Weil NYC Info Forum

[bananasfloat]

Will be there as a 2L SA this May and am just hoping to get a sense of the office. Any tips would also be appreciated, either about Weil or being an SA in general

[KunAgnis]

I've read that some accepted summers will often ask to visit the office before the internship to meet with attorneys and have a better idea of the office's culture/relationships/etc. You could probably do this, if you aren't able to get a more substantive response on this thread.

[Anonymous User]

Will be there as a 2L SA this May and am just hoping to get a sense of the office. Any tips would also be appreciated, either about Weil or being an SA in general

Summered and spent my first 2 years there. Not really sure that you need any sort of advanced knowledge. Just focus on school, relax when you can, and enjoy the summer associate experience. That's about it.

[Nagster5]

I summered there as a 1L and did a touch back as a 2L. I ended up going elsewhere, but I enjoyed my time there. There's a lot of events, very little work, and nice people. Just be friendly, do what you're asked, and be where you're told. If you do that, you'll be fine. Happy to answer any specific questions.

[Anonymous User]

Don’t join the restructuring group if you value a personal life

[Anonymous User]

Don’t join the restructuring group if you value a personal life

Am in restructuring group, can confirm.

[Anonymous User]

Don’t join the restructuring group if you value a personal life

Am in restructuring group, can confirm.

More details? Hours? the work assigned to junior associates? On-call all the time ?

[Anonymous User]

Summered there and accepted the offer.

Many thoughts on the Weil summer program. They will be throwing money at you (haha, not too literally but seriously, the pay is ridiculous). The NY summer program is so extravagant (read, extra). There are multiple social events each week, you're set up with lunches all the time, and you have a "sibling" (mentor) who will take you out for random stuff (like lunch or snack or coffee in the middle of the day). If you get a lot of work, then you're doing the summer wrong. What you should be doing is enjoying as much of the program as you can. You'll feel busy because of all the social events, trainings, and work that you'll get.

The associates will have a (possibly many) email threads about the work that you and your fellow SAs do that you are not privy to. The main focus of these threads are to make fun of the bad work SAs do, and the like. Your goal here is to not stand out as very bad. My sibling told me about some of the bad SAs when I was there (but don't worry because everyone got an offer anyway). They talk about how they have to redo SA work that wasn't good enough. Workwise, you'll get a coordinator who will ask you for your preferences and they will try to assign you to work that matches with your interests although sometimes this doesn't always work out (my coordinator once gave me an IP assignment and excitedly told me that she nabbed it for me because of my interest in IP, however, I have zero interest in IP and actually hate it very much--point is, they try). Also they try to manage your workload so you don't get too much.

I think the Weil conference rooms will be renovated by the time summer rolls around so you'll probably have regional weekend this year. It's a weekend where they fly in all US office SAs. The weekend will be great for you because you're a NY SA and you'll feel right at home. It'll be a little weird for the regional office SAs because there will be so many of you and so few of them. Try to be nice to them and befriend some, they're usually nice people. They will make you do some embarrassing stuff, but all in all, it'll be fun. Look forward to the summer because you won't experience anything like it again. It's fun, no prep needed. Just don't be a weirdo.

[Anonymous User]

Don’t join the restructuring group if you value a personal life

Am in restructuring group, can confirm.

More details? Hours? the work assigned to junior associates? On-call all the time ?

Look at the cases they filed recently. There is no respite. There are crazies well over 3 thousand hours

[Anonymous User]

Also steer clear of securities lit. They party super hard, but they also work really hard and don't treat their junior associates well. Someone I know used to be in that group and they started with a class of 5-6 first years, and by the time the summer rolled around (less than a year later) attrition was so high there was only one first year left in that group. I heard some partners are yellers, and senior associates (possibly now partners) like to throw juniors under the bus. My friend said that at one point they billed like 300 hours in a month, and that was normal. [small caveat, this was 2-3 years ago, so I don't know how dated this information is. maybe someone currently there can confirm/deny]

The general lit group is super cool though. CCL (complex commercial lit) has great people, although it isn't a specialty in and of itself so they tend to be more of support for other groups that need lit specialty (like they do lit work for BFR sometimes, and their associates get loaned out if they're not busy).

