How soon is too soon to take another vacation? Forum

[Anonymous User]

Hello. Question in thread title, but I'm prefacing this by stating that I work in an Asian office. I took a long-ish vacation in the first week of February (we get three days off for Lunar New Year, but I added two days vacation, so total days I was away was more like 9 days (one week and both weekends before and after)). My significant other really wants to go on a trip for an event in the first week of June. Luckily enough there's another holiday then, but I would need to take another day off for the event, which would mean that it would be like a 4 day weekend. Given that I just took a long-ish looking vacation first week of February, is taking another long weekend like this in June too soon?

Again, know that because I'm at an Asian office, attitudes/atmosphere might be different, but just wanted to get a general sense of whether this is okay or not. For what it's worth 2nd year, transaction focused. Thanks.

[generaltoast]

I suppose it could be firm dependent, but I would be pretty baffled if this were not ok at any firm. I took a short vaca at the end of January and am taking a week vaca next week. Hoping to do another in July. As long as you have enough work to keep up hours, this shouldn't be an issue even at the most intense firms.

[Anonymous User]

At my firm in my practice group, there is a second year who always lines his/her vacations up with holidays or long weekends, such that the “vacation days” pile up such that this person basically takes 5 weeks of vacation a year. When you’re talking a full week more than once per quarter, people notice.

Partners and senior associates talk shit about this persons vacation schedule all the time. It’s a bad look. This person doesn’t know their own rep, and they’ll truly never recover, and I’m not sure when someone will tell them.

I can’t aince I never worked directly with the person and I just know their rep because everyone at a mid/senior level is chatty and gossipy. Kinda poisonous group, but, just throwing this out there all the same.

I think a week in Jan/feb and a week in June is fine, but if you have another week in August and another in November...?

Of course if you want to leave before your fourth year, then fuck it and just vacationmax. No reason to let this shit rattle you unless you want to stick around long-term. Lawyers are too conflict averse to raise it directly and the firm games aren’t worth playing unless you’re legit gunning partner

[nixy]

A long weekend in June isn’t a week in June, though.

[Anonymous User]

I don’t think a vacation in February and taking a vacation again in June is “soon” by anyone’s definition.

[s1m4]

At my firm in my practice group, there is a second year who always lines his/her vacations up with holidays or long weekends, such that the “vacation days” pile up such that this person basically takes 5 weeks of vacation a year. When you’re talking a full week more than once per quarter, people notice.

Partners and senior associates talk shit about this persons vacation schedule all the time. It’s a bad look. This person doesn’t know their own rep, and they’ll truly never recover, and I’m not sure when someone will tell them.

I can’t aince I never worked directly with the person and I just know their rep because everyone at a mid/senior level is chatty and gossipy. Kinda poisonous group, but, just throwing this out there all the same.

I think a week in Jan/feb and a week in June is fine, but if you have another week in August and another in November...?

Of course if you want to leave before your fourth year, then fuck it and just vacationmax. No reason to let this shit rattle you unless you want to stick around long-term. Lawyers are too conflict averse to raise it directly and the firm games aren’t worth playing unless you’re legit gunning partner

Is it considered a vacation when you are factoring in weekend time and holiday time? seems just like a few days off every few months, no?

[BrainsyK]

Is it considered a vacation when you are factoring in weekend time and holiday time? seems just like a few days off every few months, no?

The optics matters a lot more than the technicalities. This person isn't actually taking more days. It just looks and feels like they are.

[LaLiLuLeLo]

Is it considered a vacation when you are factoring in weekend time and holiday time? seems just like a few days off every few months, no?

The optics matters a lot more than the technicalities. This person isn't actually taking more days. It just looks and feels like they are.

Wut? Everyone is getting the holidays off, so not sure how it “looks and feels” like more days. If they take the Friday off before a 3 day weekend, everyone is getting Monday off. This person also gets Friday off. Not sure how that’s OMG HORRIBLE OPTICS. Isn’t it better that they take one or two day instead of five to get a week off?

Shit, I’m glad I don’t work with you guys...

[LBJ's Hair]

I mean if you're a "good" associate, nobody gives a shit if your vacation lines up with a holiday. if you're "bad," you could take it at the least-disruptive time possible and the minute you're gone, everyone will say "what a lazy piece of shit."

like idk if you read that partner complaining about the associate's vacation schedule as a complaint about the schedule, and not the associate, that seems very....credulous.

[Anonymous User]

What I meant is that this person takes the 4 days of a "shortened" week off, so they effectively take the full week off but only use 4 days.

They do that four times, and suddenly they've only used 16 days for four weeks of vacation instead of the 20 the firm allots.

