Spouse advice Forum

[Hiphopanonyspouse]

thanks I got some good info. Appreciated

[emkay625]

Hi there! We need some more information to be helpful here.

Which school is your spouse at? (You can just give us a range....by Ivy League do you mean HY or do you mean Penn/Cornell?)

What are his grades like? Experience prior to law school?

Where is he from originally?

What happened to him at 2L OCI? Did he choose not to participate? Or did he strike out?

Is he not interested in clerkships? (I assume no, 3L year would be a little late to pursue them).

Once we have these answers we can offer you more insight and help.

[Anonymous User]

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[UVA2B]

Which school is your spouse at? (You can just give us a range....by Ivy League do you mean HY or do you mean Penn/Cornell?)

- T10 Ivy but not H or Y.

What are his grades like? Experience prior to law school?
- solid b+s and some As. He worked in gov and was in the military before. He also has professors that want him to work with them on writing and research.

Where is he from originally?
- same city he's in school

What happened to him at 2L OCI? Did he choose not to participate? Or did he strike out?
- stuck out at big law. But also wanted to try court time.

Is he not interested in clerkships? (I assume no, 3L year would be a little late to pursue them).
- he is interested.

Thanks for any input.
I just feel so stressed out as the only person with an income. We have very modest loans to cover childcare costs so I can work.

I don't have any advice to offer, but I'm sorry things haven't been working out for him. I'm also shocked that a veteran at Columbia or Penn with median or above median grades struck out at OCI. He should definitely try to line up a clerkship, which could salvage his opportunity to end up in a big firm. It might be a little late, but if you're/he's willing to be a little less picky and mail out applications to every Art. III judge out there, he might be able to land something. Following the clerkship, he would have a definite shot of getting into biglaw in Philly or NYC.

[A. Nony Mouse]

To be honest I think you need to be talking to him, and he needs to be the one reaching out for advice.

[Nagster5]

This is odd. Above median at Penn with military experience should almost certainly land at least one biglaw offer absent some glaring X factor. He'll likely be fine financially with those credentials, unless there's something seriously wrong with his resume/personality that made him strike out. Based on the info you've given, seems like he's in a pretty good position to land something even if it's not biglaw. Assuming he's on GIB your loans are going to be minimal so you should be fine financially, especially if you're going to be working as well. The more concerning thing is his lack of communication, but a lot of my soldiers were the same way when it came to finances/professional matters. Can't tell you anything more without more info, feel free to PM me.

[Anonymous User]

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[Hiphopanonyspouse]

This is odd. Above median at Penn with military experience should almost certainly land at least one biglaw offer absent some glaring X factor. He'll likely be fine financially with those credentials, unless there's something seriously wrong with his resume/personality that made him strike out. Based on the info you've given, seems like he's in a pretty good position to land something even if it's not biglaw. Assuming he's on GIB your loans are going to be minimal so you should be fine financially, especially if you're going to be working as well. The more concerning thing is his lack of communication, but a lot of my soldiers were the same way when it came to finances/professional matters. Can't tell you anything more without more info, feel free to PM me.

Thanks, I'll PM you

[Roy McAvoy]

To be honest I think you need to be talking to him, and he needs to be the one reaching out for advice.

[emkay625]

The folks posting above are correct. A veteran at median at a T14 school should have had no problem getting big law at OCI, unless there was something else wrong. How is he at interviews? Did he do any mock interviews with the folks at career services?

But really, unless he's the one seeking help, our advice won't matter. He's got the credentials, just seems like he needs to figure out something that's hitching him up in the application process.

[Hiphopanonyspouse]

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[Raiden]

I currently work as a prosecutor and while the pay is not the best, I am able to support my family and also recently purchased a home. My wife does not work either. I understand circumstances are different for each person, but if he does land a DA job after taking the bar, don't be too discouraged. Moreover, the work he is doing now (law clerk, intern) is different than the work he'd start off doing as a misdemeanor attorney. He might enjoy filing cases.

[MKC]

Your husband should probably make an account so everyone can tell him to start mass mailing. (and how to mass mail)

[Hiphopanonyspouse]

Thanks all.

[A. Nony Mouse]

To be honest I think you need to be talking to him, and he needs to be the one reaching out for advice.

Yes. I've tried. Multiple times and he either gets defensive or says it'll work out and not to worry.

I mean this nicely, honestly, but no one here will be able to change that.

[Hiphopanonyspouse]

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[cron1834]

It's pretty uncommon to go from DA to biglaw. What is less uncommon, tho, is changing your mind while you're in law school. Husband should apply to every Federal clerkship he can, and apply to every firm that hires rising 3Ls, after developing a reasonable story as to why he didn't do biglaw this summer.

As others have said, a vet with above-average grades at Penn or Columbia striking out from OCI is pretty rare, so I'd ask bluntly whether he was just not into the interviews or if there's something weird about his personality that shows up in them. There's a 95% chance one of those things is the case.

