Final Transfer 2011 OCI Results Forum

[Anonymous User]

Hey everyone,

I figured I would go ahead and start this thread for transfers whose cycles are wrapping up. There's another thread out there but it doesn't really have complete information. Feel free to post your cycle stats here (and update if things change)!

I'll start:

School range: CCN
Market(s): NYC/DC (plus a little SF/SV)
Approx. class rank/Old School: Almost certainly below median at DCNG
Law review: No; secondary journal at CCN
Work experience: Relevant, pre-LS experience
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact?: Fluency in a rare/valuable language
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 8
Screening Interviews: 29
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 18
Callbacks accepted: 11
Offers w/vault ranges: 4 (1 V15, 1 V25, 2 V50); 2 dings, withdrew from the rest
Accepted: V25 (top choice)
Comments/Thoughts: All of my callbacks were in NYC. DC was a bloodbath. Also, I have absolutely no clue how I got in to CCN with my numbers. There's definitely enough information here to out me, but whatever.

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Market(s): Mostly NYC
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 15-33% at T17
Work experience: None
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact?: Nothing
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): Not even going to try to guess.
Screening Interviews: 20-30
Mass mails: 10-15
Callbacks received: 2-6
Callbacks accepted: 2-4
Offers w/vault ranges: 2-3 offers, all within the V20
Accepted: V5 (dream firm)
Comments/Thoughts: There are some transfers who far outperformed what they could have expected at their old school (e.g. came from a T30 and got multiple V5 offers) and there are some transfers who far underperformed what they could have expected at their old school (e.g. transferred to CCN from being better than top quarter at a lower T14 and got almost no callbacks while some people with the same numbers at their old school get close to double-digit callbacks). OCI is scary as shit by itself. Going in as a transfer, which turns things into even more of a crapshoot, just adds to the insanity. It turned out well for me, but I really have to feel sorry for some of my fellow transfers. A lot of them gave up good class rank and a hefty scholarship at their old school; some of them are now striking out while staring down $100k+ more in debt than they would have had at their old school. It turned out okay for me, but for some people, transferring could turn out to be one of the worst decisions of their life.

[Anonymous User]

School range: MVPB
Market(s): NYC, regional
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 2%/T2
Law review: Old school, yes; new school, secondary
Work experience: Nope
IP background: Nope
Anything else that might have an impact: nope.
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 7
Screening Interviews: 27
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 10 (I chose, on advice from a former transfer, a lot of highly selective firms. This was risky, but given my results, I am glad I did).
Callbacks accepted: 9 (1 V5, 1 V10, 1 V15, 1 V25, 1 V50, 3 V100, 2 regional)
Offers w/vault ranges: 4 (1 V15, 1 V25, 1 V100, 1 regional); 2 dings, withdrew elsewhere
Accepted: V15 (Or I most likely will)
Comments/Thoughts: Transfers absolutely killed it in my class. Vast majority got V100 offers: many, many got their top choice.

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Market(s): NYC + a few LA firms
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 5%/T2 in the 60s
Law review: no
Work experience: no
IP background: no
Anything else that might have an impact: I'm younger than almost everyone
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 3
Screening Interviews: 25
Mass mails: none before OCI, lots in September (i.e. too late)
Callbacks received: 3
Callbacks accepted: 3 (2 V30s, 1 V100)
Offers w/vault ranges: 0
Comments/Thoughts:

I definitely think I overbid a bit; went for mostly V25 firms and, in hindsight, that probably made an uphill battle for me. Also, I guess I suck at interviewing. Those 2 things make for a bad combo. Underbidding stinks, but at the end of the day you still have a paying job for 2L summer and most likely a permanent job in your future. Feel free to aim higher if you have WE, you're an excellent interviewer (and you 100% know it), you're going into IP, etc., but there's nothing wrong with playing it safe. That said, I know a bunch of transfers that did very well here (including V5s, V10s, etc.) so don't place too much emphasis on my stats alone.

[Anonymous User]

School range: MVP
Market(s): Southeast
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 13(ish)% @ a T-30
Law review: no
Work experience: no
IP background: no
Anything else that might have an impact: At least SOME ties nearly everywhere I bid
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): I thought maybe 5 or 6, but in reality it's probably lower.
Screening Interviews: 23
Mass mails: 15 or so, plus a few resume drops
Callbacks received: 2 (one from a resume drop and one from a screener; neither with a Vault range, but I don't really care about that)
Callbacks accepted: 2
Offers w/vault ranges: 0 (CBs were very recent though)
Comments/Thoughts:

I'm pretty sure I was a borderline transfer applicant, so I'm sure that didn't help my chances. I feel like my interviews always go reasonably well. They seem conversational and I've really been trying to sell myself. Apparently I'm not doing such a great job.

