Easier for patent students to find jobs? Forum

[Anonymous User]

Several of my T14 classmates with degrees in science and engineering claim that it will be easier for them to find patent-oriented 1L summer associate positions than it is for other law students for the remaining areas of law (corporate, litigation, etc.). Is that true? And if so, how much easier? And will they have an easier time finding 2L and full-time positions at high-paying firms?

[Anonymous User]

Yes to all the above if science/engineering background is in a high demand field. I'm at a T40, have a CS degree, and had upwards of 50 interviews between OCI and Loyola Patent Fair...almost all of them for high paying firms.

As for 1L summer jobs, it may still be difficult. It was for me at least.

[Anonymous User]

I know a kid with an EE background that landed an excellent west coast firm for his 1L SA; he seemed like he had good grades on top of the background, but I can't say for sure. There seem to be a lot of IP specific opportunities at OCI and other job fairs, and that background certainly won't hurt your chances.

Generally speaking, I doubt you can quantify "easiness" of getting hired in any meaningful way. If you shit your pants during the interview (literally or figuratively), you're not getting hired regardless of your qualifications. Best guess, an IP background might lower the GPA threshold for certain firms, but you probably won't have much choice about your future practice area.

[Anonymous User]

Absolutely.

My partner is a double EE and biomed engineering major and she was flooded with job opportunities in biglaw. Her credentials are in such high demand at her firm - she works far fewer hours than most biglaw attorneys because 1) she has so much work and the nature of IP litigation allows her to reach billables in a far more efficient manner and 2) her firm gives her so much leeway in terms of "having a life" because they know she constantly is being searched out by recruiters.

And from what she tells me, her firm is getting exceedingly desperate for IP attorneys. The job market for attorneys with hard science background is so much different because you are insulated from the oversaturation of attorneys who don't have this pedigree.

If you have a hard science background, you should seek out part-time employment doing patent prosecution during school. It pays well and you end up with some valuable exp on your resume that gives you an even bigger leg up in the market.

[Anonymous User]

I am a 1L at a T14, and several of my classmates with degrees in science and engineering claim that it will be easier for them to find patent-oriented 1L summer associate positions than it is for other law students for the remaining areas of law (corporate, litigation, etc.). Is that true?

Yes

And if so, how much easier?

I had my two 1L summer associateships lined up before March, with a single semester of median grades on my resume. I ended up declining a third, and didn't apply to a bunch of other good opportunities that I got after I accepted the first two jobs. Out of around 15 other patent bar eligible classmates, I know for sure that 12 or so had something patent-related going on their 1L summer.

And will they have an easier time finding 2L and full-time positions at high-paying firms?

Absolutely. As for personal experience, I had 3 offers coming out of OCI, all at big law firms or big corporations. I had another two offers from my 1L firms. Of my 15ish patent bar eligible classmates, I can't think of one who isn't doing at least a half-summer at a big law firm in their 2L summer.

[Anonymous User]

I am a 1L at a T14, and several of my classmates with degrees in science and engineering claim that it will be easier for them to find patent-oriented 1L summer associate positions than it is for other law students for the remaining areas of law (corporate, litigation, etc.). Is that true?

Yes

And if so, how much easier?

I had my two 1L summer associateships lined up before March, with a single semester of median grades on my resume. I ended up declining a third, and didn't apply to a bunch of other good opportunities that I got after I accepted the first two jobs. Out of around 15 other patent bar eligible classmates, I know for sure that 12 or so had something patent-related going on their 1L summer.

And will they have an easier time finding 2L and full-time positions at high-paying firms?

Absolutely. As for personal experience, I had 3 offers coming out of OCI, all at big law firms or big corporations. I had another two offers from my 1L firms. Of my 15ish patent bar eligible classmates, I can't think of one who isn't doing at least a half-summer at a big law firm in their 2L summer.

This is all pretty much me, too - CS & hard science degrees, median-ish grades at a T20. Purposefully limited my 1L summer job search to biglaw in one particular secondary market, so I only sent out 18 "mass" emails. Got four callbacks and two offers. Liked it at my 1L summer firm, and I'm going back there next summer. Can't think of any patent bar eligibles in my class who came up dry.

[Anonymous User]

Does the above still apply if you've had a smattering of Biology, Chemistry and Physics courses in undergrad - enough to be patent bar eligible, but no degree in a hard science?

[ScottRiqui]

Does the above still apply if you've had a smattering of Biology, Chemistry and Physics courses in undergrad - enough to be patent bar eligible, but no degree in a hard science?

I think it will be somewhat of a disadvantage no matter what - if you look at firm bios, most patent attorneys (on the prosecution side, at least) seem to have hard science degrees, with EE/CS favored heavily.

