1L Summer Job Search Forum

[Anonymous User]

Interview at Kirkland Ellis, DC

MVP, IP

So jealous, they told me last week they weren't taking any 1Ls in the DC office.

Wow this makes me paranoid about the no-1L rejections I've had. However, I know Kirkland & Ellis has taken 1Ls before.

[bluecrab5448]

What should a cover letter to a judge include?

I spent 1L summer working for a judge. Just dug up all my old cover letters: I really tried to emphasize any prior writing experiences and research skills I had, since you'll be doing a lot of memo drafting and WestLaw/Lexis work. So I talked a lot about undergrad research positions and a senior thesis. Some judges also like to see some sort of geographic connection to the area. I targeted mostly New York judges and started the opening paragraph off with personal ties to NYC. You could also poke around online for cover letter templates; GWU has a bunch that don't require a password.

[Anonymous User]

I would suggest everyone look into applying to some secondary or smaller markets. I have had some good luck lining up interviews. If you are OK with medium sized firms it may be worth the shot.

[Anonymous User]

Got a DOJ interview request. DC, civil division. Obviously I would be really happy to get an offer, but just wondering what people have heard about how good this would be for 1L summer. Is it the kind of thing that if I get an offer I should accept immediately, or hold on to it for as long as I can and look for other stuff? I know that obviously 2L SLIP is extremely competitive and very prestigious, but how are the 1L positions looked at?

[bk1]

Got a DOJ interview request. DC, civil division. Obviously I would be really happy to get an offer, but just wondering what people have heard about how good this would be for 1L summer. Is it the kind of thing that if I get an offer I should accept immediately, or hold on to it for as long as I can and look for other stuff? I know that obviously 2L SLIP is extremely competitive and very prestigious, but how are the 1L positions looked at?

IME, you will get about 2 weeks to respond. You may be able to ask for more. You do NOT have to accept immediately. 1L DoJ positions are not looked at in some special light. They are pretty much the same as any other volunteer legal employment. If you get an offer feel free to keep looking and even feel free to turn it down if their time window is too short for you.

[Anonymous User]

Got a DOJ interview request. DC, civil division. Obviously I would be really happy to get an offer, but just wondering what people have heard about how good this would be for 1L summer. Is it the kind of thing that if I get an offer I should accept immediately, or hold on to it for as long as I can and look for other stuff? I know that obviously 2L SLIP is extremely competitive and very prestigious, but how are the 1L positions looked at?

IME, you will get about 2 weeks to respond. You may be able to ask for more. You do NOT have to accept immediately. 1L DoJ positions are not looked at in some special light. They are pretty much the same as any other volunteer legal employment. If you get an offer feel free to keep looking and even feel free to turn it down if their time window is too short for you.

Any upsides to a DOJ 1L position as opposed to something else? Would it better than doing a judicial internship? Or is it just a matter of preference? I have heard that judicial internships are kind of looked at as "blah" to OCI interviewers because its the most common thing people do their 1L summer. Would a DOJ internship get the same response?

[bk1]

Any upsides to a DOJ 1L position as opposed to something else? Would it better than doing a judicial internship? Or is it just a matter of preference? I have heard that judicial internships are kind of looked at as "blah" to OCI interviewers because its the most common thing people do their 1L summer. Would a DOJ internship get the same response?

You can spin pretty much any position in a positive way. Externing for a judge versus interning at the DoJ should be chosen between based on (a) what you would prefer to do, and (b) location. There is no pecking order to 1L jobs other than legal > nonlegal.

[Bronck]

Couple Question

1) I was thinking of mass mailing smaller firms in my home market. Do firms generally compensate 1L summer associates? Or are there many that don't? Is there any way to find this out for particular firms?

2) Are there any things you should necessarily cut out of a writing sample? Or if they request 5-10 pages, and you have something 8 pages, it's OK to just send the whole thing?

[thelawschoolproject]

Couple Question

1) I was thinking of mass mailing smaller firms in my home market. Do firms generally compensate 1L summer associates? Or are there many that don't? Is there any way to find this out for particular firms?

2) Are there any things you should necessarily cut out of a writing sample? Or if they request 5-10 pages, and you have something 8 pages, it's OK to just send the whole thing?

I have a smaller home market and all of the firms there compensate 1Ls. In fact, I haven't found a firm that doesn't compensate 1Ls, although I'm not sure how small of firms you're going. NALP occasionally lists 1L job salaries so you can look there. However, smaller firms sometimes aren't on NALP so you may just have to ask someone who's worked there before.

As for the writing sample, we were told to use all of it if it was within the page limit. However, if we wanted to cut some information out (they suggested the facts section) that we just put in brackets that it was removed. Also, they told us to indicate on our writing sample cover letters that it was an abridged/edited version.

[A. Nony Mouse]

1) I was thinking of mass mailing smaller firms in my home market. Do firms generally compensate 1L summer associates? Or are there many that don't? Is there any way to find this out for particular firms?