Here's hoping that SOMETHING comes through at the last minute.

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Market(s): NYC + a few LA firms
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 5%/T2 in the 60s
Law review: no
Work experience: no
IP background: no
Anything else that might have an impact: I'm younger than almost everyone
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 3
Screening Interviews: 25
Mass mails: none before OCI, lots in September (i.e. too late)
Callbacks received: 3
Callbacks accepted: 3 (2 V30s, 1 V100)
Offers w/vault ranges: 0
Comments/Thoughts:

I definitely think I overbid a bit; went for mostly V25 firms and, in hindsight, that probably made an uphill battle for me. Also, I guess I suck at interviewing. Those 2 things make for a bad combo. Underbidding stinks, but at the end of the day you still have a paying job for 2L summer and most likely a permanent job in your future. Feel free to aim higher if you have WE, you're an excellent interviewer (and you 100% know it), you're going into IP, etc., but there's nothing wrong with playing it safe. That said, I know a bunch of transfers that did very well here (including V5s, V10s, etc.) so don't place too much emphasis on my stats alone.

^Me. Just wanted to say this is 100% how I felt too:

I feel like my interviews always go reasonably well. They seem conversational and I've really been trying to sell myself.

[Anonymous User]

School range: MVPB
Market(s): Secondary, NY
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 1-2%/T2
Law review: Old school, secondary; new school, secondary
Work experience: Yes
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact: Not really.
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 5
Screening Interviews: 27
Mass mails: Picked up a couple of mid law type screeners, but cancelled them since they were late-ish and offers started coming in from OCI.
Callbacks received: 13
Callbacks accepted: 10 (1 V10, 2 V20-50, 2 V50-100, 5 regional. Also withdrew at two firms right after CB, waited for decision at eight.)
Offers w/vault ranges: 5 (1 V10, 2 V50-100, 2 regional); 3 dings
Accepted: Not yet
Comments/Thoughts: The vault ranges of my CBs/offers are probably not too instructive, as a lot of my screeners/CBs were with non-vault firms due to bidding on secondary markets where I have ties. Also, had I known how well transfers in general would do, I might have actually bid a little more agressively. Very few complaints about how things worked out, and I'm sure I will be very happy with whichever place I end up choosing.

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Market(s): NYC
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 10%/T1
Law review: secondary journal at CCN
Work experience: Yes
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact?:
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): this is ridiculous
Screening Interviews: 24
Mass mails: 15 or so
Callbacks received: 1
Callbacks accepted: 1
Offers w/vault ranges: 0
Accepted: 0
Comments/Thoughts: I think I had trouble faking enthusiasm for biglaw work.

[Anonymous User]

School range: T25 to HYS
Market(s): NYC
Work experience: Internships only
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): Higher side
Screening Interviews: 20
Callbacks received: 12
Callbacks accepted: 8
Offers w/vault ranges: 8 (consisting of: 2 V5; 3 V10; 3 V15)
Accepted: V15
Comments/Thoughts: I bid aggressively; it's possible that I could have snagged the firm I eventually accepted at my old school -- I'm unsure. But I'm confident that the transfer boosted my prospects overall. Very happy with decision.

[Anonymous User]

School range: HYS
Market(s): NYC
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 15-20%, Lower T14
Law review: Old school, yes; new school no journal
Work experience: Yes, 2 years decent WE
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact: Language skills
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 7/8 in screeners, 9/10 in CBs. I was anxious during screeners and felt like I hit my stride in CBs.
Screening Interviews: 30
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 19
Callbacks accepted: 10 (2 V5, 2 V10, 2 V15, 3 V25, 1 V50)
Offers w/vault ranges: 10 offers
Accepted: V10
Comments/Thoughts: Transfers generally appeared to do better than average. Transfers within the T14 were especially golden. For anxious transfer looking at this thread next year, my advice is to bid as if you are around top 20% but sprinkle in a few solid safeties. Have a narrative prepared for why you transferred, I was asked it every single time.

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Market(s): NYC
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 25% T25
Law review: Old school secondary
Work experience: Yes, a few years
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact: I'm attractive
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 8/9 in screeners, 8 in CBs.
Screening Interviews: 30
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 10
Callbacks accepted: 8
Offers w/vault ranges: 2 (V40; V60 - hoping for V10)
Accepted: None
Comments/Thoughts: Happy.