That leaves them 4 more days, which they again use for another shortened week.

The result is that they take 5 week-long "vacations" (even though they take the same number of technical vacation days as other people). In terms of staffing and deal flow and general disruption, it ends up feeling like a whole extra vacation even if it's technically the same number of vacation days.

Point taken on the "complaint about the schedule vs complaint about the associate" point. The associate is already borderline disliked by a lot of the seniors and partners, and the optics of having manufactured an extra week of vacation has just sort of solidified this person on the shitlist.

OP -- if you're otherwise well-liked and whatnot, my read is that a long-ish vacation in Feb and an extra-day long weekend in June is surely fine. Just go with it and don't let the job consume your life except when it absolutely needs to.

[2013]

OP is in Asia, so it may differ. I could honestly see the culture there being completely different and thinking this is unacceptable.

However, if the partners you work for are from the states, it may not matter to them.

[BasilHallward]

What I meant is that this person takes the 4 days of a "shortened" week off, so they effectively take the full week off but only use 4 days.

They do that four times, and suddenly they've only used 16 days for four weeks of vacation instead of the 20 the firm allots.

That leaves them 4 more days, which they again use for another shortened week.

The result is that they take 5 week-long "vacations" (even though they take the same number of technical vacation days as other people). In terms of staffing and deal flow and general disruption, it ends up feeling like a whole extra vacation even if it's technically the same number of vacation days.

Point taken on the "complaint about the schedule vs complaint about the associate" point. The associate is already borderline disliked by a lot of the seniors and partners, and the optics of having manufactured an extra week of vacation has just sort of solidified this person on the shitlist.

OP -- if you're otherwise well-liked and whatnot, my read is that a long-ish vacation in Feb and an extra-day long weekend in June is surely fine. Just go with it and don't let the job consume your life except when it absolutely needs to.

I love everyone's optimism in this thread. Yes, the firm "allots" 20 days, but every junior associate knows that you're never truly on vacation. I don't know a first year who is peacing out in June for a week to go on vacation. That's why the best time as a junior (especially litigation) is before and after Xmas. You can feasibly take 12-14 days around that time because work slows down and the offices are sparsely populated. All things being equal, lol at a week vacation every quarter. I know every office and group is different and the Asia office thing throws a different color on this discussion. Nevertheless, I get the sense that this thread is setting a general rule for junior associates. I'm all for work/life balance and putting up boundaries. Again, if you're well liked and good at what you do, it's cool. But then you'll just be busy on vacation logging in remotely. It's a double-edged sword.

[Anonymous User]

What I meant is that this person takes the 4 days of a "shortened" week off, so they effectively take the full week off but only use 4 days.

They do that four times, and suddenly they've only used 16 days for four weeks of vacation instead of the 20 the firm allots.

That leaves them 4 more days, which they again use for another shortened week.

The result is that they take 5 week-long "vacations" (even though they take the same number of technical vacation days as other people). In terms of staffing and deal flow and general disruption, it ends up feeling like a whole extra vacation even if it's technically the same number of vacation days.

Point taken on the "complaint about the schedule vs complaint about the associate" point. The associate is already borderline disliked by a lot of the seniors and partners, and the optics of having manufactured an extra week of vacation has just sort of solidified this person on the shitlist.

OP -- if you're otherwise well-liked and whatnot, my read is that a long-ish vacation in Feb and an extra-day long weekend in June is surely fine. Just go with it and don't let the job consume your life except when it absolutely needs to.

I love everyone's optimism in this thread. Yes, the firm "allots" 20 days, but every junior associate knows that you're never truly on vacation. I don't know a first year who is peacing out in June for a week to go on vacation. That's why the best time as a junior (especially litigation) is before and after Xmas. You can feasibly take 12-14 days around that time because work slows down and the offices are sparsely populated. All things being equal, lol at a week vacation every quarter. I know every office and group is different and the Asia office thing throws a different color on this discussion. Nevertheless, I get the sense that this thread is setting a general rule for junior associates. I'm all for work/life balance and putting up boundaries. Again, if you're well liked and good at what you do, it's cool. But then you'll just be busy on vacation logging in remotely. It's a double-edged sword.

I'm puzzled. What's wrong with a week vacation every quarter? How else do people take vacation? Is taking a 20-day vacation around Xmas better than taking a vacation each quarter? Or are you suggesting people shouldn't use all their vacation days?

[BasilHallward]

What I meant is that this person takes the 4 days of a "shortened" week off, so they effectively take the full week off but only use 4 days.

They do that four times, and suddenly they've only used 16 days for four weeks of vacation instead of the 20 the firm allots.

That leaves them 4 more days, which they again use for another shortened week.

