Top 50 go-to law schools 2012 Forum

[kaiser]

Doesn't matter either way. The T14 distinction is for schools that were, at some point or another, in the top 10 law schools. Since UT was never in the top 10, they still aren't a T14.

Read the link a few posts above about where the T14 comes from. Said that it is because the same 14 schools have always been among the top 14 on the list (despite the changes within). Not based on those who were specifically within the top 10.

[de5igual]

jebus effin christ. this thread = proof that law students suffer from major ass-burgers

[09042014]

Stop.

Ya. TX-trolling needs to be forever put to rest. Just because it tied GULC (for one year!) does not make it a peer school. As soon as TX tied GULC, T13 started to be used. Not even sure if GULC is a peer school to those schools anymore, let alone TX.

GULC and UT tied for 15. You can't have 15 T14.

I just wanted to quote you so you can't edit it after you realize you are wrong.

You are right. 15 schools cannot fit into 14 slots. But, ranking systems do not skip the first number. If two schools are tied for the 14th slot, the rankings simply won't have a 15th numbered slot, it will go to 16. You got it backwards.

Don't call me a cunt for no reason.

I'm not saying USNEWS called them 15, I'm saying they are 15. You should tie down, not tie up.

[rad lulz]

.

[kaiser]

jebus effin christ. this thread = proof that law students suffer from major ass-burgers

Pretty sure that was well confirmed before this thread even started

[09042014]

Stop.

Ya. TX-trolling needs to be forever put to rest. Just because it tied GULC (for one year!) does not make it a peer school. As soon as TX tied GULC, T13 started to be used. Not even sure if GULC is a peer school to those schools anymore, let alone TX.

GULC and UT tied for 15. You can't have 15 T14.

No, they didn't tie for 15. That doesn't make sense. If you have a 3 person race, and 1 person clearly wins, and the other 2 tie, you don't say they tied for 3rd. You say they tied for 2nd.

It's very common to say they tied for third. And IMO it's the better way.

[lawyerwannabe]

While I never have heard it this way, I am not against it.

And simmer down. It was a joke. I edited my post if it makes you feel any better.

[09042014]

While I never have heard it this way, I am not against it.

And simmer down. It was a joke. I edited my post if it makes you feel any better.

YOU CALLIng ME A BITCH!

[srfngdd6]

Ya. TX-trolling needs to be forever put to rest. Just because it tied GULC (for one year!) does not make it a peer school. As soon as TX tied GULC, T13 started to be used. Not even sure if GULC is a peer school to those schools anymore, let alone TX.[/quote]

GULC and UT tied for 15. You can't have 15 T14.[/quote]

No, they didn't tie for 15. That doesn't make sense. If you have a 3 person race, and 1 person clearly wins, and the other 2 tie, you don't say they tied for 3rd. You say they tied for 2nd.[/quote]

It's very common to say they tied for third. And IMO it's the better way.[/quote]

I have never seen any sort of ranking or competition where if a person wins and the next two tie they are said to tie for third they tie for second and then the next guy is fourth

[09042014]

I have never seen any sort of ranking or competition where if a person wins and the next two tie they are said to tie for third they tie for second and then the next guy is fourth

Well then, if some idiot who can't use the quote feature hasn't seen it, it doesn't exist.

[kaiser]

It's very common to say they tied for third. And IMO it's the better way.

Its very common? I've never once in my life heard anyone say that in any system of ranking. But if in some other part of the country people say that, then sure. I mean, I would love for you to link me to one article, story, source, etc. that actually says that, since I would be amazed, but its not such a big deal that you or I should waste that much time with it.

In the sports standings, if 2 teams are tied for the most points in the league, you would say they are tied for 2nd? Cmon

[Curious1]

What is happening in this thread?

[sunynp]

So other than the T14 discussion, does anyone else glean much from this data? I mean, I think these numbers are worse than I thought they would be. I know that people think it is better now, is there anyway to quantify that? I don't know where to look for data from last fall's OCI and this year's summer class of SAs. The lag in data is a problem, both when things are good and when things are bad. Why is it so hard to get accurate numbers of class sizes that are starting this summer?

[srfngdd6]

I have never seen any sort of ranking or competition where if a person wins and the next two tie they are said to tie for third they tie for second and then the next guy is fourth

Well then, if some idiot who can't use the quote feature hasn't seen it, it doesn't exist.

if some dbag with a nazi frog as his avatar says it does then it must

[09042014]

So other than the T14 discussion, does anyone else glean much from this data? I mean, I think these numbers are worse than I thought they would be. I know that people think it is better now, is there anyway to quantify that? I don't know where to look for data from last fall's OCI and this year's summer class of SAs. The lag in data is a problem, both when things are good and when things are bad. Why is it so hard to get accurate numbers of class sizes that are starting this summer?

This data isn't useful for a 1L. Even knowing if summer classes increased isn't that big of a deal. If you don't go to a T12 (Michigone) you better get some A's this semester. Your school will have data about how firms recruit at your school.

It's useful for 0Ls in the sense that it shows that there about 20 or so law schools you should even consider attending, even for free.

[Big Shrimpin]

West Virginia: Most underrated law school?

BigCoalLaw FTW!

Haha this jumped out at me too. Farming career associate work out to the back woods.

[laxbrah420]

I have never seen any sort of ranking or competition where if a person wins and the next two tie they are said to tie for third they tie for second and then the next guy is fourth

Well then, if some idiot who can't use the quote feature hasn't seen it, it doesn't exist.

Go to horse track and watch your place bet DH. I'm sure it'll make sense to you for the track to pocket the place pool entirely and have the show pool split.

