Paul Weiss v Proskauer (NYC) Forum

[Anonymous User]

I love both firms and I am having trouble deciding. They were both my top choices at different times during this process... I was definitely not expecting to have the opportunity to choose between them. It's a good position to be in, obviously, but now I need to choose. Any comments on their culture, on their litigation and corporate practices, and so on?

Thank you.

[Neal Patrick Harris]

PW is better in corporate, better in lit, and better in culture.

/thread.

[Anonymous User]

Can anyone else elaborate on the previous poster's post? I am actually leaning toward Proskauer right now... my preferences change every hour, though, and--again--both firms have been my top choice at various points throughout this process. I wasn't expecting to get offers from both. A bit more guidance would be helpful. I've been talking to people affiliated with the law firms who are very nice and helpful, but obviously you can't get an unbiased opinion that way. Thanks!

[Neal Patrick Harris]

Can anyone else elaborate on the previous poster's post? I am actually leaning toward Proskauer right now... my preferences change every hour, though, and--again--both firms have been my top choice at various points throughout this process. I wasn't expecting to get offers from both. A bit more guidance would be helpful. I've been talking to people affiliated with the law firms who are very nice and helpful, but obviously you can't get an unbiased opinion that way. Thanks!

http://www.chambersandpartners.com/1280 ... torial/5/1

http://www.chambersandpartners.com/1280 ... torial/5/1

[Anonymous User]

Can anyone else elaborate on the previous poster's post? I am actually leaning toward Proskauer right now... my preferences change every hour, though, and--again--both firms have been my top choice at various points throughout this process. I wasn't expecting to get offers from both. A bit more guidance would be helpful. I've been talking to people affiliated with the law firms who are very nice and helpful, but obviously you can't get an unbiased opinion that way. Thanks!

http://www.chambersandpartners.com/1280 ... torial/5/1

http://www.chambersandpartners.com/1280 ... torial/5/1

Thanks.

[Old Gregg]

I think we're getting a bit too slavish toward rankings here. I know plenty of people who love Proskauer and hate Paul Weiss, and vice versa. Chambers ratings don't help when you're feeling like shit to begin with, but I guess the "Band 1" really can make someone feel good. And I don't think "exit options" are appreciably different between the two firms.

OP, go with where you fit in the most. Paul Weiss's corporate group is not really a Paul Weiss group in the sense that it was homegrown. It was bought from the NY office of O'Melveney. Have heard that a lot of people don't enjoy the practice. It's also very PE focused, which limits exit options in its own right.

Yeah, Paul Weiss is "better" at litigation, but what that actually translates into in associate experience is unclear to me.

and better in culture.

^^^^ Worthless contribution.

[ymmv]

Gut instinct, bro. I've given up on every other metric of making this decision. Flip a coin, and if you feel bad about the result go with the opposite.

[Anonymous User]

Can't go wrong. I'm not going to either, but really enjoyed Proskauer. You very well might be more of a number at PW than Proskauer.

[Anonymous User]

Good stuff... I'm going to talk to some friends and make a decision some time next week. Like you all said, you can't go wrong either way.

Appreciate the people who added additional thought.

[Neal Patrick Harris]

and better in culture.

^^^^ Worthless contribution.

Going around threads and pointing out "worthless contributions" is, in itself, a "worthless contribution."

If you're still wondering why people don't like you, here's a data point :lol:

[Old Gregg]

and better in culture.

^^^^ Worthless contribution.

Going around threads and pointing out "worthless contributions" is, in itself, a "worthless contribution."

If you're still wondering why people don't like you, here's a data point

Actually, that's debatable. In itself, it signals that no one should pay attention to what you said. I think that's a worthwhile contribution in case people don't know you post garbage.

But even if I concede that it's worthless, I actually included a worthwhile contribution above that.

If you're still wondering why people don't like you, here's a data point

Oh FUCK. People on the internet don't like me. Not sure how I'll survive this.

[dixiecupdrinking]

I mean -- Paul Weiss is fairly unequivocally the "better" firm but the impact it will have on your life is probably close to nil. If you have a well-founded reason to think you'd rather work at Proskauer (which is unlikely but not impossible), then by all means go there. Otherwise, PW probably wins by tie-breaker.

[dixiecupdrinking]

OP, go with where you fit in the most. Paul Weiss's corporate group is not really a Paul Weiss group in the sense that it was homegrown. It was bought from the NY office of O'Melveney. Have heard that a lot of people don't enjoy the practice. It's also very PE focused, which limits exit options in its own right.

This is also true. Paul Weiss corporate is kind of a weird animal (or at least it was a few years ago when I was looking at them). I'm speaking more culturally, not exit-options wise, which is not something I claim to have any understanding of.

[Neal Patrick Harris]

and better in culture.

^^^^ Worthless contribution.

Going around threads and pointing out "worthless contributions" is, in itself, a "worthless contribution."

If you're still wondering why people don't like you, here's a data point :lol:

Actually, that's debatable. In itself, it signals that no one should pay attention to what you said. I think that's a worthwhile contribution in case people don't know you post garbage.

But even if I concede that it's worthless, I actually included a worthwhile contribution above that.

