Big/Mid-Law Labor/Employment Firms? Forum

[Anonymous User]

I'm interested in any biglaw or midlaw sized firms that have a pretty strong L/E practice. I know of a few (Littler, Seyfarth) but I'm looking to expand my list, esp for firms that might be more GPA friendly. Location is not a significant factor for me since I am massmailing right now.

[FitterHappier289]

Some off the top of my head.

Big: Morgan Lewis, Jones Day, Orrick, Proskauer, Paul Hastings

Mid: Jackson Lewis, Epstein Becker

[Anonymous User]

Some off the top of my head.

Big: Morgan Lewis, Jones Day, Orrick, Proskauer, Paul Hastings

Mid: Jackson Lewis, Epstein Becker

Jackson Lewis has 700+ attorneys. Definitely not mid.

[Anonymous User]

ogletree deakins as well.

[FitterHappier289]

Some off the top of my head.

Big: Morgan Lewis, Jones Day, Orrick, Proskauer, Paul Hastings

Mid: Jackson Lewis, Epstein Becker

Jackson Lewis has 700+ attorneys. Definitely not mid.

Didn't realize; touche. Epstein might also qualify for Big too.

[Lasers]

I don't believe orrick has a large l&e practice, actually.

[FitterHappier289]

I'm not sure the numbers, but I think it's pretty well thought of. At least it used to be. Chambers Band 3 in NY FWIW.

[PDL]

Ogletree Deakins, Littler Mendelson, and Jackson Lewis are huge firms specializing in labor and employment. Fisher & Phillips and Ford Harrison are pretty large, as well. Morgan Lewis has a huge L&E practice.

[Anonymous User]

OP here, thanks to everyone who replied. If anyone has any more suggestions for L/E firms please share, especially if they are still hiring.

Thanks!

[JCougar]

A lot of labor and employment firms are moving towards hiring laterals. Seyfarth no longer has a summer program, and LM and OD hire very few summers, focusing more on the lateral market. Paul Hastings you need to go to a T14 AND be on law review. And the EEOC has had a hiring freeze for like the last three years. They won't even replace people when they retire. You can try and get an unpaid internship there, though. The Department of Labor still has an honors program, but it's even more selective than Biglaw...you better go to a top 20 school and be Order of the Coif.

If you don't have anything at this point, your best bet is to try and network with smaller plaintiff firms or state government agencies and prepare yourself to take a $40-50K salary for 2-3 years, unless you're cum laude from a T14. Your career options will be a lot better after that.

Bottom line is that, in this area of law, attorneys with 0 years of experience are worth little more than dog shit. Law school doesn't teach you how to do litigation, and hardly anyone wants to pay for your training.

Best advice I could give is to try and find a small firm you can intern with during 3L working as many hours a week as you can, and hope to get an offer when you graduate.

[JCougar]

But one mid-sized but national L&E defense boutique not mentioned so far is Constangy, Brooks & Smith. They're only L&E (like LM, OD, FH, etc.), but they just have smaller offices. I'm not sure if they pay market or not. I'm guessing it's a little less.

[Anonymous User]

JCougar is pretty spot-on. I was fortunate enough to get a first-year associate position from one of the big L&E firms mentioned earlier. OP can PM me -- I might be of some assistance.

[Lasers]

JCougar is pretty spot-on. I was fortunate enough to get a first-year associate position from one of the big L&E firms mentioned earlier. OP can PM me -- I might be of some assistance.

please pm me, anon.

[Anonymous User]

JCougar is pretty spot-on. I was fortunate enough to get a first-year associate position from one of the big L&E firms mentioned earlier. OP can PM me -- I might be of some assistance.

please pm me, anon.

Sorry, are you the anon poster you quoted or are you asking the quoted poster to contact you?

[Lasers]

JCougar is pretty spot-on. I was fortunate enough to get a first-year associate position from one of the big L&E firms mentioned earlier. OP can PM me -- I might be of some assistance.

please pm me, anon.

Sorry, are you the anon poster you quoted or are you asking the quoted poster to contact you?

asking that anon poster to contact me since i can't pm him; had a few questions for him.

[Anonymous User]

A lot of labor and employment firms are moving towards hiring laterals. Seyfarth no longer has a summer program, and LM and OD hire very few summers, focusing more on the lateral market. Paul Hastings you need to go to a T14 AND be on law review. And the EEOC has had a hiring freeze for like the last three years. They won't even replace people when they retire. You can try and get an unpaid internship there, though. The Department of Labor still has an honors program, but it's even more selective than Biglaw...you better go to a top 20 school and be Order of the Coif.

