3L OCI Thread. Forum

[Anonymous User]

So far I've seen Kirkland advertising for 3Ls.


Anyone else see anything?

I'll be applying primarily to non law firm gigs, but I want to trade up markets and firms if I stay in law.

[Anonymous User]

What Kirkland offices?

[Anonymous User]

What Kirkland offices?

I'm not sure, it's from my friend who is at Columbia.

[Anonymous User]

Kirkland does a lot of 3L oci because they have about a 60% offer rate for the 2ls summering with them.

[JMWZ]

Kirkland does a lot of 3L oci because they have about a 60% offer rate for the 2ls summering with them.

That is pretty stupid. Both NALP (http://www.nalpdirectory.com/employer_p ... hCondJSON=) and Vault (http://www.vault.com/company-profiles/l ... rview.aspx) show 100% offer rate. I understand that math is hard though.

[Anonymous User]

Kirkland does a lot of 3L oci because they have about a 60% offer rate for the 2ls summering with them.

Anon flame. Kirkland is extremely busy firm wide. Last year they hired on some of their SAs to work part time remotely during 3L to help balance out the workload of their junior associates. The firm is very very healthy and looking to grow hence the uptick in hiring. Pretty much the opposite of what you said incorrectly.

[Anonymous User]

Any firms other than Kirkland?

[Anonymous User]

Checking in. Kirkland And Cravath are all I've seen so far.

[Anonymous User]

For those of us summering at a firm and looking to trade up, do we accept the current firm offer when the summer ends here shortly then trade up if and when another offer pans out? Is it bad form to do so? To renege later on?

[Anonymous User]

Skadden NY, SullCrom Palo Alto

[Anonymous User]

Latham, Cleary DC, Kirkland Chicago, Seward and Kissel

[Anonymous User]

Paul Weiss, Kirkland (Chicago), Patterson Belknap, White and Case (Mandarin speakers)

[Anonymous User]

For those of us summering at a firm and looking to trade up, do we accept the current firm offer when the summer ends here shortly then trade up if and when another offer pans out? Is it bad form to do so? To renege later on?

Yes, unless you'd rather the possibility of ending up with no job in the end.

[Anonymous User]

What's the protocol for firms that give really quick dings at this phase in the game? There's been a couple of firms that I've gotten quick responses from (~24hrs) that definitely have had to resort to hiring 3Ls in the past, and it seems unlikely that they'd be certain thattheir class is a 100% yield this early in the game, especially given how some of these firms have handled the raise issue. Is it worth it to re-submit in like mid-August, or should we just count these ones out?

[Anonymous User]

What's the protocol for firms that give really quick dings at this phase in the game? There's been a couple of firms that I've gotten quick responses from (~24hrs) that definitely have had to resort to hiring 3Ls in the past, and it seems unlikely that they'd be certain thattheir class is a 100% yield this early in the game, especially given how some of these firms have handled the raise issue. Is it worth it to re-submit in like mid-August, or should we just count these ones out?

If you were dinged, then consider yourself out. Otherwise they would have given you the silent treatment until they needed you.

[oblig.lawl.ref]

For those of us summering at a firm and looking to trade up, do we accept the current firm offer when the summer ends here shortly then trade up if and when another offer pans out? Is it bad form to do so? To renege later on?

Yes, unless you'd rather the possibility of ending up with no job in the end.

My understanding was that it is poor form to accept and renege an offer. The advice I always heard and followed was to try to get an offer prior to your offer expiring. Per NALP they normally give you like 60 days IIRC. But yeah, if you have to, I would accept and renege but I wouldn't do that if you still have time to decide/accept.

[Anonymous User]

For those of us summering at a firm and looking to trade up, do we accept the current firm offer when the summer ends here shortly then trade up if and when another offer pans out? Is it bad form to do so? To renege later on?

Yes, unless you'd rather the possibility of ending up with no job in the end.

My understanding was that it is poor form to accept and renege an offer. The advice I always heard and followed was to try to get an offer prior to your offer expiring. Per NALP they normally give you like 60 days IIRC. But yeah, if you have to, I would accept and renege but I wouldn't do that if you still have time to decide/accept.

