OCI Gunning from the Margin Forum

[Anonymous User]

I wanted to get this all down because I don’t know if I will have the desire to next cycle. I think I had a pretty successful cycle coming from the margin: over ten callbacks and some really good offers. I define margin as the zone at your school where you are not disqualified, but won’t be able to get callbacks on the strength of your grades alone. At my school, that zone is a median GPA. At most T14s that zone should be the top-third, T1s should be at least top-10 percent. My advice isn’t cumulative, but check out the following thoughts:

1. OCI at the margin is a game of chance. Believe what you want, but you cannot do much to change the results of your interviews. One interviewer will like you for having an engineering degree, a sense of humor, and Allen Edmonds shoes. The next might hate you for being overbearing, chubby, and having Woody Allen mannerisms. While having a clear, well-structured resume, doing research into firms, and not being a creepster will help, these things won’t save you. Your best and only chance is to apply to as many firms as possible. Some caution about burn-out, but I did 65 interviews in eight days and only got 2 callbacks from the firms I was originally assigned. My others all came through walking in on interviews, talking to interviewers during breaks, mass mailing, elevator pitching in elevators, and the scheduling phone interviews. Every phone interview I did got me a callback.

2. Show interest... appropriately. People like you better if you go out of your way to show interest. Key is not looking like a weirdo. I can’t draw the line, but I think most people can feel where the line is and just get desperate and cross it.

3. Be a good actor. No one cares that you know what the firm does. Be the cop character from Reservoir Dogs—speak the lingo, know the major players, know some recent industry issues, actually knowing will help a lot. Conversely, if you don’t care enough to do this, load up on more interviews than you can handle and learn to BS well. My favorite way of BSing was asking questions that would keep the interviewer talking like “If you were in my situation right now, what factors would you consider to make the best decision,” or “I saw you recently handled the Apple case, how would you assign associates to that?”

4. Be Nice. People love to feel important, make them feel important. One way to do this by carefully following the flow of the conversation and asking questions which let them talk about themselves. Laugh, smile, be slightly flirty or cute, masculine, or suck-up-ish. Don’t be too obvious though.

5. Callbacks. 1) Don’t be antisocial with the associates, unless they are antisocial. 2) Make one partner like you. 3) Don’t be a loser to the other partners.

6. Perks. I loved OCI. I gained 10 lbs, got to visit 10 different cities, have almost 5k in expenses reimbursed, enough frequent flyer miles for six plane tickets, got to hang out with Iranian President Ahmadinejad, have a crazy emergency landing, chased down the patriarch from Sister Wives, ran into the secret service in three different places, went to Disneyland, stayed at a 350 dollar ranch mansion with mini-houses, and saw snow, cactuses, manhattan, the white house, the golden gate bridge, Mexico, Hollywood, and the Sears Tower all in a 14 day period. When you are grinding it out through your interviews and finding yourself awkwardly begging for that extra screener, remember the perks will be pretty awesome.

[Go_to_NYU]

Perks. I loved OCI. I gained 10 lbs, got to visit 10 different cities, have almost 5k in expenses reimbursed, enough frequent flyer miles for six plane tickets, got to hang out with Iranian President Ahmadinejad, have a crazy emergency landing, chased down the patriarch from Sister Wives, ran into the secret service in three different places, went to Disneyland, stayed at a 350 dollar ranch mansion with mini-houses, and saw snow, cactuses, manhattan, the white house, the golden gate bridge, Mexico, Hollywood, and the Sears Tower all in a 14 day period. When you are grinding it out through your interviews and finding yourself awkwardly begging for that extra screener, remember the perks will be pretty awesome.

Sounds like good times. I guess I was doing it wrong! I stuck to Manhattan and required zero reimbursements. Also had less fun it seems.

[mrloblaw]

6. Perks. I loved OCI. I gained 10 lbs, got to visit 10 different cities, have almost 5k in expenses reimbursed, enough frequent flyer miles for six plane tickets, got to hang out with Iranian President Ahmadinejad, have a crazy emergency landing, chased down the patriarch from Sister Wives, ran into the secret service in three different places, went to Disneyland, stayed at a 350 dollar ranch mansion with mini-houses, and saw snow, cactuses, manhattan, the white house, the golden gate bridge, Mexico, Hollywood, and the Sears Tower all in a 14 day period. When you are grinding it out through your interviews and finding yourself awkwardly begging for that extra screener, remember the perks will be pretty awesome.

