Bottom 20% Forum

[Anonymous User]

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1 L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

[20141023]

.

[dead head]

I assume you are DCNG. I hope it's not G, especially now that they have moved to a UVa style preselect-lottery blend. At any rate, bid carefully, and get input on your bid list from career services and here.

Obviously, try to better this semester. Start taking practice exams now. Talk to professors about why you did poorly last semester.

Be prepared to mass mail every firm in every major market, every market where you have ties and/or where you would be OK working. As soon as you've written your last final, get on working on cover letters and mailing lists.

Do your best this summer and hope that they offer 1L SAs the chance to return (though I'm not sure if many overseas offices do so). But I suppose the good news is that you got this position even though they saw your fall grades, so there's something in you they liked (languages?).

[Anonymous User]

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

Is it an integrated office that hires American JDs straight out of law school, or is it an associated office that is mostly filled with local lawyers? Have they given you any hint at whether they might let you come back for your 2L summer? (And are you interested in working in that country after law school?)

It's local lawyers and I wouldn't work there after law school.

[IAFG]

Your strategy for OCI is to assume nothing is going to come from OCI alone. Read up on all the ways people hustle for jobs because you're in a tough spot.

[Anonymous User]

top American or top foreign?

[Anonymous User]

I was in a similar position to you going into OCI. bottom 20% with a 1L summer SA. Unfortunately I don't think the SA itself helped. but are you K-JD? or do you have work experience? That might make a difference.

Bid as conservatively as possible and don't have any shame about it. Play up your work experience (whatever it is) and practice interviewing as much as possible.

[IAFG]

I was in a similar position to you going into OCI. bottom 20% with a 1L summer SA. Unfortunately I don't think the SA itself helped. but are you K-JD? or do you have work experience? That might make a difference.

Bid as conservatively as possible and don't have any shame about it. Play up your work experience (whatever it is) and practice interviewing as much as possible.

Yeah intuitively I would have thought a 1L SA would be a game-changer even with bad grades, but enough people have struck out despite 1L SA that I think differently now.

[Lincoln]

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1 L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

Bid for New York and whatever places you have ties. If your ties are to a market that doesn't do OCI at your school, mass mail that market like crazy.

[IAFG]

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1 L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

Bid for New York and whatever places you have ties. If your ties are to a market that doesn't do OCI at your school, mass mail that market like crazy.

You're really understating the gravity of the situation. OP needs to do a massmail campaign regardless.

[TooOld4This]

Start laying the groundwork for your 2L job now. Schedule as many informational interviews as you can. Reach out to alumni in your area that might be willing to do mock interviews. If you are traveling at all, try to schedule informational interviews then as well. The goal for all of these should be to collect enough information to demonstrate an interest in a region, firm, and/or practice area. You should also ask how each of these people would recommend conducting a job search (don't mention your grades unless you have to). Sometimes you will get bad advice, but sometimes you will get helpful advice. And generally advice is something people gladly give (it makes them feel good and takes away the feeling that the purpose of the meeting was to beg for a job).

Also start putting together a spreadsheet so you can mass mail and work on cover letters (short, but moderately tailored either on geography or practice areas). You should start mass mailing in July and the have follow up letters for early September.

Work like crazy to pull your grades up this semester. An upward trend can be helpful.

[Lincoln]

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1 L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

Bid for New York and whatever places you have ties. If your ties are to a market that doesn't do OCI at your school, mass mail that market like crazy.

You're really understating the gravity of the situation. OP needs to do a massmail campaign regardless.

I didn't phrase that properly. My point was that OP should leverage ties to any market, regardless of whether firms from that market at at OP's OCI. But I can see that it reads as if mass mailing is necessary only if that is the case, which was not what I intended to get across.

OP, what's your school? You're anonymous, so it won't out you.

[Anonymous User]

top American or top foreign?

Firm is Top American - one of the very top.

[Anonymous User]

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1 L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

Bid for New York and whatever places you have ties. If your ties are to a market that doesn't do OCI at your school, mass mail that market like crazy.

You're really understating the gravity of the situation. OP needs to do a massmail campaign regardless.

I didn't phrase that properly. My point was that OP should leverage ties to any market, regardless of whether firms from that market at at OP's OCI. But I can see that it reads as if mass mailing is necessary only if that is the case, which was not what I intended to get across.

OP, what's your school? You're anonymous, so it won't out you.

Top 10.

[20141023]

.

[Tiago Splitter]

Do all of the above, but most importantly keep grinding this semester. If you currently have like a 3.1 on a 3.3 curve you're just a decent semester from being one of many around median.

[mr.hands]

Yeah just get to 3.2-something cumulative by the end of the year and you're in the mushy middle. If you're in the 2.x range, you're in trouble

[PepperJack]

Wouldn't the fact OP has a 1L SA change the analysis? My experience was the whole value of grades lies in the fact there's nothing else to go on. There's already evidence someone else wanted them and if they get a 2L offer too that means they did a fine job.

[jbagelboy]

Wouldn't the fact OP has a 1L SA change the analysis? My experience was the whole value of grades lies in the fact there's nothing else to go on. There's already evidence someone else wanted them and if they get a 2L offer too that means they did a fine job.

