Should I respond? Obscene Rejection Forum

[Anonymous User]

So this just happened to me, and I want to know if it is normal? unprofessional? Effed up? or what?

I got a callback from my screener it took place in late august. We scheduled it for 2 Mondays ago. Sunday evening, they cancelled and said they'd reschedule and they'd be in touch by the end of the week. They didn't contact me. Tuesday I emailed them and once again gave them my availability. they said they'd call me Thursday, and asked what department I was interested in. Nothing. Today, I emailed them giving them my availability for next week.

I got a response saying they actually won't be able to reschedule my CB since they completed their hiring....

WTFFFFFF

[Anonymous User]

Pretty damn unprofessional. Assume it's a small firm, but worthy of outing.

[Anonymous User]

Nope V50...Considering posting it on ATL... wonder what that would do to my professional prospects

[legends159]

Don't out on ATL. No good can come to you. Sorry this happened but take the long weekend to calm down.

[emkay625]

Yeah ATL is a bad idea. I would not do this.

Do you know any attorneys at the firm? I would consider emailing them, explaining what happened (in a calm totally polite manner that doesn't seem bitter) and ask if they'd do an informational interview. This won't get you anywhere in terms of hiring, but it would at least put some folks on notice that the HR people screwed you and that maybe they should take steps to prevent that from happening.

[kcdc1]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

[071816]

order a SHITLOAD of pizzas to their office every day for the next two weeks. they'll get the picture.

[dixiecupdrinking]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

Well, a callback is an invitation to be considered for a job. It's pretty bullshit they didn't even give OP that chance.

OP, tell your career services office. This is the kind of thing that they tend to be good about dealing with. Firms and top schools have long relationships.

[Anonymous User]

This happened to me too. Wonder if it's the same firm....

[rpupkin]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

Although I understand the OP's disappointment, I have to agree with this.

[Anonymous User]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

Although I understand the OP's disappointment, I have to agree with this.

Just because they are able to be unprofessional without repercussions doesn't make it ok for them to be. Cancelling a CB to reject a candidate is already pretty terrible, and demonstrates poor planning on the firm's part. Not only that, but OP's situation piles it on:
- firm cancels literally the day before, and on a weekend
- firm doesn't inform OP that it's actually a rejection, and instead stalls
- OP has to e-mail back multiple times to get his rejection
Could you explain to me which part of this is professional ? Are you going to tell me the hiring committee meets on week-ends ? Because if not, they could just as well have called OP on Friday. They could also have told him then and there that he was rejected, which is a bit of a d*ck move but would at least have been honest.

Reminds me of another V50 this year who e-mailed everyone who CB'd at their office with an invitation to the offer dinner, and then told the people who didn't get the offer the night before.

[star fox]

Tell your CSO.

[Companion Cube]

Dude everybody agrees with you that they didn't handle it well. Sounds like all that really happened was you dodging a bullet. Good luck with the rest of your interviews and hopefully you land somewhere better.

[notgreat]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

Although I understand the OP's disappointment, I have to agree with this.

Just because they are able to be unprofessional without repercussions doesn't make it ok for them to be. Cancelling a CB to reject a candidate is already pretty terrible, and demonstrates poor planning on the firm's part. Not only that, but OP's situation piles it on:
- firm cancels literally the day before, and on a weekend
- firm doesn't inform OP that it's actually a rejection, and instead stalls
- OP has to e-mail back multiple times to get his rejection
Could you explain to me which part of this is professional ? Are you going to tell me the hiring committee meets on week-ends ? Because if not, they could just as well have called OP on Friday. They could also have told him then and there that he was rejected, which is a bit of a d*ck move but would at least have been honest.

Reminds me of another V50 this year who e-mailed everyone who CB'd at their office with an invitation to the offer dinner, and then told the people who didn't get the offer the night before.

Lol, who the fuck did this? That's terrible.

[Anonymous User]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

Although I understand the OP's disappointment, I have to agree with this.

