DC Lawyers: Where Do You Live Forum

[AllAboutTheBasis]

I'll be moving to the DMV next year to start at a firm and have very little experience with the region. So, DC associates, where do you live? Do you like it? Where do you wish you could live? I'm especially interested in your thoughts re: living in NOVA/SS v. DC proper.

[Anonymous User]

Unpopular opinion at least at my firm, but as a parent of a young kid, I really liked Bethesda. I was able to bike to work on the Capital Crescent Trail almost every day. 7.5 miles, about 24-26 minutes in, 26-28 minutes back up to Bethesda, which is about how long it takes to drive in and find parking. Good schools and other things for little kids.

We moved out to Potomac for the big yard, and I regretted it. It was too far from the city, and Potomac basically shuts down at 9 pm.

A lot of young associates lived in DC and loved it. Others lived in Alexandria/Arlington and they seemed to like it enough.

[Anonymous User]

Unpopular opinion at least at my firm, but as a parent of a young kid, I really liked Bethesda. I was able to bike to work on the Capital Crescent Trail almost every day. 7.5 miles, about 24-26 minutes in, 26-28 minutes back up to Bethesda, which is about how long it takes to drive in and find parking. Good schools and other things for little kids.

We moved out to Potomac for the big yard, and I regretted it. It was too far from the city, and Potomac basically shuts down at 9 pm.

A lot of young associates lived in DC and loved it. Others lived in Alexandria/Arlington and they seemed to like it enough.

Also have young kid and also in Bethesda. Would someday go to Potomac for more space, but only because I think COVID has changed the WFH perceptions and I think I will ultimately be able to continue WFH a couple of days per week post-COVID (but maybe that's wishful thinking).

[Anonymous User]

Bethesda is good if you have kids. Pike and Rose is actually really nice.

I don’t have kids, and my firm is in the golden triangle area, so Dupont and Logan were the best options. I was able to walk to work within 20 minutes. The apartments are more expensive and smaller (my apt is 450 sq ft and around $2200). I live in a full service “luxury” building, so you can find cheaper places especially now.

A few coworkers live in NOMA and Navy Yard. Both are nice but inconvenient for work.

I personally wanted to be close to work, but if you like the finer things, the new apartments in Navy Yard are a great value.

[Anonymous User]

I wanted to be within a 15 min walk from work (ironic now, thanks COVID) so I chose the Penn Quarter neighborhood. Even with the proximity to work aspect gone though, I really do like the neighborhood, the restaurants, the museum's, it's close to all the metro stops, etc and I'd move here again even with the hindsight

[ashawnt]

Been a DC associate and resident for a number of years. If you are looking to not have a car and walk to work, you cant go wrong with living in Georgetown, the Wharf Waterfront, DuPont, Shaw, 14th/U street corridor, or Penn Quarter area. All of these places have tons of restaurants, bars, nightclubs, lounges, etc. A decent one bedroom will probably run you around $2,500 to $3,000/m in any of these places.

Of course, none of this is relevant now with COVID. DC is a ghost town compared to what it was pre COVID. Whats the point of living in a prime DC location like DuPont if you cant take advantage of what it has to offer? When my lease is up I am planning on moving to Tysons Corner in NOVA. Tysons corner has a number of new high rise buildings that are really nice at a fraction of the cost ($500-$1000/m less than you would pay in DC). The other thing you need to consider is state income taxes. Taxes are much lower in VA and MD than in DC. I personally know of a lot of people who have moved from DC to Virginia for this issue alone.

A lot of it just depends on what you are looking for exactly. Feel free to PM me if you want more information.

[Goldie]

Starting at a firm in DC in a couple months and chose Arlington, largely for the lower state income tax and also because my sense was you could get a little more for your money in northern Virginia over DC proper. The commute will be a bit more of a hassle in more normal times, but my firm is starting me remotely.