Now I totally wish I wasn't going to law school in the major market I targeted.

Otherwise, nice post. Even the obvious could use occasional restatement.

[Anonymous User]

6. Perks. I loved OCI. I gained 10 lbs, got to visit 10 different cities, have almost 5k in expenses reimbursed, enough frequent flyer miles for six plane tickets, got to hang out with Iranian President Ahmadinejad, have a crazy emergency landing, chased down the patriarch from Sister Wives, ran into the secret service in three different places, went to Disneyland, stayed at a 350 dollar ranch mansion with mini-houses, and saw snow, cactuses, manhattan, the white house, the golden gate bridge, Mexico, Hollywood, and the Sears Tower all in a 14 day period. When you are grinding it out through your interviews and finding yourself awkwardly begging for that extra screener, remember the perks will be pretty awesome.

Now I totally wish I wasn't going to law school in the major market I targeted.

Otherwise, nice post. Even the obvious could use occasional restatement.

Good point. I did target a market first and exhausted it and then applied everywhere that had particular strong practice groups I was interested in. I guess if your market is New York, and you want it, it would be dumb to apply anywhere else before you've gotten yourself into every NYC slot possible.

[kaiser]

Damn. I was obviously doing it wrong. I would leave my apartment an hour before a CB, take the subway, and then get back to school in time for class.

[mrloblaw]

Damn. I was obviously doing it wrong. I would leave my apartment an hour before a CB, take the subway, and then get back to school in time for class.

I know, right? I never met a reviled world leader on the B train, either.

[kaiser]

Damn. I was obviously doing it wrong. I would leave my apartment an hour before a CB, take the subway, and then get back to school in time for class.

I know, right? I never met a reviled world leader on the B train, either.

And I didn't get my $4 bucks reimbursed either!

[keg411]

Damn. I was obviously doing it wrong. I would leave my apartment an hour before a CB, take the subway, and then get back to school in time for class.

I know, right? I never met a reviled world leader on the B train, either.

And I didn't get my $4 bucks reimbursed either!

Y'all are lucky on that. Flying multiple times in a one month span is exhausting.
It's also a recipe for getting bronchitis. (Which happened to me)

[Anonymous User]

Damn. I was obviously doing it wrong. I would leave my apartment an hour before a CB, take the subway, and then get back to school in time for class.

I know, right? I never met a reviled world leader on the B train, either.

And I didn't get my $4 bucks reimbursed either!

Y'all are lucky on that. Flying multiple times in a one month span is exhausting.
It's also a recipe for getting bronchitis. (Which happened to me)

So true. I got pretty sick during one round of CBs, almost passed out on the plane, and was in the hospital through the night. My buddy hung out with me in the hospital and kept hitting on this manic-depressant girl in the bed next to me who had hit her head on a pool table at her rehab after passing out. My hotel was on-site, so I got two hours of sleep, rinsed off, sprayed cologne on my stinkiest parts, and staggered to the interview like a bleeding hobo after shaving dry and cutting myself. This firm had one of the top attorneys in the nation in a particular field interview me. I could barely get through the interview and felt like I was going to pass out or throw up on his little crystal awards. The guy kept cocking his head and trying to look deep into my eyes with this expression that perfectly said "Whats wrong with you, are you on drugs or something?" He would even stop mid sentence to give me puzzled/confused glares. We would then exchange awkward silence until one of us said something like "Do you have any questions," or "So, can you tell me about the firm's licensing group." As soon as the time was up he rushed me out of his office and gave me the deadest hand shake in the world.

Later during the first week of school, several LLMs who worked with him closely overseas became my friends, knowing that I had interviewed with their firm. They said "We will talk to him about you, we should help you get the job." I didn't have the heart to tell them I was already rejected. After they talked to him they stopped wanting to hang out with me and tried to avoid me on campus/ in elevators.

