Burnout Issue Forum

[Anonymous User]

I'm a 6th year M&A associate that has moved around a few times and finally settled a few years ago on a good firm in a secondary market that I like a lot. The issue is that I'm just freaking burned out. Had 5 straight 225+ hour months, which bled into vacations, weekends, nights, and there isn't really an end in sight for this.

Is it normal to feel completely unmotivated after having this type of stretch? I have deals trying to sign and I can't even get myself to review new turns of documents until I get into a panic about wanting to get my bonus in the winter. In-house is the ultimate goal, but I'm in a pretty small market with not a ton of stuff. I was going to apply nationally after getting my bonus, but I'm at the point where I'm just fried.

Never had a stretch like this, and I'm sort of just zoned out now. Shitty sleep, no exercise, constant stress from many deals at once. Being a lawyer fucking blows.

[Anonymous User]

I have been there too, I am also six years out of school. My hours were similar to yours for about four years, and I think it's definitely natural to burn out at the point you've reached.

I'm constantly thinking about leaving the profession or at least getting into a different type of law. I've done everything to take my mind off of how miserable the job can be -- joining the military part time, getting new hobbies, dating recklessly, taking on extreme sports (climbing, parachuting). It helps but it isn't a total solution for lack of job satisfaction or burnout.

I am not sure if I would recommend mass job applications as a way to cope with burnout. On one hand, it gave me something to look forward to. On the other hand, it made me anxious and discontent because I was constantly thinking of how much I wanted to be anywhere else.

[Anonymous User]

I totally understand where you are at. I had a 2200, 2400 and then 2600 year all in a row. I was pretty burned out but one of those people whose mindset was "give up your life for the $ for like 6-7 years and be set." One day, a client asked me to come work for them. Being on the other side here are my two points that I hope help you hang in there:

(1) you don't want to take any in-house gig. You want the right one. Focus on the people and the pay. No matter the comp, you will likely think back fondly to the ALL CASH comp you get at a firm. The people are so important because unlike a firm, you can't avoid shitty people.

(2) enjoy the CASH comp. I cannot stress this enough. I think I got a GREAT comp package. I make $195k, target bonus of $50k and restricted stock of $60k (4 year vest). Here is the issue - I would be making $305 base next year, so I greatly miss the extra $110k in salary. Equity blows because you can't spend it, especially when it doesn't vest for forever. Target bonuses in-house are rarely (in my exp) given at 100% (ours are solely based on company performance, 0% discretionary), last year I only got 50%.

All that said, even thinking about all that green, I get offers to go back to a firm all the time(including my old one), but I don't do it because life is great on the other side. I get home every day at 6:30 and I don't work weekends, but hang in there and stock pile money as long as you can!

[Anonymous User]

Mid-level litigation associate here. My view is that being a work horse is not sustainable long term. It's helpful to build the necessary skills you will need to succeed, but depending on others to give you work, receiving a fraction of the value of that work, and being very replaceable by constantly growing classes of new associates every year is a recipe for disaster.

[barkschool]

Mid-level litigation associate here. My view is that being a work horse is not sustainable long term. It's helpful to build the necessary skills you will need to succeed, but depending on others to give you work, receiving a fraction of the value of that work, and being very replaceable by constantly growing classes of new associates every year is a recipe for disaster.

But what do you do when you let it creep into your psyche that you are the best work horse and that maybe it’ll work out for you and everything will be fine?

[dabigchina]

Mid-level litigation associate here. My view is that being a work horse is not sustainable long term. It's helpful to build the necessary skills you will need to succeed, but depending on others to give you work, receiving a fraction of the value of that work, and being very replaceable by constantly growing classes of new associates every year is a recipe for disaster.

But what do you do when you let it creep into your psyche that you are the best work horse and that maybe it’ll work out for you and everything will be fine?

Do you enjoy being a workhorse? If so, there's nothing wrong with it IMHO. I think most people dislike being leaned on to do so much work.

[QContinuum]

Mid-level litigation associate here. My view is that being a work horse is not sustainable long term. It's helpful to build the necessary skills you will need to succeed, but depending on others to give you work, receiving a fraction of the value of that work, and being very replaceable by constantly growing classes of new associates every year is a recipe for disaster.

But what do you do when you let it creep into your psyche that you are the best work horse and that maybe it’ll work out for you and everything will be fine?

Do you enjoy being a workhorse? If so, there's nothing wrong with it IMHO. I think most people dislike being leaned on to do so much work.