[Anonymous User]

Arlington, specifically Clarendon. Close enough to get to DC, enough bars/restaurants to be interesting, lower taxes

[Anonymous User]

McLean, VA. Lower taxes, superior schools, more space. Downside is that it's very expensive. Our house is one traffic light to DC. Door-to-door commute to my office on K Street is 14 minutes, ~30 with rush hour traffic.

Before kids, we lived in Arlington along the Orange line. I find Rosslyn pretty sterile, but anything between there and Ballston is a good option if you're looking for apartment living/restaurants.

[Anonymous User]

I live in Old Town Alexandria, near King Street metro, which was pretty convenient for my office on the yellow line but obviously irrelevant now that we're WFH until who knows when. I like it because it's still less than 30 minutes away (I metro in, instead of driving), cheaper than downtown DC (when I last apartment hunted a few years ago it was probably $400 or $500 cheaper for the same type of apartment), but with restaurants/shopping fairly close, and great recreation options if you're looking for places to bike or run. Not sure if it's the best place to live if you're young and hip and into whatever young and hip people do but I think it's a great area. My basic luxury building is $1900 for a one bedroom, plus whatever the car parking fee is (less than $100), but you wouldn't really need to have a car in the area unless you want to have one.

[Anonymous User]

I'll be moving to the DMV next year to start at a firm and have very little experience with the region. So, DC associates, where do you live? Do you like it? Where do you wish you could live? I'm especially interested in your thoughts re: living in NOVA/SS v. DC proper.

DC biglaw junior associate. Popular choices among my friends at my firm at my firm, in no particular order: Adams Morgan/Woodley Park, Georgetown, Mt Vernon Triangle (a ton of big apartment buildings), Navy Yard (also a ton of big apartment buildings), Mount Pleasant/Columbia Heights, and Foggy Bottom. Don't personally know anyone without kids who lives in Virginia at my firm among juniors. People who live in VA/SS often swear by it. I love living in DC proper.

[Anonymous User]

DC biglaw junior - most juniors I know lived in DC proper be it admo, navy yard, noma, etc, but I know people who lived in nova too who were happy (though it often tended to be the people who were married and/or had kids). For me, the thing that makes the biggest difference is living in walking distance of friends. I see my nova big law friends less than I would like because both of our schedules make that a pain, especially when you factor in travel and potentially needing to run back home or to the office. I see the friends who live in DC way more frequently because its easier to carve out the time without stressing over unexpected work.

[Anonymous User]

McLean, VA. Lower taxes, superior schools, more space. Downside is that it's very expensive. Our house is one traffic light to DC. Door-to-door commute to my office on K Street is 14 minutes, ~30 with rush hour traffic.

Before kids, we lived in Arlington along the Orange line. I find Rosslyn pretty sterile, but anything between there and Ballston is a good option if you're looking for apartment living/restaurants.

McLean is nice, and I agree it is a great place if you want to have a family or more space. The length of the commute depends on the locations in McLean and in DC.

I'm guessing you live off Kirby, or maybe 123. I live in McLean closer to Tysons and it would be a bit longer, but my office was also might have been deeper into DC. My office was at Metro Center, and it took about 50 minutes in the worst of the rush hour traffic to get back to my home.

Now, however, I work in NoVa and my commute is less than 10 minutes. It's hard to beat.

[Pulsar]

If you have a family, then VA/MD is better for having more space (and there are tax advantages). If you are single and want to be able to more easily meet friends/dates/etc. then I would live in DC proper. I live in Logan Circle and love it -- I can walk to the office in normal times, and I'm also within walking distance to lots of cool stuff in Shaw or even Admo.

Logan/Shaw/Admo have more to do than other areas. Dupont is pricey and increasingly sterile; NoMA & Navy Yard both have nice good apartment buildings but don't feel as much like an organic neighborhood on street level. Columbia Heights is also an option (if your firm is close to the green/yellow line), but there are certain blocks (e.g., Fairmont) that have crime and safety problems.

[Anonymous User]

McLean, VA. Lower taxes, superior schools, more space. Downside is that it's very expensive. Our house is one traffic light to DC. Door-to-door commute to my office on K Street is 14 minutes, ~30 with rush hour traffic.