The result is that they take 5 week-long "vacations" (even though they take the same number of technical vacation days as other people). In terms of staffing and deal flow and general disruption, it ends up feeling like a whole extra vacation even if it's technically the same number of vacation days.

Point taken on the "complaint about the schedule vs complaint about the associate" point. The associate is already borderline disliked by a lot of the seniors and partners, and the optics of having manufactured an extra week of vacation has just sort of solidified this person on the shitlist.

OP -- if you're otherwise well-liked and whatnot, my read is that a long-ish vacation in Feb and an extra-day long weekend in June is surely fine. Just go with it and don't let the job consume your life except when it absolutely needs to.

I love everyone's optimism in this thread. Yes, the firm "allots" 20 days, but every junior associate knows that you're never truly on vacation. I don't know a first year who is peacing out in June for a week to go on vacation. That's why the best time as a junior (especially litigation) is before and after Xmas. You can feasibly take 12-14 days around that time because work slows down and the offices are sparsely populated. All things being equal, lol at a week vacation every quarter. I know every office and group is different and the Asia office thing throws a different color on this discussion. Nevertheless, I get the sense that this thread is setting a general rule for junior associates. I'm all for work/life balance and putting up boundaries. Again, if you're well liked and good at what you do, it's cool. But then you'll just be busy on vacation logging in remotely. It's a double-edged sword.

I'm puzzled. What's wrong with a week vacation every quarter? How else do people take vacation? Is taking a 20-day vacation around Xmas better than taking a vacation each quarter? Or are you suggesting people shouldn't use all their vacation days?

Great use of anon. Of course, taking a vacation every quarter is better. I just don't see how one is getting a real week off every quarter, without needing to login remotely for 4 hours a day and taking calls, etc. as a junior associate. There's nothing "wrong" with it. I'm just not condoning a message were 1st/2nd year associates should be expecting that to be the norm and start booking flights for a week in Cabo in May or June. I wish it was the norm, but it's definitely the exception IME.

[Excellent117]

Great use of anon. Of course, taking a vacation every quarter is better. I just don't see how one is getting a real week off every quarter, without needing to login remotely for 4 hours a day and taking calls, etc. as a junior associate. There's nothing "wrong" with it. I'm just not condoning a message were 1st/2nd year associates should be expecting that to be the norm and start booking flights for a week in Cabo in May or June. I wish it was the norm, but it's definitely the exception IME.

I've taken at least 3-4 total weeks of completely unplugged vacations (at all times of the year) every year since I started in biglaw, even at the most junior level. Never received any pushback and never came close to missing my hours as a result. Just communicate with your teams, line up coverage, and be willing to return the favor for other colleagues and you'll be fine.

Now, it's obviously going to vary by office/firm, but I don't believe my experience is as atypical as you seem to believe.

[Guchster]

Great use of anon. Of course, taking a vacation every quarter is better. I just don't see how one is getting a real week off every quarter, without needing to login remotely for 4 hours a day and taking calls, etc. as a junior associate. There's nothing "wrong" with it. I'm just not condoning a message were 1st/2nd year associates should be expecting that to be the norm and start booking flights for a week in Cabo in May or June. I wish it was the norm, but it's definitely the exception IME.

I've taken at least 3-4 total weeks of completely unplugged vacations (at all times of the year) every year since I started in biglaw, even at the most junior level. Never received any pushback and never came close to missing my hours as a result. Just communicate with your teams, line up coverage, and be willing to return the favor for other colleagues and you'll be fine.

Now, it's obviously going to vary by office/firm, but I don't believe my experience is as atypical as you seem to believe.

Same here. After my second year in big law, I have taken a 1.5-2 week vacation every year (I find you get the most bang for your buck enjoyment wise the longer you're away at one time) than piecemealing weekends here and there--plus people leave you alone if they know you'll be gone that long and you're more likely to be disciplined about lining up coverage. I've never heard a single thing about it in a negative manner. I had to cancel a vacation once for a client because of an urgent manner but took off 2 weeks a month later after the deal closed.

As others have echoed, what matters most is that you communicate as early as possible and remind your teams as your vacation approaches and line up coverage appropriately. Where people get burned is when they try to be sneaky or hide vacations or too embarrassed to raise it and then your teams get screwed when you're out of pocket but didn't set things up in advance.

IMHO, the best time to max your vacation is when you're junior. When you get more senior, it's harder to unplug because of the need to maintain client relationships and the difficulty in trusting your clients with others (also the fear of your clients using another firm while your away and taking away future work). When you're junior, someone else can fill your role and get the job done.

[Guchster]

OP to answer your question, I don't see a problem at all with the timing of your proposed vacations.