Depends. This isn't a 1L SA with a firm in the states, it's a position with a foreign office. Probably HK or something like that. I know these offices will sometimes take native speakers/former residents who aren't being paid $3K/week and aren't expected to be able to return upon graduation - this type of "staff associate" thing wouldn't look quite as 'valuable' to another firm.

OP, if you don't mind me asking, are you being paid market pro rata and are they flying you out there? That's a decent indicator of your value to this "top" American firm. By "Top" I assume you mean like V20. If you got a V20 SA, that would definitely be worth holding on to since it's better than anything that could come via OCI at this point, unless you somehow got straight A's this semester. My "strategy" would be to describe this position in more detail, find out if it can become a full time offer, and leverage the shit out of it.

This is of course in addition to all the other stuff others have said

[Anonymous User]

Wouldn't the fact OP has a 1L SA change the analysis? My experience was the whole value of grades lies in the fact there's nothing else to go on. There's already evidence someone else wanted them and if they get a 2L offer too that means they did a fine job.

Depends. This isn't a 1L SA with a firm in the states, it's a position with a foreign office. Probably HK or something like that. I know these offices will sometimes take native speakers/former residents who aren't being paid $3K/week and aren't expected to be able to return upon graduation - this type of "staff associate" thing wouldn't look quite as 'valuable' to another firm.

OP, if you don't mind me asking, are you being paid market pro rata and are they flying you out there? That's a decent indicator of your value to this "top" American firm. By "Top" I assume you mean like V20. If you got a V20 SA, that would definitely be worth holding on to since it's better than anything that could come via OCI at this point, unless you somehow got straight A's this semester. My "strategy" would be to describe this position in more detail, find out if it can become a full time offer, and leverage the shit out of it.

This is of course in addition to all the other stuff others have said

It's V10, I get paid local market rate (much lower than in here), language skills helped me get the job and they have formal SA program. I'm not looking to work abroad after graduation, I am hoping to leverage this opportunity to get 2 L in one of their offices in the USA. However, i am worried that my grades might disqualify me in spite of my 1 L summer.

[IAFG]

Wouldn't the fact OP has a 1L SA change the analysis? My experience was the whole value of grades lies in the fact there's nothing else to go on. There's already evidence someone else wanted them and if they get a 2L offer too that means they did a fine job.

Depends. This isn't a 1L SA with a firm in the states, it's a position with a foreign office. Probably HK or something like that. I know these offices will sometimes take native speakers/former residents who aren't being paid $3K/week and aren't expected to be able to return upon graduation - this type of "staff associate" thing wouldn't look quite as 'valuable' to another firm.

OP, if you don't mind me asking, are you being paid market pro rata and are they flying you out there? That's a decent indicator of your value to this "top" American firm. By "Top" I assume you mean like V20. If you got a V20 SA, that would definitely be worth holding on to since it's better than anything that could come via OCI at this point, unless you somehow got straight A's this semester. My "strategy" would be to describe this position in more detail, find out if it can become a full time offer, and leverage the shit out of it.

This is of course in addition to all the other stuff others have said

It's V10, I get paid local market rate (much lower than in here), language skills helped me get the job and they have formal SA program. I'm not looking to work abroad after graduation, I am hoping to leverage this opportunity to get 2 L in one of their offices in the USA. However, i am worried that my grades might disqualify me in spite of my 1 L summer.

And they might. Having a 1L SA isn't necessarily a game-changer. Focus on getting your grades up, then put together a good massmail campaign and bid conservatively.

As an aside, if your question is really "should I still make a run at V10 firms with this on my résumé?" In general the more selective firms are still attainable lower in your bid list, or through open sign up, because the majority of students know they aren't getting them.

[Over the top]

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1 L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

Is it an integrated office that hires American JDs straight out of law school, or is it an associated office that is mostly filled with local lawyers? Have they given you any hint at whether they might let you come back for your 2L summer? (And are you interested in working in that country after law school?)

It's local lawyers and I wouldn't work there after law school.

[20141023]

.

[dead head]

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1 L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

My grades are at the bottom 20% at T14. I have a 1L paid SA position abroad at a top law firm for the entire summer.
What should my strategy be for OCI? Ultimately, my goal is to get a job, any job...

Is it an integrated office that hires American JDs straight out of law school, or is it an associated office that is mostly filled with local lawyers? Have they given you any hint at whether they might let you come back for your 2L summer? (And are you interested in working in that country after law school?)

It's local lawyers and I wouldn't work there after law school.

Pretty sure he was merely saying that the 1L SA isn't a pipeline to permanent employment at that office (which doesn't seem to hire US grads, let alone entry-level ones).

[bk1]

I was in a similar position to you going into OCI. bottom 20% with a 1L summer SA. Unfortunately I don't think the SA itself helped. but are you K-JD? or do you have work experience? That might make a difference.

Bid as conservatively as possible and don't have any shame about it. Play up your work experience (whatever it is) and practice interviewing as much as possible.

Yeah intuitively I would have thought a 1L SA would be a game-changer even with bad grades, but enough people have struck out despite 1L SA that I think differently now.

Based on what I've seen, I definitely agree. I just haven't seen any difference during 2L fall recruiting between people who had 1L SAs and those who didn't.