T30 1L. BOMBED 1st semester. How Doomed Am I? Forum

[Anonymous User]

I'm a 1L at BU/BC who is solidly set on PI. I just got grades recently, and the results are all over the place as you will see below. Dropping out is absolutely not an option for me because my debt will be reasonable, and I want to be a lawyer. Obviously, "prestigious" PI like DoJ, big-name fellowships (i.e. Skadden, EJW, etc.), federal clerkships, etc. are out of the question at this point, but I want to know what kind of employment options I'm looking at, for this summer and post-grad. My grades are:

Contracts: A
Torts: B
Property: C+

That puts me at a dismal, putrid 3.11. Grade distributions are not released until the end of the 1L year, but for the class of 2014 it was 3.23. The second semester of 1L is a lot more credits than the first, so there is significant opportunity for improvement. Any input on where I stand (and some TLC) would be greatly appreciated.

By the way, for the summer, I am applying to legal aid, non-profits, local gov't agencies, and DA's offices. Got one interview on Friday--they haven't requested a transcript, but I'm sure they will at some point. Ugh.

[cinephile]

I like to tell everyone to drop out because it seems like the best choice for 99% of people, but you're kind of fine. 3.11 is not the end of the world. A C+ is kind of ugly, particularly if it's a discretionary C+ at your school, but you can actually bring things up next semester. Furthermore, I go to BU and for us at least, if you're below a 3.5 (top third) but above a 3.0, there are no distinctions really so 3.11 is just as good as 3.4.

[Anonymous User]

Hey cinephile.

Thanks...no the C+ is not discretionary, just the rock bottom of the curve. Honestly,how I did on the exam coincided exactly with how I felt.

The "A" in Ks shows that I have the ability to succeed, but I'm worried that employers will look at it as a fluke. What sorts of summer positions did your peers at BU get with grades between 3.0-3.5? Again, I have absolutely no interest in Big Law.

[cinephile]

I think employers know there's some variability in your grades, and I doubt many will even look at your transcript - at least I've had few transcript requests at the screener stage. And by the time you get to the callback, hopefully they like you enough to move past one little C+.

People with a 3.0-3.5 are doing all kinds of things, including biglaw. I know someone with a 2.99 who has a 2L SA, but she also has some exceptional community involvement. You'll just have to distinguish yourself in other ways. Particularly since you want public interest, start doing some legal externing/volunteering now for like 5-10 hours a week if you can. I couldn't really say what people my year are doing who want PI/gov because while they may have something for this summer, the chance of actually getting a full-time offer from these organizations is so, so slim. Very few BU people get PI jobs, despite a lot of them wanting one, because they simply don't have the money to hire people. That's why biglaw is really the best option for everyone. Particularly since you can get trained at a big firm and then learn the skills you need to move into PI later when you're experienced (and that's really the only kind of candidate that a PI org wants, an experienced one). So I would encourage you to do your best to try for biglaw anyway now and just keep your eye on PI some 4 years or so down the line.

[Anonymous User]

Thank you! This is very comforting. I do pro bono work on a weekly basis and have WE, so hopefully that will help overcome the awful GPA. Do DAs offices (not Manhattan) typically ask for transcripts for 1L summer, and if so, will the 3.11 kill my chances? How about legal aid?

What's the biggest improvement you've seen from 1st to 2nd semester?

[cinephile]

Thank you! This is very comforting. I do pro bono work on a weekly basis and have WE, so hopefully that will help overcome the awful GPA. Do DAs offices (not Manhattan) typically ask for transcripts for 1L summer, and if so, will the 3.11 kill my chances? How about legal aid?

What's the biggest improvement you've seen from 1st to 2nd semester?

Did you just do the PI interviews at Suffolk this week? Yes, plenty of them ask for transcripts, but a 3.1 isn't that awful and won't preclude you from getting a summer internship. Particularly if you're willing to work as a DA in somewhere like Middlesex County or just something less popular. And there can be huge changes for the better and for the worse. But I wouldn't count on things changing that much unless there was something clear and fixable that you messed up on last time (like you answered the question you thought the professor asked rather than reading the instructions, or you rambled on without any organization, or you forgot to argue both ways). You need to look at those exams and speak to your professors.

[20160810]

The fact that you got an A in what might be the hardest 1L class (apart from property) tells me that you're not unfit for law school, you just need to refine your study methods. I would give it one more semester before you entertain dropping out. Even getting your GPA up into the 3.3-3.4 range gives you some pretty OK options coming from BU/BC.

[bizzybone1313]

The fact that you got an A in what might be the hardest 1L class (apart from property) tells me that you're not unfit for law school, you just need to refine your study methods. I would give it one more semester before you entertain dropping out. Even getting your GPA up into the 3.3-3.4 range gives you some pretty OK options coming from BU/BC.