[Anonymous User]

Also steer clear of securities lit. They party super hard, but they also work really hard and don't treat their junior associates well. Someone I know used to be in that group and they started with a class of 5-6 first years, and by the time the summer rolled around (less than a year later) attrition was so high there was only one first year left in that group. I heard some partners are yellers, and senior associates (possibly now partners) like to throw juniors under the bus. My friend said that at one point they billed like 300 hours in a month, and that was normal. [small caveat, this was 2-3 years ago, so I don't know how dated this information is. maybe someone currently there can confirm/deny]

The general lit group is super cool though. CCL (complex commercial lit) has great people, although it isn't a specialty in and of itself so they tend to be more of support for other groups that need lit specialty (like they do lit work for BFR sometimes, and their associates get loaned out if they're not busy).

Lol, 300 hours is not a big deal for the restructuring group. Hell even one of the paralegals just had an article written about him for billing 430 hours in one month to the sears bankruptcy

[Anonymous User]

Also steer clear of securities lit. They party super hard, but they also work really hard and don't treat their junior associates well. Someone I know used to be in that group and they started with a class of 5-6 first years, and by the time the summer rolled around (less than a year later) attrition was so high there was only one first year left in that group. I heard some partners are yellers, and senior associates (possibly now partners) like to throw juniors under the bus. My friend said that at one point they billed like 300 hours in a month, and that was normal. [small caveat, this was 2-3 years ago, so I don't know how dated this information is. maybe someone currently there can confirm/deny]

The general lit group is super cool though. CCL (complex commercial lit) has great people, although it isn't a specialty in and of itself so they tend to be more of support for other groups that need lit specialty (like they do lit work for BFR sometimes, and their associates get loaned out if they're not busy).

Lol, 300 hours is not a big deal for the restructuring group. Hell even one of the paralegals just had an article written about him for billing 430 hours in one month to the sears bankruptcy

Am in restructuring group, just had our annual associate townhall, restructuring hours were 400+ hours above corporate on average for the third year in a row. 300 hour months are common.

[flanrigget]

Am in restructuring group, just had our annual associate townhall, restructuring hours were 400+ hours above corporate on average for the third year in a row. 300 hour months are common.

Do you at least get bigger bonuses?

[Anonymous User]

Am in restructuring group, just had our annual associate townhall, restructuring hours were 400+ hours above corporate on average for the third year in a row. 300 hour months are common.

Do you at least get bigger bonuses?

Lol no

[Anonymous User]

Am in restructuring group, just had our annual associate townhall, restructuring hours were 400+ hours above corporate on average for the third year in a row. 300 hour months are common.

Do you at least get bigger bonuses?

Lol no

Worst paid associates in the entire firm (on an hourly basis once you factor in NY cost of living and hours worked).

The entire firm counts on all the business that BFR generates and yet the firm doesn’t even acknowledge that by throwing a few extra grand at the associates for way above hour associates like Kirkland would. Instead, Barry wolf says every restructuring attorney in the country should want to come work here. News flash Barry, it looks like a bunch of associates are about to jump ship (and if the rumors are true, a ton of Laterals have been given offers and almost none have accepted).

[LBJ's Hair]

Am in restructuring group, just had our annual associate townhall, restructuring hours were 400+ hours above corporate on average for the third year in a row. 300 hour months are common.

Do you at least get bigger bonuses?

Lol no

Worst paid associates in the entire firm (on an hourly basis once you factor in NY cost of living and hours worked).

The entire firm counts on all the business that BFR generates and yet the firm doesn’t even acknowledge that by throwing a few extra grand at the associates for way above hour associates like Kirkland would. Instead, Barry wolf says every restructuring attorney in the country should want to come work here. News flash Barry, it looks like a bunch of associates are about to jump ship (and if the rumors are true, a ton of Laterals have been given offers and almost none have accepted).

Not going to Weil, but 2L SA and will be doing a rotation through R&F at another firm, so curious: How are the exit options from Weil BFR? (Like if this is a scenario where you get railed for a few years but can leave to do some moonshot stuff, can see it being worth it.)

[Anonymous User]

Am in restructuring group, just had our annual associate townhall, restructuring hours were 400+ hours above corporate on average for the third year in a row. 300 hour months are common.

Do you at least get bigger bonuses?

Lol no

Worst paid associates in the entire firm (on an hourly basis once you factor in NY cost of living and hours worked).