If you don't have anything at this point, your best bet is to try and network with smaller plaintiff firms or state government agencies and prepare yourself to take a $40-50K salary for 2-3 years, unless you're cum laude from a T14. Your career options will be a lot better after that.

Bottom line is that, in this area of law, attorneys with 0 years of experience are worth little more than dog shit. Law school doesn't teach you how to do litigation, and hardly anyone wants to pay for your training.

Best advice I could give is to try and find a small firm you can intern with during 3L working as many hours a week as you can, and hope to get an offer when you graduate.

Paul Hastings doesn't necessarily require law review/top grades for l&e - I'm median at MVP with offers at PH and other l&e firms. PH NY, though, aims to only hire 1-2 SAs that will join l&e.

Also, while DOL honors does depend on grades, your commitment to doing this type of work shown through past experiences is going to matter exponentially more. I know of honor attorneys with slightly-above median grades from non T-20, albeit they are in regional offices.

[crumpetsandtea]

JCougar is pretty spot-on. I was fortunate enough to get a first-year associate position from one of the big L&E firms mentioned earlier. OP can PM me -- I might be of some assistance.

please pm me, anon.

Me too please!

[JCougar]

Paul Hastings doesn't necessarily require law review/top grades for l&e - I'm median at MVP with offers at PH and other l&e firms. PH NY, though, aims to only hire 1-2 SAs that will join l&e.

I almost had a job at PH because I used to work in HR for one of their main clients, but I ended up getting median grades at a school significantly below MVP for Biglaw purposes. I did a lot of research on them and met their chief L&E partners at some networking events. They seemed to like me, but after finding out my grades they never returned any e-mails. However, it seems almost unheard of for them to hire outside the T14 without being a lateral, and everyone I saw was on law review. Maybe if you go as high as MVP, they'll look past that. PH is supposed to be one of those firms more impressed by work experience, but the thing is, there's few enough positions open that they can ask for T14, work experience, and law review and still get mostly what they're looking for.

Also, while DOL honors does depend on grades, your commitment to doing this type of work shown through past experiences is going to matter exponentially more. I know of honor attorneys with slightly-above median grades from non T-20, albeit they are in regional offices.

This thread pretty much sums up DOL Honors:

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=189821

They hire mostly AIII clerks and law reviewers at T20 schools. I actually heard "top 20" straight from a DOL worker's mouth. It's possible that the one person you know is an extreme exception...depends on which field office it is.

Again, this is one of those circumstances where, yes, your background matters, but there's 10 or so positions open nationally, and with legal hiring in the state that it's in, they can ask for background, law review, and T20 and still pretty much get what they want.

The lateral market in L&E is strong, however, so if you can get 1-3 years of experience at some fly-by-night plaintiff's shop or a state agency--as long as it's handling real cases instead of just doing doc review/other various chores--chances are you can lateral to an employer-side firm or the DOL if you do a good job where you're at and network. But good luck getting a job at a good plaintiff's firm straight out of law school. Even these firms basically require you to have at least a year of experience in public interest/employment before they hire you.

And even the crappy L&E plaintiff firms want people with actual litigation experience, because they, above all others, can't babysit you while you learn how to file a petition/motion, and otherwise manage a case. So even these $40K/year jobs are going to people who did serious intern work at a firm for more than just a summer when in law school.

[DwightSchruteFarms]

Add Littler Mendelson and Lewis Brisbois to that list

[JCougar]

I wasn't sure, so I had to check my symplicity account, and yes, the DOL honors program did OCI at my school. I have a Master's Degree in the field, 4 years of work experience in HR, and political volunteer experience on top of that that would fit in with their mission. Despite coming to my school, they didn't even give me the courtesy of an interview. They announced their class rank cutoff at top 20%, and I was well below that, so my work experience meant nothing to them.

I do not think it is reasonable for someone not near top 10% at anything but a T10 to strive for a DOL job. You'd be wasting your time. Get the most out of your time in law school by not focusing on the worthless experience that is law school classes. If you haven't knocked it out of the park during 1L, no one is going to care much for your grades in the later years. I've had various internships in the L&E field, and I don't think I've had to submit a transcript for any of them. The only grades that matter are your 1L grades for Biglaw and BigGov. No one else gives a damn. They care about experience. Network locally and get a year-long internship somewhere that pays you like $15/hour that you can work at while you take your classes. That work experience will be a far better benefit to you than getting good 2L/3L grades.