This guy has 25,000+ posts. He is an OG from TLS. That means his advice is probably sound.

[stillwater]

The fact that you got an A in what might be the hardest 1L class (apart from property) tells me that you're not unfit for law school, you just need to refine your study methods. I would give it one more semester before you entertain dropping out. Even getting your GPA up into the 3.3-3.4 range gives you some pretty OK options coming from BU/BC.

This guy has 25,000+ posts. He is an OG from TLS. That means his advice is probably sound.

He's the Bro-mander in Chief, have some respect

[worldtraveler]

I'm a 1L at BC who is solidly set on PI. I just got grades recently, and the results are all over the place as you will see below. Dropping out is absolutely not an option for me because my debt will be reasonable, and I want to be a lawyer. Obviously, "prestigious" PI like DoJ, big-name fellowships (i.e. Skadden, EJW, etc.), federal clerkships, etc. are out of the question at this point, but I want to know what kind of employment options I'm looking at, for this summer and post-grad. My grades are:

Contracts: A
Torts: B
Property: C+

That puts me at a dismal, putrid 3.11. Grade distributions are not released until the end of the 1L year, but for the class of 2014 it was 3.23. The second semester of 1L is a lot more credits than the first, so there is significant opportunity for improvement. Any input on where I stand (and some TLC) would be greatly appreciated.

By the way, for the summer, I am applying to legal aid, non-profits, local gov't agencies, and DA's offices. Got one interview on Friday--they haven't requested a transcript, but I'm sure they will at some point. Ugh.

You got terrible information from somewhere. The only big PI fellowship that cares about grades is Skadden. EJW doesn't even ask for a transcript. Most 1L employers don't ask for one either if they're PI. For some others, they ask for it more as a formality to check that you are interested in PI.
I've probably submitted 200 PI applications and the only one where I needed a transcript was the DOJ.
If you want PI, I don't see why you're so worried.

[JusticeHarlan]

Do you know who the public interest fellows at BC are (three students every year who are sort of the coordinators for public interest stuff)? They're usually pretty good starting points for doing the PI job search, especially the 2Ls and 3Ls. They'll have a good sense of which professors have useful connections, where other students in similar circumstances found summer work, how the after-graduation job search is going for PI, etc.

Also, time to try to talk with your property prof about what happened on the exam (torts too, probably) and tracking down students who've had your current professor before so you can start gaming for those classes.

[Rocío]

If you want PI, you have nothing to worry about unless you want Big Fed or Honors PI. I know plenty if people with your 1L GPA (or worse) from comparable schools who ended up in public interest careers, including local/state government, legal services, DA and public defender jobs. PM me if you want.

[Anonymous User]

Thank you! This is very comforting. I do pro bono work on a weekly basis and have WE, so hopefully that will help overcome the awful GPA. Do DAs offices (not Manhattan) typically ask for transcripts for 1L summer, and if so, will the 3.11 kill my chances? How about legal aid?

What's the biggest improvement you've seen from 1st to 2nd semester?

Did you just do the PI interviews at Suffolk this week? Yes, plenty of them ask for transcripts, but a 3.1 isn't that awful and won't preclude you from getting a summer internship. Particularly if you're willing to work as a DA in somewhere like Middlesex County or just something less popular. And there can be huge changes for the better and for the worse. But I wouldn't count on things changing that much unless there was something clear and fixable that you messed up on last time (like you answered the question you thought the professor asked rather than reading the instructions, or you rambled on without any organization, or you forgot to argue both ways). You need to look at those exams and speak to your professors.

I didn't do the PI/Gov interviews at Suffolk because there were no employers there from the market I am targeting. Re: finals, my ExamSoft f*cked up and part of it was handwritten. I also tended to ramble without any organization and managed time poorly, but I clearly learned my lesson and changed my approach on my last final, which was Ks. I will try talking to my Property and Torts profs to see what went wrong even though I feel embarrassed.

Really shocked that EJW doesn't ask for transcripts! This is great news. I will reach out to the PI fellows at BC re: the job search and profs w/ connections.

Thanks so much for the kind and helpful responses! You have no idea how demoralized I felt this afternoon when Property came out. Very pleasantly surprised...the typical response to these types of threads on TLS is a chorus of "drop out", which I'm dead set against.

Oh, and bizzybone1313, what does OG mean? Offensive Guard? lol

[marmot8]

PM me OP; might be able to provide some advice. Hang in there!

[Anonymous User]

For those who made big gains after first semester, what did you do differently the second time around?

[Anonymous User]

Also, even if I do better, what is the best way to tactfully explain away the anomalous abysmal grade? Whining about ExamSoft isn't gonna cut it, lol.

Oh, by the way, I got a summer job with a legal aid office in my target market. Woo-hoo!

[BlueLotus]

[nevdash]

You know, determined or not, that cat must be long dead.