In my view it depends on two things, not necessarily in this order. First, one's personal view of work/life balance. People's tolerance for long hours varies quite significantly. Two, the nature of the work. It's one thing to be a work horse taking on loads and loads of all the crappy work no one else wants; it's a whole different beast to be sought after and staffed on high-level, sexy work that everyone else wants in on.

[barkschool]

Mid-level litigation associate here. My view is that being a work horse is not sustainable long term. It's helpful to build the necessary skills you will need to succeed, but depending on others to give you work, receiving a fraction of the value of that work, and being very replaceable by constantly growing classes of new associates every year is a recipe for disaster.

But what do you do when you let it creep into your psyche that you are the best work horse and that maybe it’ll work out for you and everything will be fine?

Do you enjoy being a workhorse? If so, there's nothing wrong with it IMHO. I think most people dislike being leaned on to do so much work.

In my view it depends on two things, not necessarily in this order. First, one's personal view of work/life balance. People's tolerance for long hours varies quite significantly. Two, the nature of the work. It's one thing to be a work horse taking on loads and loads of all the crappy work no one else wants; it's a whole different beast to be sought after and staffed on high-level, sexy work that everyone else wants in on.

I think we are approaching a definition question here. There is definitely a split from workhorse when it’s sexy work, broadly defined as work that is substantive, where you learn real skills and provide value that could serve as a serious advancement tool in your career, and work that while sexy may never lead to being included on credits or actual steps towards partnership.

It is tough to know whether you are THE GUY, instead of A GUY.

[DanielPWhite]

Hi, can we just please never call any type of legal work "sexy"? Bc its ridiculous, sexy legal work haha, the fucc outta here. Thank you

[QContinuum]

Hi, can we just please never call any type of legal work "sexy"? Bc its ridiculous, sexy legal work haha, the fucc outta here. Thank you

There is absolutely legal work that is exciting, thrilling, sexy. I feel sorry for you if you've never experienced such work.

[Anonymous User]

Hi, can we just please never call any type of legal work "sexy"? Bc its ridiculous, sexy legal work haha, the fucc outta here. Thank you

There is absolutely legal work that is exciting, thrilling, sexy. I feel sorry for you if you've never experienced such work.

This job has literally destroyed my sex drive from stress and being overworked, so I guess there's that....

[yodamiked]

Hi, can we just please never call any type of legal work "sexy"? Bc its ridiculous, sexy legal work haha, the fucc outta here. Thank you

+1

[BigLawer]

Hi, can we just please never call any type of legal work "sexy"? Bc its ridiculous, sexy legal work haha, the fucc outta here. Thank you

There is absolutely legal work that is exciting, thrilling, sexy. I feel sorry for you if you've never experienced such work.

Not sure if you are being sarcastic. I could see it in high-stakes litigation I guess. It does not exist in transactional work, unfortunately.

[nerd1]

Hi, can we just please never call any type of legal work "sexy"? Bc its ridiculous, sexy legal work haha, the fucc outta here. Thank you

There is absolutely legal work that is exciting, thrilling, sexy. I feel sorry for you if you've never experienced such work.

Anyone that actually thinks this contract/legal documents reviewing and drafting work is sexy has a very serious mental illness. Maybe some appellate litigation work could be sexy.

Having sex, watching a movie, working out, playing piano, just walking for the sake of walking, solving puzzles, and even solving some math problems are infinitely more fun than this.

Accidental anon btw

[trebekismyhero]

Hi, can we just please never call any type of legal work "sexy"? Bc its ridiculous, sexy legal work haha, the fucc outta here. Thank you

There is absolutely legal work that is exciting, thrilling, sexy. I feel sorry for you if you've never experienced such work.

Not sure if you are being sarcastic. I could see it in high-stakes litigation I guess. It does not exist in transactional work, unfortunately.

QContinuum was almost certainly being sarcastic. Even high-stakes litigation is not sexy while actually doing the work

[QContinuum]

There is absolutely legal work that is exciting, thrilling, sexy. I feel sorry for you if you've never experienced such work.

Not sure if you are being sarcastic. I could see it in high-stakes litigation I guess. It does not exist in transactional work, unfortunately.

QContinuum was almost certainly being sarcastic. Even high-stakes litigation is not sexy while actually doing the work

Thanks Trebek, it appears I wasn't being quite hyperbolic enough.