The entire firm counts on all the business that BFR generates and yet the firm doesn’t even acknowledge that by throwing a few extra grand at the associates for way above hour associates like Kirkland would. Instead, Barry wolf says every restructuring attorney in the country should want to come work here. News flash Barry, it looks like a bunch of associates are about to jump ship (and if the rumors are true, a ton of Laterals have been given offers and almost none have accepted).

Not going to Weil, but 2L SA and will be doing a rotation through R&F at another firm, so curious: How are the exit options from Weil BFR? (Like if this is a scenario where you get railed for a few years but can leave to do some moonshot stuff, can see it being worth it.)

My sibling was in the restructuring group and I did a rotation during my summer. They said if you're very lucky/good, you can land at a hedge fund that specializes in distressed companies. Other than that there's not great exit options compared to other corporate practices. Obviously in-house people don't really need you (unless they are repeat creditors, in which case you're not positioned super well coming from a huge debtor shop like Weil/Kirkland). If you want to be in a firm for the rest of your life, you're really well positioned to leave to a lower ranked bankruptcy practice and make a run at partner.

[LBJ's Hair]

Am in restructuring group, just had our annual associate townhall, restructuring hours were 400+ hours above corporate on average for the third year in a row. 300 hour months are common.

Do you at least get bigger bonuses?

Lol no

Worst paid associates in the entire firm (on an hourly basis once you factor in NY cost of living and hours worked).

The entire firm counts on all the business that BFR generates and yet the firm doesn’t even acknowledge that by throwing a few extra grand at the associates for way above hour associates like Kirkland would. Instead, Barry wolf says every restructuring attorney in the country should want to come work here. News flash Barry, it looks like a bunch of associates are about to jump ship (and if the rumors are true, a ton of Laterals have been given offers and almost none have accepted).

Not going to Weil, but 2L SA and will be doing a rotation through R&F at another firm, so curious: How are the exit options from Weil BFR? (Like if this is a scenario where you get railed for a few years but can leave to do some moonshot stuff, can see it being worth it.)

My sibling was in the restructuring group and I did a rotation during my summer. They said if you're very lucky/good, you can land at a hedge fund that specializes in distressed companies. Other than that there's not great exit options compared to other corporate practices.

Right, so does this actually happen--like are there people who you/your sibling knows personally who have done this? Or is this something that people talk about in an abstract sense--because it *could* happen bc it "makes sense"--but no one has actually done it?

The "bankruptcy->distressed" trope comes up occasionally on here, and I find it intriguing but would like to see actual examples of it occurring in practice

[spidey314]

My sibling was in the restructuring group and I did a rotation during my summer. They said if you're very lucky/good, you can land at a hedge fund that specializes in distressed companies. Other than that there's not great exit options compared to other corporate practices.

Right, so does this actually happen--like are there people who you/your sibling knows personally who have done this? Or is this something that people talk about in an abstract sense--because it *could* happen bc it "makes sense"--but no one has actually done it?

The "bankruptcy->distressed" trope comes up occasionally on here, and I find it intriguing but would like to see actual examples of it occurring in practice

Adding on to this, would it be easier or more difficult to make that transition from a top-tier debtor (K&E/Weil) than creditor (DPW) practice?

[Anonymous User]

My sibling was in the restructuring group and I did a rotation during my summer. They said if you're very lucky/good, you can land at a hedge fund that specializes in distressed companies. Other than that there's not great exit options compared to other corporate practices.

Right, so does this actually happen--like are there people who you/your sibling knows personally who have done this? Or is this something that people talk about in an abstract sense--because it *could* happen bc it "makes sense"--but no one has actually done it?

The "bankruptcy->distressed" trope comes up occasionally on here, and I find it intriguing but would like to see actual examples of it occurring in practice

Adding on to this, would it be easier or more difficult to make that transition from a top-tier debtor (K&E/Weil) than creditor (DPW) practice?

My intuition is that you will be better off from a debtor firm. The ultimate goal of Distressed activist HF or credit funds is to control the debtor, fix its operational/capital structure problems, and liquidate at a higher value. The debts that they either take out from themselves (DIP) or buy from other creditors (fulcrum security) usually serve that purpose eventually through an debt equity swap. Even though there are funds who buy a shit ton of secured or unsecured debts without converting to equity but try to influence the Rx plan as an activist creditor, the focus is still on debtor’s going concern. So it’s not the experience with loan instruments that matters; it’s the understanding of debtor’s problems and experience of wrestling with other creditors. Experience representing creditors may focus more on residual value but less on the debtor’s going concern.

