not a particularly face-time group, but a group that has a lot of partners who value face-to-face meetings.

Firm as a whole is "considering" what WFH will look like but has not messaged anything solid.

[Anonymous User]

Annon above - this sounds like back to 2019 and really restrictive. For reference, i work at an extremely face time heavy firm and this was how things worked pre-covid. If the message was, I need a sick kid or other material reason in order to WFH, I’d immediately lateral. Life is short...

[blair.waldorf]

Annon above - this sounds like back to 2019 and really restrictive. For reference, i work at an extremely face time heavy firm and this was how things worked pre-covid. If the message was, I need a sick kid or other material reason in order to WFH, I’d immediately lateral. Life is short...

Yeah, screw that. I love WFH and would not stay at a firm that didn't allow at LEAST 1-2 days a week. I'm hoping 1-3 days becomes the standard and firms that do not allow it will be forced to fall in line.

[Anonymous User]

Anon because identifying info.

How do we feel about the possibility of doing a three weeks in-one week out situation? My SO is about to start grad school halfway across the country and I'd like to live with them at least one week out of the month (on average). My current in-house gig said they're going to let me work from home as much as I want, but I still plan on spending 1-2 weeks in the office a month. I'm interviewing for BigLaw jobs right now but worried about having longer hours and less flexibility for travelling will lead to me basically not seeing my SO at all for 3 years.

[blair.waldorf]

Anon because identifying info.

How do we feel about the possibility of doing a three weeks in-one week out situation? My SO is about to start grad school halfway across the country and I'd like to live with them at least one week out of the month (on average). My current in-house gig said they're going to let me work from home as much as I want, but I still plan on spending 1-2 weeks in the office a month. I'm interviewing for BigLaw jobs right now but worried about having longer hours and less flexibility for travelling will lead to me basically not seeing my SO at all for 3 years.

If you get an offer, I think you can negotiate this. I'm hearing about laterals and mid-levels/seniors negotiating WFH arrangements with firms.

[Anonymous User]

Anon because identifying info.

How do we feel about the possibility of doing a three weeks in-one week out situation? My SO is about to start grad school halfway across the country and I'd like to live with them at least one week out of the month (on average). My current in-house gig said they're going to let me work from home as much as I want, but I still plan on spending 1-2 weeks in the office a month. I'm interviewing for BigLaw jobs right now but worried about having longer hours and less flexibility for travelling will lead to me basically not seeing my SO at all for 3 years.

I have the exact same situation and would also LOVE the 1-out, 3-week in policy. I'm pretty confident my V50 firm will allow us to do that considering it is the functional equivalent of 1-2 days a week WFH.