[Raiden]

It's pretty uncommon to go from DA to biglaw. What is less uncommon, tho, is changing your mind while you're in law school. Husband should apply to every Federal clerkship he can, and apply to every firm that hires rising 3Ls, after developing a reasonable story as to why he didn't do biglaw this summer.

As others have said, a vet with above-average grades at Penn or Columbia striking out from OCI is pretty rare, so I'd ask bluntly whether he was just not into the interviews or if there's something weird about his personality that shows up in them. There's a 95% chance one of those things is the case.

Yeah it is difficult to make that jump. Even for AUSA's, it's not easy to transfer to biglaw. He'd have a solid chance at a midsize firm though, and from there possibly lateral up to big law further down in his career.

But I think there is an underlying issue of finances that seems to be bothering you that you need to sit down and talk together with him.

[A. Nony Mouse]

To be honest I think you need to be talking to him, and he needs to be the one reaching out for advice.

Yes. I've tried. Multiple times and he either gets defensive or says it'll work out and not to worry.

I mean this nicely, honestly, but no one here will be able to change that.

I'm not asking anyone to change it. Im used to it.
I was asking for experiences - maybe someone worked at a DA office and didn't end up there...

Yeah, I'm sorry, I didn't word that well. What I meant was that I don't think you asking for advice for him is going to change the situation.

But FWIW, people do go on to get other jobs from spending the summer at a DA's office. Also frankly if he can get a job at the DA's office, a job is better than no job (in terms of moving on to other things in the future).

[pancakes3]

Also, Honors bigfed apps are under way where his vet boost would be even greater.

He's got to apply though (both literally and figuratively). It feels like he backed his way into this DA position.

Also, maybe his grades aren't as he's told you?

[lolwat]

Wait. I saw this in the mix:

He's got a few OCIs coming up, but it's not enough and they aren't local enough.

Where is he from originally?
- same city he's in school

I mean fuck, this is kind of a guessing game.
There's only two possible schools, right? Columbia and Penn.
Now if he's at Columbia, and looking in NYC, it seems like there's almost a certainty he'd be getting biglaw with his stats.
But no, it sounds like he's at Penn, and he's only looking locally -- say, in Philly.

Isn't that the problem? I mean yeah, with his stats, school, and ties, he shouldn't have too much of a problem getting biglaw in Philly or whatever, but that's a much, much, much smaller market than biglaw in NYC.

[TheJanitor6203]

I agree with the advice that he should look at clerkships. If he lands a clerkship, he'll certainly end up in big law after (assuming he wants to). I secured a clerkship at the beginning of my 3L year so I know it's still possible at this point. Although, it may be somewhere you don't really want to live for a year. Having been in the military, I'm sure ya'll are used to living in a shitty place for a while. It's not the end of the world and it's totally worth it for a clerkship. But it's only a year.

Also, assuming people are correct and y'all are in Philly and that's where y'all want to stay, can he not look at firms and NYC and commute for a year or two until he can lateral to a Philly firm? I'm sure that would suck giant balls but if big law is the goal and you're not willing to move for it, it's an option at least.

[A. Nony Mouse]

If he lands a clerkship, he'll certainly end up in big law after (assuming he wants to).

This may well be the case, but it's not guaranteed. People have posted here who haven't been able to get into big law after a clerkship, generally people who didn't get biglaw the first time around.

(I definitely agree a clerkship is a good option for getting back into biglaw, just wanted to temper the above statement.)

[njdevils2626]

Assuming you guys are in Philly, he should also broaden his parameters to looking at Delaware firms. The commute wouldn't be bad, he'd probably be pretty competitive (though it would obviously depend on what openings firms have), and Biglaw market there is higher than in Philly

[elendinel]

Why is there such a concern about him not getting biglaw, specifically? Is it that he hates the DA's office and it looks like that's his only option for a job, period, or are you concerned you won't have enough money to do _____ if he's at the DA's office/not in biglaw?

If it's the former:
- if he likes the DA's office but not trials, specifically, he could try getting a semester internship in the appeals group, if they'll let him
- there are options other than biglaw, like clerkships, midlaw, fed, smaller firms, nonprofits, etc., most of which don't hire at OCI; he's not stuck at the place he interns 2L summer, as long as he does some hustling now.

If it's the latter:
- maybe it's just time to start making plans that don't require him having that biglaw salary? If he still gets it it'll be a bonus for you guys, but you may be causing your own stress by assuming you need that biglaw salary to live comfortably.

I echo other people's general sentiments that we can tell you what he could do, but it doesn't matter much if he doesn't want to do those things. It's also kind of concerning that he's not at least telling you that all these other career options exist, since he should know about them and it's not unreasonable for a spouse to want to know what those options are and which ones the spouse plans to pursue.