Reneging on offer with OCI changes? Forum

[scubasteve9999]

Any thoughts on reneging on big law nyc offer? 3L oci is january for most schools and most postemployment offers expire in october. What if want switch firmz, how to handle?

[Anonymous User]

Any thoughts on reneging on big law nyc offer? 3L oci is january for most schools and most postemployment offers expire in october. What if want switch firmz, how to handle?

Just came here to say I'm in the exact same situation. I've heard reneging is the way to go in this economy, but obviously it's still risky given we don't want to be at a disadvantage if the new firm decides to renege accepted offers themselves.

[cavalier1138]

I think you both should accept your offers. Reneging on the assumption that you'll get something better during 3L OCI (even in a good economy, this would be unlikely) is a horrible idea.

[The Lsat Airbender]

Cav is right. Reneging without an offer in-hand is nuts. You're playing Russian roulette with your career for tiny upside (the possibility of getting a new offer at a "better" firm).

[polareagle]

I think there's terminological confusion here.

"Reneging" means accepting and then backing out. I take the OP (and other poster) to mean that they would accept their offers, then participate in 3L OCI, and then renege if they got something better (but stick with the offer if they didn't).

I agree with the two previous posters that you definitely should not *reject* your offer. Reneging is a little trickier--I suppose there's no harm in participating in 3L OCI unless your original firm finds out.

[LBJ's Hair]

This is a truly terrible idea. Your interviewers could easily call your 2L summer firm to confirm you weren't no-offered, and then...oops.

Minimal upside, massive downside.

[trmckenz]

As suggested previously, you definitely should accept whatever biglaw offer you've got now. Then you can interview as a 3L. If you land something better later, renege on that first acceptance. Reneging does burn bridges, but if you get another offer that makes you happier, so be it.

I think the risk of the original firm "finding out" is overblown on here. I'm not saying you should be reckless; obviously you want to maintain a sterling professional image with everyone you meet, especially your employer. But it's hard to imagine the original biglaw firm stopping an incoming associate from joining simply because he participated in OCI. Isn't that the whole point of going to law school?

FWIW, I interviewed as a 3L, both while I was a summer associate and after. Cravath, which used to be notorious for calling previous firms, didn't even call my summer firm. They just wanted me to prove that I actually received an offer from my original firm by sending them the offer letter. Despite warnings from my law school's career services, nobody "found out" about my interviewing. And I spoke with a number of other firms.

Really, most biglaw firms understand what you're doing and will be discrete. You can even request to maintain confidentiality throughout the hiring process. Just be smart and respectful as you search for other opportunities. It also is good advice to write cover letters as if your original firm will read it (i.e., do not disparage your original firm).

In many ways, 3L hiring feels more like a lateral hire than a new associate hire. It's important to have a solid story of why you're looking because 3L hiring is much more about fit and current needs than the typical 2L OCI process. As a 3L, my school's OCI was not useful because firms aren't looking for 3Ls (they only wanted 2Ls) and the structure was very rigid. My 3L interviews arose through direct communication with firms. Having a partner vouch for you works wonders.

Hope that helps. Good luck!

[Anonymous User]

First anon here. I agree there was a terminology misunderstanding. While I can't speak for OP, I am just trying to decide whether to accept my 2A SA firm's offer now under the assumption that I won't hold my breathe for a better offer (but will renege if one comes along), or if I should keep the offer open and hope one of my mass mails comes through in the next week or so.

FWIW, I have recently been in contact with firms that said my application has been passed along to the respective departments. One said they would get back to me "very soon."

[trmckenz]

There is no rush to accept your current offer. I would wait to see if any other offers come in before accepting. The reason being that it is cleaner / smoother to flat-out reject the first offer without having to later renege on an acceptance. But practically speaking the effect is probably the same, whether you accept and then renege or reject. Just don't let your current offer lapse.

[Anonymous User]

There is no rush to accept your current offer. I would wait to see if any other offers come in before accepting. The reason being that it is cleaner / smoother to flat-out reject the first offer without having to later renege on an acceptance. But practically speaking the effect is probably the same, whether you accept and then renege or reject. Just don't let your current offer lapse.

Thanks! So you don't think there's a material risk of my 2L firm rescinding the offer?

[trmckenz]

There is zero risk of your offer being rescinded if your 2L firm never finds out about your interviewing. The risk increases from zero only if your 2L firm learns about your interviewing. How risky that actually becomes depends on your 2L firm. A traditional NYC biglaw shop with high turnover isn't going to monitor you, and HR is focused on recruiting new 2Ls. So unless some partner learns that you're interviewing and takes it really personally, your offer should remain secure.

Again, just be thoughtful in how you approach your 3L interview strategy. To minimize the chances of word getting back to your 2L firm, express up front to firms your desire for discretion. As professionals, they will understand. Also avoid places that are super risky. For example, don't apply to another office of your 2L firm, and don't apply to a place where you know the hiring partner golfs regularly with your 2L supervisor. Apart from that, go after the job you want!

[Anonymous User]

As suggested previously, you definitely should accept whatever biglaw offer you've got now. Then you can interview as a 3L. If you land something better later, renege on that first acceptance. Reneging does burn bridges, but if you get another offer that makes you happier, so be it.

I think the risk of the original firm "finding out" is overblown on here. I'm not saying you should be reckless; obviously you want to maintain a sterling professional image with everyone you meet, especially your employer. But it's hard to imagine the original biglaw firm stopping an incoming associate from joining simply because he participated in OCI. Isn't that the whole point of going to law school?

FWIW, I interviewed as a 3L, both while I was a summer associate and after. Cravath, which used to be notorious for calling previous firms, didn't even call my summer firm. They just wanted me to prove that I actually received an offer from my original firm by sending them the offer letter. Despite warnings from my law school's career services, nobody "found out" about my interviewing. And I spoke with a number of other firms.

Really, most biglaw firms understand what you're doing and will be discrete. You can even request to maintain confidentiality throughout the hiring process. Just be smart and respectful as you search for other opportunities. It also is good advice to write cover letters as if your original firm will read it (i.e., do not disparage your original firm).

In many ways, 3L hiring feels more like a lateral hire than a new associate hire. It's important to have a solid story of why you're looking because 3L hiring is much more about fit and current needs than the typical 2L OCI process. As a 3L, my school's OCI was not useful because firms aren't looking for 3Ls (they only wanted 2Ls) and the structure was very rigid. My 3L interviews arose through direct communication with firms. Having a partner vouch for you works wonders.

Hope that helps. Good luck!

How did you get an interview through direct communications? Did you reach out to the partners directly and have them vouch for you?

[Anonymous User]

So the situation is that you are a 3L, you have an offer from your 2L firm, but you are also going through 3L OCI? How long has the offer been outstanding from your 2L firm? Summer was a long time ago, after all.

If it were me, I would absolutely accept the 2L summer firm's offer and continue looking for something better. Once I officially accepted an offer from a different firm, and no sooner, I would reach out to the original firm to back out. It is not a big deal to renege on an offer, especially six months in advance of when you would start. Any concerns about the original firm not liking you are nowhere near as important as you needing to make sure that you have a job this fall. Don't wait to accept the offer in your hand for that reason.