However, those buy sides recruit lawyers primarily because they understand the complex legal process, so maybe working at a debtor law firm and a creditor law firm is not that different in that respect.

BTW you don’t even see the Rx Big law -> Distressed shift much today; most lawyers who made the switch did it during the wild west of this type of alternative investments. Today if those funds need someone who understands the legal process and can read legal documents, a second/third year EB Rx analyst will do just fine. Skill sets learned in big law is only marginally transferable.

[Anonymous User]

Am in restructuring group, just had our annual associate townhall, restructuring hours were 400+ hours above corporate on average for the third year in a row. 300 hour months are common.

Do you at least get bigger bonuses?

Lol no

Worst paid associates in the entire firm (on an hourly basis once you factor in NY cost of living and hours worked).

The entire firm counts on all the business that BFR generates and yet the firm doesn’t even acknowledge that by throwing a few extra grand at the associates for way above hour associates like Kirkland would. Instead, Barry wolf says every restructuring attorney in the country should want to come work here. News flash Barry, it looks like a bunch of associates are about to jump ship (and if the rumors are true, a ton of Laterals have been given offers and almost none have accepted).

Not going to Weil, but 2L SA and will be doing a rotation through R&F at another firm, so curious: How are the exit options from Weil BFR? (Like if this is a scenario where you get railed for a few years but can leave to do some moonshot stuff, can see it being worth it.)

My sibling was in the restructuring group and I did a rotation during my summer. They said if you're very lucky/good, you can land at a hedge fund that specializes in distressed companies. Other than that there's not great exit options compared to other corporate practices.

Right, so does this actually happen--like are there people who you/your sibling knows personally who have done this? Or is this something that people talk about in an abstract sense--because it *could* happen bc it "makes sense"--but no one has actually done it?

The "bankruptcy->distressed" trope comes up occasionally on here, and I find it intriguing but would like to see actual examples of it occurring in practice

Yes, it happens, and it happens now. More likely to rx banking rather than buy-side though. I personally know former Weil bfr associates who moved to vp level in ib, and not during the “Wild West” as the poster above writes. That being said, not common, and it’s rough gig.

[Anonymous User]

Yes Rx banking has a robust hiring for Weil Gotshal Rx lawyers but i was talking about distressed buy side (I said funds and alt. investments). buy and sell sides are two completely different beasts especially when it comes to hiring

[LBJ's Hair]

Seconding above, banking isn't remotely comparable. If you wanna do that, just do your 2L summer at an investment bank and skip the BigLaw part.

[Anonymous User]

Not responding to any post in particular, but why do rx lawyers glamorize rx banking? Are your hours/comp really any better? Just trying to understand the appeal of making that transition.

[LBJ's Hair]

I think it's the perception of this like, massive compensation differential that's like 10-15 years out of date at this point.

Ten years ago, i.e., pre-crisis investment bankers were making money comparable to that of private equity and hedge funds; you could make $500K easily as a junior investment banking associate. Everyone wanted to do it out of MBA, blah blah blah. So yeah, woking in BigLaw fucking sucked by comparison. You were working super hard for nothing, when the bankers on the other side of the deal were swimming in cash.

That is not remotely the case anymore. Investment banking compensation has fallen materially in nominal (not just absolute, nominal) terms. Investment banking analysts uniformly leave for the buyside after two years; it's not "cool" to do out of HBS or Wharton or GSB. And a relatively senior managing director at JPMorgan might make ~$3-4 million in an average year now, which is what he would have made as a junior director pre-crisis. (And a lot of that is going to be in stock.) If you ever get a chance, ask a 50something MD at one of the big banks about comp in the "old days" vs now. It's hilarious/depressing.

But anyway, lawyers, who don't know anything about the industry, lump banking-PE-HF all in as just "finance" and think banking is still a way to get crazy rich. Maybe they have buddies from college who did banking for two years and have a lot of money now (from their buyside job) and associate that with "being a banker." Like you hear people talk about this in the M&A context, as though leaving Skadden's corporate group or w/e to go to banking is some path to riches. Maybe at a few boutiques, I guess? But on the whole...not really. Especially factoring in shittier job security, transferability of skillset, and extreme variability in compensation.