Proper Etiquette for resigning (biglaw) and vacation Forum

[Anonymous User]

Can people chime in on their experience with respect to associates quitting big law and vacation policies?
My understanding is that most firms have about 20 vacation days, with maybe 1-2 floating holidays thrown in. I believe at my firm it accrues quarterly and is use it-or lose it each year (but if you quit your job, they will pay you out for accrued vacation days in the year of quitting).

So it's just Q1 now and the hottest time of the year for lateral moves. I suspect a lot of people (including my self) will be moving at the end of the month or next month (especially as bonuses get paid out).

is it bad form to take 5 days of vacation (but do it so it's more like 9 days because of weekend before and after) and then come back and a few days later give two weeks notice? I could potentially get by without working much this February then. (Understand some firms let you go after one week of notice actually). Will this look bad or is it legitimate in that it could be conceievable that you already had the vacation planned and got an offer while on vacation?

I don't think I'm necessarily doing anything outrageous like taking 2 weeks of vacation or anything. Figure 5 days is not bad for Q1 and this way I don't have to rely on the firm paying me out or not or on how they calculate accruals.

[ghostoftraynor]

Fine

[Anonymous User]

Fine

Thanks, is this common? I just don't want any partners holding it against me (in case new job doesn't work out). A lot of people end up coming back to our firm.

[Wild Card]

Fine

Thanks, is this common? I just don't want any partners holding it against me (in case new job doesn't work out). A lot of people end up coming back to our firm.

If they wanted to fire you, they would call you at a random hour of the day, tell you to show up to a random conference room, then have you escorted out of the building immediately.

FYI.

[Anonymous User]

If they wanted to fire you, they would call you at a random hour of the day, tell you to show up to a random conference room, then have you escorted out of the building immediately.

FYI.

True point taken, though they would generally give you separation pay in the above scenario. In any case, I am going to take the vacation because there's nothing they can do.Why isn't it more common that people don't coast their last month then?

[LaLiLuLeLo]

Totally fine. And imo the right move. I’ve seen people do it after multi week vacations with no ill feelings. I did it myself.

[TigerIsBack]

If they wanted to fire you, they would call you at a random hour of the day, tell you to show up to a random conference room, then have you escorted out of the building immediately.

FYI.

True point taken, though they would generally give you separation pay in the above scenario. In any case, I am going to take the vacation because there's nothing they can do.Why isn't it more common that people don't coast their last month then?

Not sure how common or uncommon it is, but I can tell you that I entirely coasted from the day that I gave notice until the very last day at the firm. Almost no one gave me new work since they knew I was on my way out, and people immediately started taking me off email chains. I was in the office from like 10 or 11am until 1-3pm every day during my notice period because I wasn't that busy after being taken off email chains.

[nealric]

Doubt they will care. Vacation days you take are vacation days they don't pay out.

[Anonymous User]

If they wanted to fire you, they would call you at a random hour of the day, tell you to show up to a random conference room, then have you escorted out of the building immediately.

FYI.

True point taken, though they would generally give you separation pay in the above scenario. In any case, I am going to take the vacation because there's nothing they can do.Why isn't it more common that people don't coast their last month then?

Not sure how common or uncommon it is, but I can tell you that I entirely coasted from the day that I gave notice until the very last day at the firm. Almost no one gave me new work since they knew I was on my way out, and people immediately started taking me off email chains. I was in the office from like 10 or 11am until 1-3pm every day during my notice period because I wasn't that busy after being taken off email chains.

How long was your notice period? I would like to give a full two weeks but have heard the firm sometimes tells you to pack your things after a week. I don't really want to miss out on a free week of pay.

Doubt they will care. Vacation days you take are vacation days they don't pay out.

How's it work at yours or others' firms? It's not like if you quit in January you will get paid out for 20 days (vacation allotted for the year). What happens if you took 2 weeks off (assume they'd dock your pay for the extra week or something you took).

[Wild Card]

If they wanted to fire you, they would call you at a random hour of the day, tell you to show up to a random conference room, then have you escorted out of the building immediately.

FYI.

True point taken, though they would generally give you separation pay in the above scenario. In any case, I am going to take the vacation because there's nothing they can do.Why isn't it more common that people don't coast their last month then?

Not sure how common or uncommon it is, but I can tell you that I entirely coasted from the day that I gave notice until the very last day at the firm. Almost no one gave me new work since they knew I was on my way out, and people immediately started taking me off email chains. I was in the office from like 10 or 11am until 1-3pm every day during my notice period because I wasn't that busy after being taken off email chains.

My point was that they could behave disgracefully toward you if they wanted to, so don't stress out about it. However, I would double check your firm's policy on taking vacation AFTER you've given notice. I believe my firm refuses to honor paid vacation if you take days AFTER you've given notice. (Taking vacation, then giving notice immediately upon returning, is a different story and they wouldn't do anything to you in that case.)

