NYU Tax LLM best, but possible? Forum

[Anonymous User]

I'm set to graduate from a T14 and am headed to a V50 tax practice in DC with a ~3.5 GPA. I know that the conventional wisdom is that a NYU Tax LLM is king, but would I even be competitive with my median GPA? Would it just be better/more feasible to do a GULC Tax LLM in my case?

[Anonymous User]

Timeout. I’m confused. Why would you go to an LLM? I went to an LLM and I wouldn’t have even considered it if I had a tax offer at a v50.

Wait for your firm to offer to pay for your LLM. You probably won’t end up with better options by getting an LLM.

Also, I had a 3.4 at a t25 and got in within days of applying to all the top LLM programs. You’d have no problem.

[Anonymous User]

Current NYU Tax LLM here. I would be SHOCKED if you did not get into NYU.

[Anonymous User]

Timeout. I’m confused. Why would you go to an LLM? I went to an LLM and I wouldn’t have even considered it if I had a tax offer at a v50.

Wait for your firm to offer to pay for your LLM. You probably won’t end up with better options by getting an LLM.

Also, I had a 3.4 at a t25 and got in within days of applying to all the top LLM programs. You’d have no problem.

Several of my firm's partners already have one, and they said that the firm would gladly pay for it, so funding/internal optics shouldn't be a problem. Re: why? My T14 has probably the most robust tax offerings outside of GULC/NYU, so I ended up taking a lot of our Tax LLM classes and enjoyed them. I'd like to continue learning some new tax concepts/skills/code provisions, get an addition to my firm bio, and possibly use it down the road to use to go in-house for a Director/VP of Tax role at a F500. One of my parents is actually a F500 Tax VP but came up from the accounting side and doesn't know much about law credentials, so I figured I could get a better assessment here. Does that seem unreasonable (genuine question)?

Glad to hear you had success getting into the top programs. Did you go solely in an attempt to land a big law gig? Regardless, did you find it worthwhile?

Also, @Current NYU Tax LLM, thanks for the response!

[QContinuum]

Timeout. I’m confused. Why would you go to an LLM? I went to an LLM and I wouldn’t have even considered it if I had a tax offer at a v50.

Wait for your firm to offer to pay for your LLM. You probably won’t end up with better options by getting an LLM.

Also, I had a 3.4 at a t25 and got in within days of applying to all the top LLM programs. You’d have no problem.

+1 to the above. OP, you'll get in to NYU, no problem (and probably with a scholarship to boot), but why would you even want to go? You already have a tax offer at a V50. NYU's the best Tax LL.M. program in the country, but its students still struggle to land BigLaw - Big4 is a much more realistic outcome, and even that is competitive and not by any means assured (unlike BigLaw from a T13 J.D. program).

So why would you want to pay for a fourth year of law school? Not only would you spend time and money (at least COL, even if you get a full-tuition scholarship), you might even hurt your chances, because once you're in the Tax LL.M. program, you'll be judged relative to your peers in the Tax LL.M. program, and grades will (once again) take on paramount importance. If you don't get great grades as a LL.M. student, you could very possibly end up with a worse outcome than your current one. You'd be frittering away a sure thing - the advantage of your T13 J.D., with a strong GPA and a freaking V50 tax offer to boot! - for a very uncertain gamble, where at best, if you get stellar grades, you'd end up with a similar V50 tax offer. It ain't worth it.

[Anonymous User]

Timeout. I’m confused. Why would you go to an LLM? I went to an LLM and I wouldn’t have even considered it if I had a tax offer at a v50.

Wait for your firm to offer to pay for your LLM. You probably won’t end up with better options by getting an LLM.

Also, I had a 3.4 at a t25 and got in within days of applying to all the top LLM programs. You’d have no problem.

+1 to the above. OP, you'll get in to NYU, no problem (and probably with a scholarship to boot), but why would you even want to go? You already have a tax offer at a V50. NYU's the best Tax LL.M. program in the country, but its students still struggle to land BigLaw - Big4 is a much more realistic outcome, and even that is competitive and not by any means assured (unlike BigLaw from a T13 J.D. program).

So why would you want to pay for a fourth year of law school? Not only would you spend time and money (at least COL, even if you get a full-tuition scholarship), you might even hurt your chances, because once you're in the Tax LL.M. program, you'll be judged relative to your peers in the Tax LL.M. program, and grades will (once again) take on paramount importance. If you don't get great grades as a LL.M. student, you could very possibly end up with a worse outcome than your current one. You'd be frittering away a sure thing - the advantage of your T13 J.D., with a strong GPA and a freaking V50 tax offer to boot! - for a very uncertain gamble, where at best, if you get stellar grades, you'd end up with a similar V50 tax offer. It ain't worth it.

Shoot, I just realized I may not have been clear. I would be doing my Tax LLM online part-time while working at the firm. Of course, at GULC I would do it part-time but physically. Hope that helps on the advice giving. Sorry for the lack of clarity!

[QContinuum]

Shoot, I just realized I may not have been clear. I would be doing my Tax LLM online part-time while working at the firm. Of course, at GULC I would do it part-time but physically. Hope that helps on the advice giving. Sorry for the lack of clarity!