For-profit employers aren't generally supposed to have unpaid interns (there are some narrow exceptions). So while I don't actually know anything about 1L SA hiring itself (it was almost non-existent at my school), firm jobs should be compensated. Doesn't guarantee they will be, but they're supposed to be.

[Anonymous User]

If a firm wants set up an interview, is it probably just a short interview, or should I expect a half day sort of thing? Or can you ask what the interview procedure is when you set it up?

[bk1]

If a firm wants set up an interview, is it probably just a short interview, or should I expect a half day sort of thing? Or can you ask what the interview procedure is when you set it up?

Sometimes it will be a short screener, sometimes it will be a callback. Just ask.

[Anonymous User]

If a firm wants set up an interview, is it probably just a short interview, or should I expect a half day sort of thing? Or can you ask what the interview procedure is when you set it up?

Sometimes it will be a short screener, sometimes it will be a callback. Just ask.

Thanks! I didn't need to ask, they told me about their interview process. Now I get to worry about my interview skills...

[franklyscarlet]

asking professors if I can list them as references: is email ok?

[bk1]

asking professors if I can list them as references: is email ok?

Probably fine (especially if you're trying to get stuff done while over break since you can't ask in person anyways). I generally prefer to email and set up an appointment to talk to them about job stuff and then in that meeting ask them.

[Bronck]

When applying to PI orgs, should we personalize cover letters by mentioning how we're interested in that particular field (e.g., environmental law)? As a K-JD, I really have no relevant experience for any of the PI orgs and wouldn't know what to say about the different fields.

Or are PI orgs really just looking for bodies from top schools to do free work and it doesn't matter too much?

[renardthecrocs]

When applying to PI orgs, should we personalize cover letters by mentioning how we're interested in that particular field (e.g., environmental law)? As a K-JD, I really have no relevant experience for any of the PI orgs and wouldn't know what to say about the different fields.

Or are PI orgs really just looking for bodies from top schools to do free work and it doesn't matter too much?

Yes, generally one expresses interest in particular organizations in cover letters expressing interest in particular organizations.

[20130312]

Well, you've been insufferable lately.

[Bronck]

When applying to PI orgs, should we personalize cover letters by mentioning how we're interested in that particular field (e.g., environmental law)? As a K-JD, I really have no relevant experience for any of the PI orgs and wouldn't know what to say about the different fields.

Or are PI orgs really just looking for bodies from top schools to do free work and it doesn't matter too much?

Yes, generally one expresses interest in particular organizations in cover letters expressing interest in particular organizations.

Lol, doesn't answer my question. Thanks for being a snarky asshole.

[renardthecrocs]

I mean, ok, maybe it's not common knowledge that PI gigs vary widely in their prestige, the competition vying for it, etc. As a good rule of thumb try to sell yourself however you can. Look up organizations specifically and ask people who have worked there from your school. If you're K-JD, join the student orgs relevant to the work so you have something to say in a cover letter. Never assume that a job is just looking for the bodies so you can phone it in during the app process. That guarantees that the only thing you'll get is something that just needs you to do busywork.

The reason for my snarky first post and the reason no one else answered you is that most of this seems like common sense.

[dingbat]

What's everyone's thoughts on transcript requests when grades aren't out yet?

Can I get away with not sending a transcript and stating grades aren't available yet?
Can I send an unofficial transcript?
Do I have to send an official transcript (which may not arrive prior to deadline)?

[bk1]

What's everyone's thoughts on transcript requests when grades aren't out yet?

Can I get away with not sending a transcript and stating grades aren't available yet?
Can I send an unofficial transcript?
Do I have to send an official transcript (which may not arrive prior to deadline)?

Tell them your grades aren't available and you will send when they are. Once they are, send an unofficial transcript (unless they specifically ask for official).

[dingbat]

What's everyone's thoughts on transcript requests when grades aren't out yet?

Can I get away with not sending a transcript and stating grades aren't available yet?
Can I send an unofficial transcript?
Do I have to send an official transcript (which may not arrive prior to deadline)?

Tell them your grades aren't available and you will send when they are. Once they are, send an unofficial transcript (unless they specifically ask for official).

Thanks

[JRustle]

So I have sent out apps to every firm that is listed as hiring 1Ls and I have ties, around ~35 total. 1 interview, couple informal lunches, and several "contact us after grades." Sitting on my hands for a couple of weeks, should I be contacting the "2L only" firms and trying to get lunches or stuff set up in prep for 2L hiring next august? Sending apps to 1L firms in places where I've got no ties?

[dingbat]

So I have sent out apps to every firm that is listed as hiring 1Ls and I have ties, around ~35 total. 1 interview, couple informal lunches, and several "contact us after grades." Sitting on my hands for a couple of weeks, should I be contacting the "2L only" firms and trying to get lunches or stuff set up in prep for 2L hiring next august? Sending apps to 1L firms in places where I've got no ties?

Have you tried applying for corporate jobs, PI or clerkships?