[TigerIsBack]

If they wanted to fire you, they would call you at a random hour of the day, tell you to show up to a random conference room, then have you escorted out of the building immediately.

FYI.

True point taken, though they would generally give you separation pay in the above scenario. In any case, I am going to take the vacation because there's nothing they can do.Why isn't it more common that people don't coast their last month then?

Not sure how common or uncommon it is, but I can tell you that I entirely coasted from the day that I gave notice until the very last day at the firm. Almost no one gave me new work since they knew I was on my way out, and people immediately started taking me off email chains. I was in the office from like 10 or 11am until 1-3pm every day during my notice period because I wasn't that busy after being taken off email chains.

How long was your notice period? I would like to give a full two weeks but have heard the firm sometimes tells you to pack your things after a week. I don't really want to miss out on a free week of pay.

I gave 2.5 weeks notice (cleared background/conflicts on like a Wednesday, immediately did my rounds of giving notice to the partners in my office, and gave the rest of that week plus 2 full weeks to maximize my chill time). I also wanted to end on a Friday so I could do a long lunch with other associates I was close to, which is just usually easier on a Friday.

[TigerIsBack]

If they wanted to fire you, they would call you at a random hour of the day, tell you to show up to a random conference room, then have you escorted out of the building immediately.

FYI.

True point taken, though they would generally give you separation pay in the above scenario. In any case, I am going to take the vacation because there's nothing they can do.Why isn't it more common that people don't coast their last month then?

Not sure how common or uncommon it is, but I can tell you that I entirely coasted from the day that I gave notice until the very last day at the firm. Almost no one gave me new work since they knew I was on my way out, and people immediately started taking me off email chains. I was in the office from like 10 or 11am until 1-3pm every day during my notice period because I wasn't that busy after being taken off email chains.

My point was that they could behave disgracefully toward you if they wanted to, so don't stress out about it. However, I would double check your firm's policy on taking vacation AFTER you've given notice. I believe my firm refuses to honor paid vacation if you take days AFTER you've given notice. (Taking vacation, then giving notice immediately upon returning, is a different story and they wouldn't do anything to you in that case.)

I was just responding to OP's question about why more people don't coast during their last month of work.

[stoopkid13]

FWIW, I think the ABA came out with a recent ethics opinion questioning notice period requirements. No idea how firms are responding, if at all, though.

[Anonymous User]

Doubt they will care. Vacation days you take are vacation days they don't pay out.

Pretty common at my "unlimited vacation" firm for associates to take one close to when they leave, too, and AFAIK nobody really cares. No associates are taking enough vacation as it is.

[Anonymous User]

Just make sure what your firm’s carryover/accrual policy is. My coworker took two weeks in January and gave notice. The firm said that my coworker took too many vacation days and their pay would be adjusted.

[Anonymous User]

It's that time of the year again...

Any checklist of things to do before leaving? All I can think of is to get copies of my MCLE hours from the librarian. I figured the new firm would have any relevant samples, so I don't really plan on saving any samples, but maybe it would be nice to save copies of important motions completed.

[Anonymous User]

Two weeks' notice is fine, and typical, but don't stress if you need/want to give shorter notice. When I left my last firm, I only gave ~1.5 weeks' notice because my new firm was slow about completing my conflicts, and no one at my old firm - not any senior, not HR, no one - ever hinted that I should've given longer notice. Unless your firm has a specific policy for giving notice, I think the length of notice matters a lot less than not leaving folks in the lurch. When I left my last firm, I took preparatory steps such that, by the time I gave notice, it was easy to transition my remaining matters and there wasn't any backlog that got dumped on anyone.

To Wild Card's comments, I don't think it's at all common for associates to be fired on the spot, with no prior warning, and escorted out by security. There are firms that lay off support staff that way, but I haven't heard of that kind of treatment of associates, absent some kind of misconduct.

[Anonymous User]

To add another counterpoint:

At my v50 firm, associates who gave notice with 2 weeks in mind were often told to leave within 2-3 days instead of completing the 2 weeks so the firm could save money, particularly if the associate wasn't really busy. So I would definitely not give notice until you feel like you could be fine without getting paid and are ready to leave.

Also I wish i took a LONG vacation before giving notice. They didn't make me pay any days back (but check your firms WRITTEN policy on this).

[Anonymous User]

To add another counterpoint:

At my v50 firm, associates who gave notice with 2 weeks in mind were often told to leave within 2-3 days instead of completing the 2 weeks so the firm could save money, particularly if the associate wasn't really busy. So I would definitely not give notice until you feel like you could be fine without getting paid and are ready to leave.

Also I wish i took a LONG vacation before giving notice. They didn't make me pay any days back (but check your firms WRITTEN policy on this).

For what it's worth, at my old firm it very much depended where you were leaving to. If you were leaving for an in-house job, you'd suddenly become every partner's best friend and got a nice going away party, etc. They would never tell someone like that to leave immediately. If you were going to another firm, the reaction was considerably more frosty. Government was neutral, though I imagine that might depend on what sort of role.