[sunynp]

So other than the T14 discussion, does anyone else glean much from this data? I mean, I think these numbers are worse than I thought they would be. I know that people think it is better now, is there anyway to quantify that? I don't know where to look for data from last fall's OCI and this year's summer class of SAs. The lag in data is a problem, both when things are good and when things are bad. Why is it so hard to get accurate numbers of class sizes that are starting this summer?

This data isn't useful for a 1L. Even knowing if summer classes increased isn't that big of a deal. If you don't go to a T12 (Michigone) you better get some A's this semester. Your school will have data about how firms recruit at your school.

It's useful for 0Ls in the sense that it shows that there about 20 or so law schools you should even consider attending, even for free.

Is the thinking behind this that you should only go to a school that held its own (so to speak) in the worst legal market? What about the whole free ride at top regional schools being better than T14? I am starting to think that no one should go to law school unless they have no debt at all( + possibly Yale)

[LawIdiot86]

It's useful for 0Ls in the sense that it shows that there about 20 or so law schools you should even consider attending, even for free.

Given that your odds of Biglaw drop to 1/6 at #21 and if not biglaw, then law's bizarre bi-modal salary distribution screws you, this is very very good advice. I think law schools should be required to show a warning video with charts by Elie and Lat before students are allowed to enroll.

[LawIdiot86]

So other than the T14 discussion, does anyone else glean much from this data? I mean, I think these numbers are worse than I thought they would be. I know that people think it is better now, is there anyway to quantify that? I don't know where to look for data from last fall's OCI and this year's summer class of SAs. The lag in data is a problem, both when things are good and when things are bad. Why is it so hard to get accurate numbers of class sizes that are starting this summer?

This data isn't useful for a 1L. Even knowing if summer classes increased isn't that big of a deal. If you don't go to a T12 (Michigone) you better get some A's this semester. Your school will have data about how firms recruit at your school.

It's useful for 0Ls in the sense that it shows that there about 20 or so law schools you should even consider attending, even for free.

Is the thinking behind this that you should only go to a school that held its own (so to speak) in the worst legal market? What about the whole free ride at top regional schools being better than T14? I am starting to think that no one should go to law school unless they have no debt at all( + possibly Yale)

If you want a JD, then sure, free ride at a top regional is great. Do it. If you want to practice biglaw, even at the peak of the bull market, only 30 schools were placing better then 1/6 in biglaw. (http://www.law.com/pdf/nlj/20080414empl ... trends.pdf). Now it's 20 schools. Maybe those 10 schools are worth paying a little for if you time the year right, you're already gambling by saying 1/5 is so much better then 1/6, so why not gamble that you've picked the right year to be doing OCI?

[LawIdiot86]

I've seen this NLJ250 chart floating around since 2007, http://www.law.com/img/nlj/charts/composite.pdf, but cannot begin to decipher if it has useful information. It doesn't match any of the datasets I've seen so far, like http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843, but it seems like it should be useful. Anyone else break it down in their research?

[NYC Law]

I've seen this NLJ250 chart floating around since 2007, http://www.law.com/img/nlj/charts/composite.pdf, but cannot begin to decipher if it has useful information. It doesn't match any of the datasets I've seen so far, like http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843, but it seems like it should be useful. Anyone else break it down in their research?

It's older than the other datasets, it's the old version of go-to law schools (there wasn't a modern list format for that year).

It's too old to really be that useful anymore though.

[rayiner]

I think Michigan is still a good school for Chicago, but you absolutely need solid ties. By telling everyone to focus on Chicago, Michigan OCS basically told a bunch of people with zero ties to bid on a market that was collapsing. Chicago for class of '11 was really terrible.

Northwestern on the other hand is a tie to Chicago. Just attending is good enough. But Chicago as a market still sucks. But attending Michigan is not a tie to Chicago. Which is why it was really stupid to tell students to bid there.

I think this is pretty spot on. Being in Chicago for NU or UChi is enough to create some legitimate ties, whereas being at Michigan isn't really enough to do that on its own.

If anything just from the huge number of people who end up with significant-others from the Chicago area.

[rinkrat19]

I've seen this NLJ250 chart floating around since 2007, http://www.law.com/img/nlj/charts/composite.pdf, but cannot begin to decipher if it has useful information. It doesn't match any of the datasets I've seen so far, like http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843, but it seems like it should be useful. Anyone else break it down in their research?

It's older than the other datasets, it's the old version of go-to law schools (there wasn't a modern list format for that year).

It's too old to really be that useful anymore though.

It's more like the breakdown that LST does, wouldn't you say?

[keg411]

So other than the T14 discussion, does anyone else glean much from this data? I mean, I think these numbers are worse than I thought they would be. I know that people think it is better now, is there anyway to quantify that? I don't know where to look for data from last fall's OCI and this year's summer class of SAs. The lag in data is a problem, both when things are good and when things are bad. Why is it so hard to get accurate numbers of class sizes that are starting this summer?

This data isn't useful for a 1L. Even knowing if summer classes increased isn't that big of a deal. If you don't go to a T12 (Michigone) you better get some A's this semester. Your school will have data about how firms recruit at your school.

My school really is embarrassing in these results as much as I want to explain them away (PUBLIC INTEREST! OCS ERRORS! lolno). Should've gone to NU with their generous curve and their less humiliating NLJ250 numbers. As much as I know people did well this year, and maybe it was all just a giant OCS error, there is really still no excuse. These numbers make us look like GeorgeTTTown. Awful. (And, of course, they're just another reason to be sad Penn rejected my sorry ass ).