But I think it would depend partly on your actual major, too; if it's something sufficiently "tech-y", but that just doesn't qualify for eligibility under Category A, that will put you in a different position compared to someone who has a liberal arts degree but took enough science courses to be eligible under Category B.

Take all this with a big grain of salt, though - I don't think I know anyone personally who got their eligibility under Category B or C.

[Anonymous User]

I am a 1L at a T14, and several of my classmates with degrees in science and engineering claim that it will be easier for them to find patent-oriented 1L summer associate positions than it is for other law students for the remaining areas of law (corporate, litigation, etc.). Is that true?

Yes

And if so, how much easier?

I had my two 1L summer associateships lined up before March, with a single semester of median grades on my resume. I ended up declining a third, and didn't apply to a bunch of other good opportunities that I got after I accepted the first two jobs. Out of around 15 other patent bar eligible classmates, I know for sure that 12 or so had something patent-related going on their 1L summer.

And will they have an easier time finding 2L and full-time positions at high-paying firms?

Absolutely. As for personal experience, I had 3 offers coming out of OCI, all at big law firms or big corporations. I had another two offers from my 1L firms. Of my 15ish patent bar eligible classmates, I can't think of one who isn't doing at least a half-summer at a big law firm in their 2L summer.

This is pretty much my experience as well.

[Abbie Doobie]

My partner is a double EE and biomed engineering major and she was flooded with job opportunities in biglaw. Her credentials are in such high demand at her firm - she works far fewer hours than most biglaw attorneys because 1) she has so much work and the nature of IP litigation allows her to reach billables in a far more efficient manner and 2) her firm gives her so much leeway in terms of "having a life" because they know she constantly is being searched out by recruiters.

how does the nature of IP litigation allow her to reach billables compared to other types of biglaw? that just doesn't seem to make any sense.

[Anonymous User]

I quit my biglaw IP job and traveled for half a year. Still managed to snag a number of interviews with biglaw firms and in-house when jumping back into the market.

That said, don't get complacent. Getting IP jobs with a tech background is easier, but by no means is it a given. You still need to put in the effort.

[Anonymous User]

Does the above still apply if you've had a smattering of Biology, Chemistry and Physics courses in undergrad - enough to be patent bar eligible, but no degree in a hard science?

My (admittedly limited) experience tells me that just simply being patent bar eligible is a bigger benefit in patent lit than prosecution. When hiring for prosecution, firms are looking for hints that you'll be able to learn complicated technology in a short period of time. Having a smattering of courses that technically makes you patent bar eligible is the bare minimum acceptable for prosecution. There are still a ton of jobs available, but the best jobs are reserved for people with years of work experience, PhD's, and other experience that shows a firm that they are experienced in learning and working with complex technology from industry. Lit is different, because patent bar eligibility is not required. The ability to "speak the language" because you've taken classes is certainly a plus.

[pancakes3]

I quit my biglaw IP job and traveled for half a year. Still managed to snag a number of interviews with biglaw firms and in-house when jumping back into the market.

That said, don't get complacent. Getting IP jobs with a tech background is easier, but by no means is it a given. You still need to put in the effort.

Not sure if you're anecdote is going to strike the fear of grades into anyone where it isn't already but the point stands. It should be obvious that IP eligible candidates operate in the IP job market, and the IP job market albeit a smaller market, proportionately has an even smaller supply of candidates - making it easier to get a job. It's still not 1:1 though.

Also by virtue of an IP student having access to both the IP market and non-IP market kind of makes the "better prospects" argument res ipsa.

[Anonymous User]

Yes. Graduated from a tier 4 school, and started over six figures in a small market (e.g., not NYC, DC, San Fran). Ohh and I work 1/3 as hard as a big law associate.

[ballouttacontrol]

Also by virtue of an IP student having access to both the IP market and non-IP market kind of makes the "better prospects" argument res ipsa.

I don't think this is really true. After a 1L IP SA, I did horribly interviewing for the typical corporate firms in NYC. I think I got 1 non-IP CB from OCI at an upper T14 with median grades (which I cancelled). On the other hand, I had somewhere between 5 and 10 offers come in from IP places, batting average was probably around .500.

After developing a resume that demonstrates your commitment to IP law, corporate firms will be like, "Yea, OK, your resume screams IP why tf are you here?"

That said, patent law market is definitely better than our classmates--for patent qualified people. That doesn't just mean patent bar eligible, but actual patent credentials. B.S. in Chem, no sorry, it will be extremely difficult to get a patent law job. BSEE with 1 year in the industry? You're golden. Everything else is pretty much somewhere in between. If you got a BA with a minor in some sciences, it's going to be very very difficult to get a real patent shop to hire you. I had a lot of patent shops reject me for insufficient technical experience with much better credentials than that.