Before kids, we lived in Arlington along the Orange line. I find Rosslyn pretty sterile, but anything between there and Ballston is a good option if you're looking for apartment living/restaurants.

Is McLean affordable for junior associates to buy homes? Same question goes for Bethesda, too?

[Anonymous User]

McLean, VA. Lower taxes, superior schools, more space. Downside is that it's very expensive. Our house is one traffic light to DC. Door-to-door commute to my office on K Street is 14 minutes, ~30 with rush hour traffic.

Before kids, we lived in Arlington along the Orange line. I find Rosslyn pretty sterile, but anything between there and Ballston is a good option if you're looking for apartment living/restaurants.

Is McLean affordable for junior associates to buy homes? Same question goes for Bethesda, too?

It depends on what your down payment is. I was looking at homes in those areas, and they’re still going to cost you $700k+ for a small 3 bed / 2 bath far from transportation.

If by home you mean condo, then yes. There are 2 bed 2 bath condos near Pike and Rose for $400k. I considered living there because it was right next to the red line stop, but I really don’t like commuting so I decided to stay out in DC proper.

[Anonymous User]

I live in DC and had to look up what Admo meant.

[Anonymous User]

McLean, VA. Lower taxes, superior schools, more space. Downside is that it's very expensive. Our house is one traffic light to DC. Door-to-door commute to my office on K Street is 14 minutes, ~30 with rush hour traffic.

Before kids, we lived in Arlington along the Orange line. I find Rosslyn pretty sterile, but anything between there and Ballston is a good option if you're looking for apartment living/restaurants.

Is McLean affordable for junior associates to buy homes? Same question goes for Bethesda, too?

It depends on what your down payment is. I was looking at homes in those areas, and they’re still going to cost you $700k+ for a small 3 bed / 2 bath far from transportation.

If by home you mean condo, then yes. There are 2 bed 2 bath condos near Pike and Rose for $400k. I considered living there because it was right next to the red line stop, but I really don’t like commuting so I decided to stay out in DC proper.

Original McLean OP. I'd push back on small, but get ready for old. DMV prices are crazy generally and new-build 4+BR is going to be way over $1MM even out in Vienna. You're making more than $300k by year four (assuming no contribution from a partner), so in principle yes, but "affordable" is obviously going to depend on your personal situation. I chose my law school based largely on scholarship, so I wasn't dealing with student loans burdening my DTI. COVID-driven demand for space means there is virtually no sub-$900k inventory in my area (meaning North Arlington through McLean Hamlet) right now, but it definitely existed previously when we were looking and buying. Not sure how that'll change once 100% WFH ends and DC starts re-opening in earnest.

Also, I hope everyone in this thread that owns has looked into refinancing over the last couple months. Just got 2.5% 30-fixed for $150 all in after credits (excluding prepaids). Mad times.

[eastcoast_iub]

McLean, VA. Lower taxes, superior schools, more space. Downside is that it's very expensive. Our house is one traffic light to DC. Door-to-door commute to my office on K Street is 14 minutes, ~30 with rush hour traffic.

Before kids, we lived in Arlington along the Orange line. I find Rosslyn pretty sterile, but anything between there and Ballston is a good option if you're looking for apartment living/restaurants.

Is McLean affordable for junior associates to buy homes? Same question goes for Bethesda, too?

It depends on what your down payment is. I was looking at homes in those areas, and they’re still going to cost you $700k+ for a small 3 bed / 2 bath far from transportation.

If by home you mean condo, then yes. There are 2 bed 2 bath condos near Pike and Rose for $400k. I considered living there because it was right next to the red line stop, but I really don’t like commuting so I decided to stay out in DC proper.

Original McLean OP. I'd push back on small, but get ready for old. DMV prices are crazy generally and new-build 4+BR is going to be way over $1MM even out in Vienna. You're making more than $300k by year four (assuming no contribution from a partner), so in principle yes, but "affordable" is obviously going to depend on your personal situation. I chose my law school based largely on scholarship, so I wasn't dealing with student loans burdening my DTI. COVID-driven demand for space means there is virtually no sub-$900k inventory in my area (meaning North Arlington through McLean Hamlet) right now, but it definitely existed previously when we were looking and buying. Not sure how that'll change once 100% WFH ends and DC starts re-opening in earnest.