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Market(s): NYC + 1 interview in a secondary market
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 1% at TTT
Law review: No; accepted into secondary journal at CCN after OCI ended.
Work experience: Limited non-legal/business WE
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact?:
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): At screeners 5, at CB 8
Screening Interviews: 31
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 4
Callbacks accepted: 2
Offers w/vault ranges: 2 : V5 & V15
Accepted: V5
Comments/Thoughts: Don't be discouraged by the fact that you have few CB. I got both of my offers within a week and a half of OCI. The other CB invitations came after I already had offers. I have friends who have gone on 5+ CB, and have no offers yet.

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Markets: NYC (1-2 screeners each for LA, DC, SF as well)
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 3% @ T1
Law review: Yes at old school, Secondary journal at new
Work experience: Technical/nonlegal
IP Background: No interest in IP, but qualified to do so
Self-assessed interview ability: 4-5
Screening Interviews: 29?
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 1
Callbacks accepted: 1
Offers w/vault ranges: 0
Accepted: N/A
Comments/Thoughts: Transferring ended up being a pretty poor choice for me, but I'm likely the exception. If I can't get a PI internship by the end of the semester, I'm cutting my losses and dropping out.

[Anonymous User]

A few of you have mentioned that you were always asked why you transferred. What answers did you find to be the best?

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Market(s): 70/30 Chicago to NYC
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 1% at T-35
Work experience: None.
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact?: Had a 1L SA to talk about. UG degree in accounting to talk about.
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 7ish? I can put myself together pretty well for an interview.
Screening Interviews: 25ish
Mass mails: 0
Callbacks received: 8
Callbacks accepted: 5
Offers w/vault ranges: V5, V10, and V30
Accepted: V5 or V10, haven't decided yet
Comments/Thoughts:
This process has made me reevaluate my ability to judge my interactions with other people. I received callbacks to firms where the screener went terribly (or so I thought) and fast dings from firms where I thought I hit it off with the interviewer. I'm very pleased to have a V5 in NYC and a V10 in Chicago to decide between.

My advice to future transfer OCI participants would be to try to paint a coherent and complete story of who you are to an interviewer. I had no work experience and it was obvious that I fucked around in undergrad, but I was able to overcome those weaknesses by presenting myself to interviewers as a reborn hardworker who was ready to put in the time. Also, don't listen to your OCS. They are painfully unhelpful.

[Anonymous User]

A few of you have mentioned that you were always asked why you transferred. What answers did you find to be the best?

As a T-35 to CCN transfer, it was a pretty big no-brainer why I transferred. I said the greater academic opportunities, the desire to clerk, and better employment opportunities. It was far more interesting for some of my transfer classmates who came from lower T-14 to CCN, where the obviousness of why transferring was the right decision.

[Anonymous User]

School range: CCN
Market(s): 70/30 Chicago to NYC
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 1% at T-35
Work experience: None.
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact?: Had a 1L SA to talk about. UG degree in accounting to talk about.
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 7ish? I can put myself together pretty well for an interview.
Screening Interviews: 25ish
Mass mails: 0
Callbacks received: 8
Callbacks accepted: 5
Offers w/vault ranges: V5, V10, and V30
Accepted: V5 or V10, haven't decided yet
Comments/Thoughts:
This process has made me reevaluate my ability to judge my interactions with other people. I received callbacks to firms where the screener went terribly (or so I thought) and fast dings from firms where I thought I hit it off with the interviewer. I'm very pleased to have a V5 in NYC and a V10 in Chicago to decide between.

My advice to future transfer OCI participants would be to try to paint a coherent and complete story of who you are to an interviewer. I had no work experience and it was obvious that I fucked around in undergrad, but I was able to overcome those weaknesses by presenting myself to interviewers as a reborn hardworker who was ready to put in the time. Also, don't listen to your OCS. They are painfully unhelpful.

how were you able to do this without it sounding contrived? i've been told i don't "sell" myself enough in my interviews, but am unsure how to improve this without coming across as too aggressive.

[Anonymous User]

I was able to overcome those weaknesses by presenting myself to interviewers as a reborn hardworker who was ready to put in the time. Also, don't listen to your OCS. They are painfully unhelpful.

how were you able to do this without it sounding contrived? i've been told i don't "sell" myself enough in my interviews, but am unsure how to improve this without coming across as too aggressive.

I always did it indirectly, and even then still felt a little bit like an asshole. For example - when an interviewer would comment on how well I did at my old school, I'd say thank you and something along the lines of that although it was a lot of long hours, especially given my school's unusually rough curve, I found that I really enjoyed rising to the challenge. Or when talking about my SA or the transfer process, I would humorously and briefly mention how there were some long nights of juggling work, writing on to LR, and doing transfer applications. Just small hints here or there that imply I've turned a new leaf regarding the grind.