Just because they are able to be unprofessional without repercussions doesn't make it ok for them to be. Cancelling a CB to reject a candidate is already pretty terrible, and demonstrates poor planning on the firm's part. Not only that, but OP's situation piles it on:
- firm cancels literally the day before, and on a weekend
- firm doesn't inform OP that it's actually a rejection, and instead stalls
- OP has to e-mail back multiple times to get his rejection
Could you explain to me which part of this is professional ? Are you going to tell me the hiring committee meets on week-ends ? Because if not, they could just as well have called OP on Friday. They could also have told him then and there that he was rejected, which is a bit of a d*ck move but would at least have been honest.

Reminds me of another V50 this year who e-mailed everyone who CB'd at their office with an invitation to the offer dinner, and then told the people who didn't get the offer the night before.

Lol, who the fuck did this? That's terrible.

Yeah, seriously wondering which firm this was. That's brutal.

[Anonymous User]

OP Here. Yes, what pisses me off is not the fact that they met their needs. It is the fact that I was the one who had to consistently contact them to attempt to set up a time to meet after their initial cancelation. It was the fact that they strung me along. Anyways, discussing this with my CDO. Good luck to all.

This happened in FL BTW. And Companion cube, this is my 3rd post, lol. So that wasn't me you were responding to.

[Anonymous User]

A few years ago I was flown to another city for a CB in the middle of the week. A message was waiting for me at check-in that my interview was cancelled because they hired their class. Fortunately they paid for the room -- and an impressive dinner and room service bill if I do say so myself.

These things happen. It sucks, but you'll be dealt many more sour lemons over the next 30+ years.

[RedGiant]

OP Here. Yes, what pisses me off is not the fact that they met their needs. It is the fact that I was the one who had to consistently contact them to attempt to set up a time to meet after their initial cancelation. It was the fact that they strung me along. Anyways, discussing this with my CDO. Good luck to all.

This happened in FL BTW. And Companion cube, this is my 3rd post, lol. So that wasn't me you were responding to.

Listen, this sucks. But as you go out into the world, you will see that HR/Recruiting at many places, in many industries, treat candidates in appallingly terrible ways, mostly because they can. I am truly sorry this happened to you--you did everything right. But you need to move on and target your anger toward finding a better place. Stuff like this will happen to you your whole life, unfortunately. And yes, it's egregious and awful. He who has the gold makes the rules. That's how it goes. You need them more than they need you. One day, when I am in charge, I will not treat people like this. But until then, you gotta put on your $hit-eating grin and bear it.

[nick417]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

Although I understand the OP's disappointment, I have to agree with this.

In theory I understand what you mean. It really is a waste of time to have a candidate come in for a call-back if you have no intention of extending them an offer. It not only wastes the candidates time but wastes the attorneys' time at the firm who have to interview the candidate. So I can understand the firm realizing that they may not want to interview the candidate.

But this shows poor planning on the firms part. You can tell, based on the call back process, which firms are well organized and which ones are not. This appears to be a firm that is poorly organized. I would definitely inform your career service department of this and let them handle it. Also, a firm that can't even figure out how to organize call-backs is probably not a firm you want to work for anyway.

[lavarman84]

OP Here. Yes, what pisses me off is not the fact that they met their needs. It is the fact that I was the one who had to consistently contact them to attempt to set up a time to meet after their initial cancelation. It was the fact that they strung me along. Anyways, discussing this with my CDO. Good luck to all.

This happened in FL BTW. And Companion cube, this is my 3rd post, lol. So that wasn't me you were responding to.

I think I know which firm this was. You might have dodged a bullet. Hope everything works out for you!

[Companion Cube]

OP Here. Yes, what pisses me off is not the fact that they met their needs. It is the fact that I was the one who had to consistently contact them to attempt to set up a time to meet after their initial cancelation. It was the fact that they strung me along. Anyways, discussing this with my CDO. Good luck to all.

This happened in FL BTW. And Companion cube, this is my 3rd post, lol. So that wasn't me you were responding to.

Risks of anon I suppose. Fwiw I've been strung along by a firm for over a month that have confirmed dings and offers sent out. They even invited me to a dinner long after I was certain I was getting dinged which rekindled my hope. I must be on some perpetual hold list or they legit forgot about me. It happens. I was bitter at first but I let I've long since let it go. None of it's personal, even though rejection almost always feels that way.