If you're still wondering why people don't like you, here's a data point :lol:

Oh FUCK. People on the internet don't like me. Not sure how I'll survive this.

There are a lot of reasons why PW has a better culture, and I could list them but I think this is a fairly obvious choice regardless.

Also, if posting a "worthwhile" contribution above the "worthless" part makes a post worthwhile, then I did the same thing and you had no reason to post in the first place.

That said, every time someone calls you out on your shitposting, you turn the thread into a pissing match so I'll bow out now and save everyone the headache.

[Old Gregg]

There are a lot of reasons why PW has a better culture, and I could list them but I think this is a fairly obvious choice regardless.

Culture is an inherently subjective concept. To say that one culture is definitely better than other is kind of stupid when people respond to different cultures in different ways. To that end, I've heard some pretty shitty things about Paul Weiss's culture.

Also, if posting a "worthwhile" contribution above the "worthless" part makes a post worthwhile, then I did the same thing and you had no reason to post in the first place.

Yeah, but dig deeper. You said nothing that OP couldn't have discovered on his/her own. So really, despite your best attempts to prove otherwise, the post was worthless.

That said, every time someone calls you out on your shitposting, you turn the thread into a pissing match so I'll bow out now and save everyone the headache.

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

[Anonymous User]

Shocked that there is any debate about this. Dude in one of my classes had a Proskauer offer in hand, spent most of every class mass-mailing any other firm that was hiring. Other than the sports law pipe dream (where they do have some credited partners doing interesting stuff, but good luck getting anywhere with that as an associate), what do they have to offer, especially in NYC?

Re: Paul Weiss, I don't think any argument even needs to be made about the litigation departments. On the assertion that the whole corp department came over from OMM, maybe you should get your information from somewhere other than ATL. Obviously taking a bunch of Apollo work from other firms has been a boon to the corporate department, but they have been a big PE group for a long time and have long-term public company clients as well (not on the level of Cravath/Skadden/Davis Polk for public company clients, but compared to Proskauer?).

[Old Gregg]

Shocked that there is any debate about this. Dude in one of my classes had a Proskauer offer in hand, spent most of every class mass-mailing any other firm that was hiring. Other than the sports law pipe dream (where they do have some credited partners doing interesting stuff, but good luck getting anywhere with that as an associate), what do they have to offer, especially in NYC?

Re: Paul Weiss, I don't think any argument even needs to be made about the litigation departments. On the assertion that the whole corp department came over from OMM, maybe you should get your information from somewhere other than ATL. Obviously taking a bunch of Apollo work from other firms has been a boon to the corporate department, but they have been a big PE group for a long time and have long-term public company clients as well (not on the level of Cravath/Skadden/Davis Polk for public company clients, but compared to Proskauer?).

Lots of misplaced focus ITT (and in this forum) on prestige and rankings. Know associates at Proskauer who work on plenty of interesting matters in the corporate group for blue chip clients. That Paul Weiss has a "better" corporate group (again, debatable, regardless of Chambers or whatever) won't really have a material impact on the associate's experience. And given that it's so PE focused, it could have a worse impact. PE-focused corporate groups tend to limit exits.

From an associate's perspective, doing a deal for Apollo (Paul Weiss) or Ares (Proskauer) is not really different and how much you "enjoy" it will come down to how much you like the people you work with. But as far as exits are concerned, no real difference.

also, anon abuse.

[Anonymous User]

Shocked that there is any debate about this. Dude in one of my classes had a Proskauer offer in hand, spent most of every class mass-mailing any other firm that was hiring. Other than the sports law pipe dream (where they do have some credited partners doing interesting stuff, but good luck getting anywhere with that as an associate), what do they have to offer, especially in NYC?

Re: Paul Weiss, I don't think any argument even needs to be made about the litigation departments. On the assertion that the whole corp department came over from OMM, maybe you should get your information from somewhere other than ATL. Obviously taking a bunch of Apollo work from other firms has been a boon to the corporate department, but they have been a big PE group for a long time and have long-term public company clients as well (not on the level of Cravath/Skadden/Davis Polk for public company clients, but compared to Proskauer?).

I agree that absent really compelling reasons for Proskauer, PW is the clear choice here. It is true that a big chunk of their corporate work is from Apollo but this poster has a point. Their two most recent big deals, as well as the Time Warner Cable one, were not Apollo related and came from home-grown partners. The OMM partners bring a whole lot of business but I think they have a somewhat more diverse corporate practice than that. Their corporate department is not the worst place to be and TBH I'd rather be there than Proskauer's corporate department if I wanted to be on big deals. Not saying that's OPs goal--just saying that. And I'm only talking corporate because litigation isn't really a question, I don't think.

[Anonymous User]

Hey, OP, what was your turn around time from CB---> Offer at PW?

Asking for a friend who is reading tea leaves...

[Anonymous User]

If you want employment/labor, go to Proskauer.

If you want basically anything else, go to Paul Weiss.


PW pros: incredible litigation firm, corporate has also come along way and is now regarded as highly as other top peer firms. Nice location in midtown, nice offices from what I remember.
PW cons: very leveraged, your partnership prospects are extremely low even if you are great.

Proskauer pros: incredible office. Great labor/employment practice.
Proskauer Cons: Times Square.

[FSK]

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