Any idea on how covid will impact Biglaw return offers for these firms? Forum

[anon65000]

For firms that have reduced associate salary and partner distribution (Baker Mckenzie; Cadwalader; Ballard Spahr), any thoughts on how that may impact return offers for their summer associates? Is it a sign of financial distress that could impact the number of summer associates joining the firms as full-time associates in 2021?

[objctnyrhnr]

My intuition is that, perhaps unlike 2008, the firms are coming at this with the goal of good PR first and foremost. I believe that a number of firms are cutting salaries in lieu of associate/furloughs for that reason.

Following from this, I would think, is a potential concern about no offers and how they would be perceived. So I think they’ll do their best to make offers.

Finally, models predict things being on track by the time these summers would begin as associates. In fact some predict a rapid ramp-up of demand.

So I think it probably wouldn’t be super detrimental to chances of getting offered after the summer.

[QContinuum]

Agree with all of objctnyrhnr's intuition above, with the major caveat that all this depends on a relatively speedy recovery, as models are currently predicting. If it turns out that the lockdowns must continue until spring 2021 when a vaccine comes out, then the economy will likely do substantially worse than the models are currently predicting and in that scenario all bets are off.

[aliciacflorrick]

Ballard already guaranteed offers to its summers, by the way.

[Anonymous User]

Ballard already guaranteed offers to its summers, by the way.

Do you think the guaranteed offer trend will extend to most law firms? I know a number of firms have guaranteed offers while others have only delayed start dates/moved to remote programs, but I am curious to see if many firms will eventually adopt guaranteed offers.

[aliciacflorrick]

I’m only a student myself. You should check the Reddit chart being updated every day about what firms are doing in the lawschool forum.

As of today, Cravath and DPW have guaranteed post-grad offers in the V10 with pay. I think firms less capable of doing that who haven’t already announced will do something like Stroock (canceling program, 15k stipend plus offer) or Hogan (reduced weeks/pay of SA plus offer). The harshest outcome in the V100 so far is Arent Fox’s outright cancellation without pay yet a guaranteed offer... and I still consider that a good outcome.

[Anonymous User]

I’m only a student myself. You should check the Reddit chart being updated every day about what firms are doing in the lawschool forum.

As of today, Cravath and DPW have guaranteed post-grad offers in the V10 with pay. I think firms less capable of doing that who haven’t already announced will do something like Stroock (canceling program, 15k stipend plus offer) or Hogan (reduced weeks/pay of SA plus offer). The harshest outcome in the V100 so far is Arent Fox’s outright cancellation without pay yet a guaranteed offer... and I still consider that a good outcome.

Maybe I’m reading the chart wrong, but the chart seems to indicate that Arent Fox cancelled WITHOUT guaranteed offers.

Edit: was looking on my phone and didn’t notice they added another row to the chart. My bad.

[Anonymous User]

I’m only a student myself. You should check the Reddit chart being updated every day about what firms are doing in the lawschool forum.

As of today, Cravath and DPW have guaranteed post-grad offers in the V10 with pay. I think firms less capable of doing that who haven’t already announced will do something like Stroock (canceling program, 15k stipend plus offer) or Hogan (reduced weeks/pay of SA plus offer). The harshest outcome in the V100 so far is Arent Fox’s outright cancellation without pay yet a guaranteed offer... and I still consider that a good outcome.

Agreed - thanks for the insight!!

[Anonymous User]

Greenberg Traurig gave post grad offers to 2L summers firmwide

[Anonymous User]

I’m only a student myself. You should check the Reddit chart being updated every day about what firms are doing in the lawschool forum.

As of today, Cravath and DPW have guaranteed post-grad offers in the V10 with pay. I think firms less capable of doing that who haven’t already announced will do something like Stroock (canceling program, 15k stipend plus offer) or Hogan (reduced weeks/pay of SA plus offer). The harshest outcome in the V100 so far is Arent Fox’s outright cancellation without pay yet a guaranteed offer... and I still consider that a good outcome.