I "traded up" as a 3L. Most (all?) firms give their SAs until Oct 1st to accept their return offers. It's standard - I think it's a NALP rule. This was true for my firm as well as every one of my friends' firms. In contrast, firms you didn't summer at will give you 28 days to accept their offers (this definitely is a NALP rule).

The 3L timeline is a lot more individualized, and can be very drawn out because firms are still figuring out their hiring needs. If you're dong it right and are competitive, you'll probably start getting offers from other firms in early-mid August. This means your new offers will often expire long before your SA firm's offer. So the problem is not really getting a second offer before your SA firm's offer expires, but getting 3rd/4th/etc. offers from your preferred firms before the 2nd firm's offer expires.

In my case, I got an offer from a firm I liked more than my summer firm in mid August, which expired in early-mid September. However, there were a couple firms I liked even more that scheduled callbacks with me in early-mid September (pushing right against my 2nd offer deadline). So, I emailed the 2nd firm's hiring partner and he was happy to extend my deadline to Oct 1st to match my SA firm.

Ended up getting an offer from my "dream" firm (oh naivety...) in mid September. Took a week to think it over and accepted in late September. So, everything ended up working out.

TL; DR - You have til Oct 1st for SA firm, but 28 days for new firms, which can be extended upon request.

[Anonymous User]

What grades are considered competitive for a 3L interested in NYC? I'm around median at MVP, and am nervous because V20's do most of the 3L hiring. Will they drop down to my level? Do any V50's commonly hire 3Ls?

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know of anyone who has had their offer at their 2L firm reneged after the firm found out they were applying to other firms?

[deuceindc]

What grades are considered competitive for a 3L interested in NYC? I'm around median at MVP, and am nervous because V20's do most of the 3L hiring. Will they drop down to my level? Do any V50's commonly hire 3Ls?

Does your school not make that data available? Mich absolutely does.

[Anonymous User]

What grades are considered competitive for a 3L interested in NYC? I'm around median at MVP, and am nervous because V20's do most of the 3L hiring. Will they drop down to my level? Do any V50's commonly hire 3Ls?

Does your school not make that data available? Mich absolutely does.

No! Jealous that you guys get that

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know of anyone who has had their offer at their 2L firm reneged after the firm found out they were applying to other firms?

What? Does this actually happen?

[Anonymous User]

What grades are considered competitive for a 3L interested in NYC? I'm around median at MVP, and am nervous because V20's do most of the 3L hiring. Will they drop down to my level? Do any V50's commonly hire 3Ls?

Does your school not make that data available? Mich absolutely does.

No! Jealous that you guys get that

The data is available at my school (CCN), but the #'s are so small that it's tough to draw conclusions from it.

[Anonymous User]

I received a post-grad offer from my 2L SA firm. How should I indicate this on my resume (if I should at all)?

[Anonymous User]

I received a post-grad offer from my 2L SA firm. How should I indicate this on my resume (if I should at all)?

I'm the anon from above who "traded up" as a 3L and talked about the offer timelines. Here's what I did, which I think worked really well:

Update your resume with your summer firm and include specific descriptions of what you actually did during the summer (i.e. "drafted X, performed due diligence for Y, etc."). Below the description of what you did, include a separate bullet point that says "received an offer to return." This will also help you spin your story about why you're looking around from before the interview even starts (i.e. really enjoyed Y and Z tasks and working for X type clients, so am looking around to see if maybe I can find somewhere that will maximize my chances to do that).

I think the #1 biggest concern for firms that are interviewing 3Ls who summered elsewhere is whether the person was no-offered. I did quite a few callbacks and it came up in almost every interview. Having it on my resume did two things: (1) it addressed the elephant in the room when the firm was deciding whether to interview me based on my resume/transcript; and (2) it let the interviewer say "so I see you got an offer to return, what prompted you to look around?" rather than "so did you get an offer to return (skeptically)?" Basically, it helped me start the interviews off on the right foot.

Hope that helps.