[kalvano]

When I was a 3L madly emailing firms for jobs, I would cold email lots of places. Most were really polite and just said "sorry, nothing available" and that was that. Now and then, some people were really nice and went out of their way to try and help, which was awesome.

But I remember getting one email - it was really rude and insulting, like I had committed some unpardonable sin by daring to email this guy. He was a massive dick.

Fast forward a couple years, and I'm happily at my current firm, and I send a default notice on behalf of a client. I get a response in the mail some days later, and then attorney's name is so familiar - yep, it was douchenozzle. His letter was simply terrible, and failed to demonstrate even basic knowledge of the issue at hand. Winning that one was particularly satisfying. I wonder if he rememberd my name.

Sometimes firms just suck. Sorry OP, but maybe one day you'll have a chance to show them the error of their ways.

[Devlin]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

Well, a callback is an invitation to be considered for a job. It's pretty bullshit they didn't even give OP that chance.

OP, tell your career services office. This is the kind of thing that they tend to be good about dealing with. Firms and top schools have long relationships.

I agree with this. While the firm screwed you, this is not outing to ATL level screwing.

Keep your head up and keep grinding.

[OneMoreLawHopeful]

I don't see how the firm erred here. Like most firms, they probably extend CB's and offers on a rolling basis. They have a target number of students to hire, and they extend enough CB's and offers to hit that target. This firm hit their target, would not be making additional offers, and decided to stop interviewing. Would you really have wanted to interview with a firm that was no longer hiring?

Well, a callback is an invitation to be considered for a job. It's pretty bullshit they didn't even give OP that chance.

OP, tell your career services office. This is the kind of thing that they tend to be good about dealing with. Firms and top schools have long relationships.

I agree with this. While the firm screwed you, this is not outing to ATL level screwing.

Keep your head up and keep grinding.

I don't know, speaking as a biglaw associate, I think the fear of "professional repercussions" from outing a firm anonymously over ATL is overblown on these forums, particularly as OP has already stated that this office was located in Florida.

Like the idea that the recruiting staff at a Florida office of some firm is going to: (1) read the story on ATL and then look up OP's name, (2) write down OP's name, keep it on file for years until OP is ultimately trying to lateral, and then (3) share OP's name with the recruiting staff at whichever firm OP is trying to lateral to...it just starts to seem absurd.

I get the whole "hey, people talk..." caution, but I think it's difficult to overstate the sheer volume of people that come in to interview (even at the CB stage) at biglaw offices every year, how easy it is to forget all of them once the process is over, and how many years are likely to pass between this incident and the next time OP would be likely to interview again. On that last point, most people don't enter the lateral market until after their 2nd year, so we're talking about a minimum of 4 years (2 more years of law school + 2 years at starter firm) before this would even be an issue again. The idea that OP's name will be somehow remembered, cursed, and passed on to other recruiters, 4 years from now (as opposed to lost in anonymity midst a sea of law students) is somewhat fantastic.

I also know that the partners at my firm tend not to care very much about ATL--over time an attitude of "Well, they're just going to report on us no matter what we do..." has developed and it's hard to see this is something they take seriously anymore. Granted, I've heard this was very different during the recession when firms were desperately trying to hide news of stealth layoffs...but in 2015? This isn't going to cause waves, much less a tsunami of shame that will hurt OP in the lateral market years from now.

NB: I'm not claiming that this rejection is actually "ATL Worthy," I don't think this is a particularly egregious rejection compared to other shit firms do...but I think the whole "REPORTING ANONYMOUSLY TO ATL WILL RUIN UR CAREER!!!1!!" thing on these boards is terribly overblown, and that we all benefit more if stuff like this is reported more openly.

[rpupkin]

Tell your CSO.

For those recommending this ITT, what do y'all think think that the CSO is going to do? Do you actually think the CSO would ban the firm (which probably regularly hires students from the school) from OCI?

Look, the firm was inconsiderate; they should have gotten back to the applicant by the end of the first week, like they said they would. I agree that the firm's conduct was unprofessional. But this kind of unprofessionalism—where you've got to follow up with someone who said they would get back to you—happens all the time. It will keep happening throughout your professional career in various contexts. Get used to it.