Greenberg Traurig guaranteed post-grad offers as well, if a V60 can do it, a V10 is going to look pretty shitty. I think guaranteed post-grad offers are going to be the norm, with variations among firms guaranteeing summer pay

[wildcatatpenn]

based on my own firm and what im hearing in the market I really wouldnt be worried too much about this. It seems like it's winding down anyways, but definitely doesn't seem like it's gonna have the long-term effects like '08 did.

My firm overreacted hardaf imo and cut the 401k match, so basically cutting comp. Yet my group
has been week over week +++ in hours/revenue p much every single week. And even the groups that have more to do with consumer goods/travel/wtv are really not suffering that much. Corporate America seems like it's p much all systems go.

Unless one of those firms in your group is heavily reliant on a client like a cruise line or casino or something like that i guess

[wwwcol]

based on my own firm and what im hearing in the market I really wouldnt be worried too much about this. It seems like it's winding down anyways, but definitely doesn't seem like it's gonna have the long-term effects like '08 did.

My firm overreacted hardaf imo and cut the 401k match, so basically cutting comp. Yet my group
has been week over week +++ in hours/revenue p much every single week. And even the groups that have more to do with consumer goods/travel/wtv are really not suffering that much. Corporate America seems like it's p much all systems go.

Unless one of those firms in your group is heavily reliant on a client like a cruise line or casino or something like that i guess

Or a hotel chain or an airline or a carmaker or a sports league or an entertainment venue or a TV network (advertising $ down) or a theater chain or an O&G driller or a retailer, etc etc. unless your client is one of these or an adjacent industry, then it’s like p much all systems go.

Lol come on man

[wildcatatpenn]

based on my own firm and what im hearing in the market I really wouldnt be worried too much about this. It seems like it's winding down anyways, but definitely doesn't seem like it's gonna have the long-term effects like '08 did.

My firm overreacted hardaf imo and cut the 401k match, so basically cutting comp. Yet my group
has been week over week +++ in hours/revenue p much every single week. And even the groups that have more to do with consumer goods/travel/wtv are really not suffering that much. Corporate America seems like it's p much all systems go.

Unless one of those firms in your group is heavily reliant on a client like a cruise line or casino or something like that i guess

Or a hotel chain or an airline or a carmaker or a sports league or an entertainment venue or a TV network (advertising $ down) or a theater chain or an O&G driller or a retailer, etc etc. unless your client is one of these or an adjacent industry, then it’s like p much all systems go.

Lol come on man

na that's taking it too far imo. My firm is big in energy. I won't even pretend to know wtf the energy ppl do but any slowdown they've had has been buoyed by other practice areas. sports league, sure, but there's what like 7 of them that have positive income? idt there's that many market segments that have been put on the precipice of disaster.

2 factors main factors i see counteracting a short duration slowdown:
1) legal spending not necessarily tied to revenue...my #1 client is definitely not, their legal services need to churn regardless... Venues like u mentioned i bet are hiring a bunch of attys right now to get out of or renegotiate contracts and stuff.
2) whole point of a big firm is to provide the client diversity that one market segment getting fuked can be weathered..

Just my perspective.

[whatanabsoluteunit]

I’m only a student myself. You should check the Reddit chart being updated every day about what firms are doing in the lawschool forum.

As of today, Cravath and DPW have guaranteed post-grad offers in the V10 with pay. I think firms less capable of doing that who haven’t already announced will do something like Stroock (canceling program, 15k stipend plus offer) or Hogan (reduced weeks/pay of SA plus offer). The harshest outcome in the V100 so far is Arent Fox’s outright cancellation without pay yet a guaranteed offer... and I still consider that a good outcome.

Greenberg Traurig guaranteed post-grad offers as well, if a V60 can do it, a V10 is going to look pretty shitty. I think guaranteed post-grad offers are going to be the norm, with variations among firms guaranteeing summer pay

I don't say this with ill will but a "guaranteed" offer means nothing. If the situation further devolves, a lot of these "guaranteed" offers are going to disappear.