Got it, thanks for the clarification. Since your firm wants you to do the LL.M. and will be funding it, by all means do it. Georgetown is fine too if more convenient for you since you won't be using the LL.M. to try to get a new job, and if (when) you lateral down the road, Georgetown is still prestigious enough that it won't hold you back.

I might go with Georgetown in your shoes because I prefer attending class physically. I'm not a fan of distance education. But, that's just me. If you're okay with (or even prefer) distance ed, don't let me influence you away from NYU.

Also check out http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=299119 which I think you'll find relevant.

[jrc]

Just wanted to bump this thread. How did it shake out? Similar set of circumstances, but with at 3.2 from a T14. I’m at a V100 firm in Texas, but will be an M&A associate and hoping to use the LLM to make my way over to tax. I am indifferent to GT or NYU as I have enough GI bill to cover fully both online programs.

[Anonymous User]

Tax associate at Biglaw without an LLM. In NYC. I had the option to get an LLM with firm money but didn't do it. It is very hard to balance school and work, and I just decided I'd rather keep my limited amount of personal time personal. Hours in transactional tax are not the best not because your total billable hours are high but because we all go with the deal flow. Especially in your first two years, you often get something between 5-7 pm and then you stay up until 12-2 working. More seniority helps, but the transactional nature dictates the hours. I have a co-worker who is going to school part-time, and my co-worker just cramps all online courses 2-3 days before the exam. Some partners definitely appreciate when their associates get an LLM, and OP's situation is probably like this. That being said, my firm told us that they wanted us to have the option (read: we should seriously consider doing it); half of the associates still didn't do it and we are fine. OP, I am not trying to convince you that you shouldn't do it; just want to offer some perspective. In terms of laterals, in tax, it's more about your class year (3-6th years are the sweet spot) and that you work at a Biglaw; an LLM gives you more credential, but not sure if it's worth the extra amount of time you have to sacrifice.

[Anonymous User]

Just wanted to bump this thread. How did it shake out? Similar set of circumstances, but with at 3.2 from a T14. I’m at a V100 firm in Texas, but will be an M&A associate and hoping to use the LLM to make my way over to tax. I am indifferent to GT or NYU as I have enough GI bill to cover fully both online programs.

Anon above. Have you tried to apply to an entry-level position at another firm first? If you are not bound to TX, try NY (more positions). Your V100 experience will open a few doors for you. Then prepare a compelling story as to why you want to do tax and be able to explain well why you are not doing tax now (if asked). I know that people in your shoes have got interviews. See if you can get a good recruiter specializing in tax; that can help, too.

[Anonymous User]

Just wanted to bump this thread. How did it shake out? Similar set of circumstances, but with at 3.2 from a T14. I’m at a V100 firm in Texas, but will be an M&A associate and hoping to use the LLM to make my way over to tax. I am indifferent to GT or NYU as I have enough GI bill to cover fully both online programs.

Anon above. Have you tried to apply to an entry-level position at another firm first? If you are not bound to TX, try NY (more positions). Your V100 experience will open a few doors for you. Then prepare a compelling story as to why you want to do tax and be able to explain well why you are not doing tax now (if asked). I know that people in your shoes have got interviews. See if you can get a good recruiter specializing in tax; that can help, too.

I went to the NYU LLM and have lateraled since landing at my first firm. When I was lateraling, a lot of the posts seemed to require an LLM. The unfortunate thing with tax hiring is that 1) most firms don’t want entry level tax associates and 2) to the extent that they do, they end up hiring the top students from NYU/GT through resume drops and TIP.

I know you probably won’t want to take the hit to pay, but one Avenue I’ve seen people take is doing a tax court clerkship instead of an LLM. A couple of my colleagues did this and they seemed to enjoy their time at the tax court.

Edit: my first firm told me afterwards that it wouldn’t have hired me if I didn’t have my LLM.

[jrc]

Thank you both for the responses. No idea why it is not letting me PM you guys directly (probably too new). Unfortunately for family reasons I am in Texas for the foreseeable future so moving to NYC or doing the Tax clerk option is kinda off the table. Also, I'm a little hesitant in this economic situation to shop around for a Tax position while I have an M&A position in hand. Also to clarify, I am not currently at the law firm. I graduate in May and start the M&A position come October. The purpose of the post was mostly to see if the original poster was accepted at NYU with his stats. My intent was to gauge acceptance rates b/c I am in a similar situation with lower G.P.A.

[Anonymous User]

Thank you both for the responses. No idea why it is not letting me PM you guys directly (probably too new). Unfortunately for family reasons I am in Texas for the foreseeable future so moving to NYC or doing the Tax clerk option is kinda off the table. Also, I'm a little hesitant in this economic situation to shop around for a Tax position while I have an M&A position in hand. Also to clarify, I am not currently at the law firm. I graduate in May and start the M&A position come October. The purpose of the post was mostly to see if the original poster was accepted at NYU with his stats. My intent was to gauge acceptance rates b/c I am in a similar situation with lower G.P.A.

If you go to a T14, you will get into NYU with any gpa.

I graduated from a top-30 and was barely median when I applied and I got in within two weeks.