Being stigmatized is definitely a danger of doing callbacks in multiple areas.

[Anonymous User]

One thing I regret about OCI is being conservative with reimbursements. I didn't read the guidelines to what could be reimbursed and therefore, missed out on some cash :/

[Glock]

6. Perks. I loved OCI. I gained 10 lbs, got to visit 10 different cities, have almost 5k in expenses reimbursed, enough frequent flyer miles for six plane tickets, got to hang out with Iranian President Ahmadinejad, have a crazy emergency landing, chased down the patriarch from Sister Wives, ran into the secret service in three different places, went to Disneyland, stayed at a 350 dollar ranch mansion with mini-houses, and saw snow, cactuses, manhattan, the white house, the golden gate bridge, Mexico, Hollywood, and the Sears Tower all in a 14 day period. When you are grinding it out through your interviews and finding yourself awkwardly begging for that extra screener, remember the perks will be pretty awesome.

Wait, is Iran still hiring? Do they hire from median at MVP? What is their CB/Offer ratio?

[mrloblaw]

Being stigmatized is definitely a danger of doing callbacks in multiple areas.

I don't need near death experiences in foreign ERs to be ostracized by law firms, I assure you.

[kaiser]

6. Perks. I loved OCI. I gained 10 lbs, got to visit 10 different cities, have almost 5k in expenses reimbursed, enough frequent flyer miles for six plane tickets, got to hang out with Iranian President Ahmadinejad, have a crazy emergency landing, chased down the patriarch from Sister Wives, ran into the secret service in three different places, went to Disneyland, stayed at a 350 dollar ranch mansion with mini-houses, and saw snow, cactuses, manhattan, the white house, the golden gate bridge, Mexico, Hollywood, and the Sears Tower all in a 14 day period. When you are grinding it out through your interviews and finding yourself awkwardly begging for that extra screener, remember the perks will be pretty awesome.

Wait, is Iran still hiring? Do they hire from median at MVP? What is their CB/Offer ratio?

Got the skillz to make nuclear weapons? I'm sure they will at least consider you

[mrloblaw]

6. Perks. I loved OCI. I gained 10 lbs, got to visit 10 different cities, have almost 5k in expenses reimbursed, enough frequent flyer miles for six plane tickets, got to hang out with Iranian President Ahmadinejad, have a crazy emergency landing, chased down the patriarch from Sister Wives, ran into the secret service in three different places, went to Disneyland, stayed at a 350 dollar ranch mansion with mini-houses, and saw snow, cactuses, manhattan, the white house, the golden gate bridge, Mexico, Hollywood, and the Sears Tower all in a 14 day period. When you are grinding it out through your interviews and finding yourself awkwardly begging for that extra screener, remember the perks will be pretty awesome.

Wait, is Iran still hiring? Do they hire from median at MVP? What is their CB/Offer ratio?

Got the skillz to make nuclear weapons? I'm sure they will at least consider you

Does that qualify as light treason or heavy treason?

[Anonymous User]

6. Perks. I loved OCI. I gained 10 lbs, got to visit 10 different cities, have almost 5k in expenses reimbursed, enough frequent flyer miles for six plane tickets, got to hang out with Iranian President Ahmadinejad, have a crazy emergency landing, chased down the patriarch from Sister Wives, ran into the secret service in three different places, went to Disneyland, stayed at a 350 dollar ranch mansion with mini-houses, and saw snow, cactuses, manhattan, the white house, the golden gate bridge, Mexico, Hollywood, and the Sears Tower all in a 14 day period. When you are grinding it out through your interviews and finding yourself awkwardly begging for that extra screener, remember the perks will be pretty awesome.

Wait, is Iran still hiring? Do they hire from median at MVP? What is their CB/Offer ratio?

Got the skillz to make nuclear weapons? I'm sure they will at least consider you

I thought about asking him if the top 6, or Fordham's nuclear law program was better for big Iran law, but the secret service was eyeing me weird and I had a callback to get to.

[sunynp]

Why would you go to an interview with an important partner when you are obviously very ill. I think they would much rather you wait a day and feel better and then come in. Or just reschedule- going ahead with yhe interview in that situation is an auto- ding.