Also, I hope everyone in this thread that owns has looked into refinancing over the last couple months. Just got 2.5% 30-fixed for $150 all in after credits (excluding prepaids). Mad times.

Who did you use to refinance, if you don't mind me asking?

[Anonymous User]

Also, I hope everyone in this thread that owns has looked into refinancing over the last couple months. Just got 2.5% 30-fixed for $150 all in after credits (excluding prepaids). Mad times.

Who did you use to refinance, if you don't mind me asking?

LoanDepot (credit to r/personalfinance)

[Anonymous User]

Also, I hope everyone in this thread that owns has looked into refinancing over the last couple months. Just got 2.5% 30-fixed for $150 all in after credits (excluding prepaids). Mad times.

Who did you use to refinance, if you don't mind me asking?

LoanDepot (credit to r/personalfinance)

I assume this has to be conforming (or else you locked in some time ago)? You're unlikely to find a rate like this on a mortgage for a purchase in McLean, unless you're putting at least 25% down.

Btw - attorneys shopping for homes should look at private banks. When I was shopping a few years ago, I recall that it was possible to get a loan of up to $1 million with as little as 10% down for associates and 5% down for partners (and perhaps better).

[Anonymous User]

Also, I hope everyone in this thread that owns has looked into refinancing over the last couple months. Just got 2.5% 30-fixed for $150 all in after credits (excluding prepaids). Mad times.

Who did you use to refinance, if you don't mind me asking?

LoanDepot (credit to r/personalfinance)

I assume this has to be conforming (or else you locked in some time ago)? You're unlikely to find a rate like this on a mortgage for a purchase in McLean, unless you're putting at least 25% down.

Btw - attorneys shopping for homes should look at private banks. When I was shopping a few years ago, I recall that it was possible to get a loan of up to $1 million with as little as 10% down for associates and 5% down for partners (and perhaps better).

Yep, conforming, LTV <75%. I think the limit is for our zip is right around ~740k.

Agreed that for jumbos or LTV >80%, private banks with a relationship with your firm are a good option. I've worked with the Citibank private banking group before and they were very competitive in the jumbo space, but that was before jumbo lending tightened up at the beginning of COVID. No clue whether jumbo rates have come back down since then.

[joeshmo39]

I used to live in Arlington and work in D.C. I'd focus on where your firm is and which metro lines are most convenient. If my firm was near Gallery place I'd consider living in Alexandria. But if my firm was further West, near the White House, I wouldn't want to live in Alexandria because I'd have to transfer to get there. Keeping your morning commute transfer-free is a consideration.

I don't like to drive so I never considered driving even though my firm provided free parking near the White House.

[Anonymous User]

I used to live in Arlington and work in D.C. I'd focus on where your firm is and which metro lines are most convenient. If my firm was near Gallery place I'd consider living in Alexandria. But if my firm was further West, near the White House, I wouldn't want to live in Alexandria because I'd have to transfer to get there. Keeping your morning commute transfer-free is a consideration.

I don't like to drive so I never considered driving even though my firm provided free parking near the White House.

Second this. I personally drive, but parking is not included at my firm and it's a $250-$350/mo in most garages in the area, including the one in my office.

So, metro is a much more cost effective option and not having to transfer is a great benefit. And this may not be a popular opinion, but living a bit further out on a metro line can also be better because then you usually get a seat for your whole commute in the morning.

[Anonymous User]

I live in Georgetown and think it is great during COVID times. It isn't as expensive as you would think (compared with other nice places in DC), but rather you just get a smaller place. Go out to the burbs if you want space and a house. Go Dupont if you want stuff to do, nice neighborhoods, and Metro convenience. Admo is cool, but I wouldn't live there unless I was really young or had lived here for a long enough time aka not within the first few years.