[Anonymous User]

School range: MVPB
Market(s): NYC, regional
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 2%/T2
Law review: Old school, yes; new school, secondary
Work experience: Nope
IP background: Nope
Anything else that might have an impact: nope.
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 7
Screening Interviews: 27
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 10 (I chose, on advice from a former transfer, a lot of highly selective firms. This was risky, but given my results, I am glad I did).
Callbacks accepted: 9 (1 V5, 1 V10, 1 V15, 1 V25, 1 V50, 3 V100, 2 regional)
Offers w/vault ranges: 6 (1 V5, 1 V15, 2 V30, 1 V100, 1 regional); 2 dings, withdrew at one.
Accepted: V15 (Or I most likely will)
Comments/Thoughts: Transfers absolutely killed it in my class. Vast majority got V100 offers: many, many got their top choice.

This was me. I actually jumped the gun, and before I got around to cancelling the rest of my firms, got some more offers. Figured I'd update.

Also, I should add that the key to doing well, especially I think in screeners (though i only got 10 CBs...lots of my classmates did better), is to be enthusiastic. Completely, non-annoyingly, continuously enthusiastic. Smile when you meet the person, laugh when they make jokes, smile when they talk about the things they like about their firm. This wasn't hard for me, because I generally am interested in things like this, but I also think it can be manufactured. I think what allowed me to do it is I treated every interview (and CB interview) as an opportunity to meet a new person; not to interview for a new job. Endeavor to find out as much as possible about the person in the context of their employment with the firm. Listen to what they have to say and act like you enjoy hearing it (or better yet -- ENJOY hearing it). This is just my approach and I think others work well (perhaps better). But, I figured I found this thread from last year to be so helpful that I owed a duty of paying it forward.

[Anonymous User]

School range: MVPB
Market(s): NYC, regional
Approx. class rank/Old School: Top 2%/T2
Law review: Old school, yes; new school, secondary
Work experience: Nope
IP background: Nope
Anything else that might have an impact: nope.
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 7
Screening Interviews: 27
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 10 (I chose, on advice from a former transfer, a lot of highly selective firms. This was risky, but given my results, I am glad I did).
Callbacks accepted: 9 (1 V5, 1 V10, 1 V15, 1 V25, 1 V50, 3 V100, 2 regional)
Offers w/vault ranges: 6 (1 V5, 1 V15, 2 V30, 1 V100, 1 regional); 2 dings, withdrew at one.
Accepted: V15 (Or I most likely will)
Comments/Thoughts: Transfers absolutely killed it in my class. Vast majority got V100 offers: many, many got their top choice.

This was me. I actually jumped the gun, and before I got around to cancelling the rest of my firms, got some more offers. Figured I'd update.

Also, I should add that the key to doing well, especially I think in screeners (though i only got 10 CBs...lots of my classmates did better), is to be enthusiastic. Completely, non-annoyingly, continuously enthusiastic. Smile when you meet the person, laugh when they make jokes, smile when they talk about the things they like about their firm. This wasn't hard for me, because I generally am interested in things like this, but I also think it can be manufactured. I think what allowed me to do it is I treated every interview (and CB interview) as an opportunity to meet a new person; not to interview for a new job. Endeavor to find out as much as possible about the person in the context of their employment with the firm. Listen to what they have to say and act like you enjoy hearing it (or better yet -- ENJOY hearing it). This is just my approach and I think others work well (perhaps better). But, I figured I found this thread from last year to be so helpful that I owed a duty of paying it forward.

+1 to pretty much all of this

I think it was my enthusiasm that really made the difference. You don't want to go in there super formal and stiff. You want to be as genuine, enthusiastic, and open as possible. Digging through obscure facts about a firm to show that you "did your research" is useless in most case IMO, and it sounds horribly contrived in most cases. If you find one or 2 reasons you REALLY want to be there, as generic as they might sound, it will be very well received if you convey them with all your passion and energy. I have a relatively informal interview style in which I smile a lot, make some jokes, keep the mood light, and always look comfortable. I'll admit that this style didn't work with stuffier older dudes. But for firms where personality fit, and energy are what they seek, I've been able to fit the bill.

As for what is the "best" way to explain why you transferred, I think the right approach is to be honest. For me, I wanted to be closer to my family. The quality of my new school was only icing on the cake. I told them that, given these 2 things together, it seemed like the right choice (and it certainly doesn't hurt that my home is essentially where my new school is located). They can see through BS pretty easily. So, as with any other part of the interview, just be honest and energetic about whatever it is you say.