Final OCI results: 2011 Version Forum

[Anonymous User]

To poster in top 5% from T20:

Do not drop out. I had similarly stats (DCNG 5%) and also a disappointing OCI (ended up with V50). At least use the J.D. for management consulting or even an academic career.

Are you saying that a V50 job is a disappointment?

If so, sheesh.

Not that anon user, but for somebody in the top 5% of DCNG? Hell yeah. Pretty much everybody I know with those numbers had multiple V5 offers. To end up with a V50 with those stats would be crushing.

"Crushing" is overly dramatic, and that's being generous.

I get it, top 5% at a school ranked in the T14 and a V50 may not be the ultimate dream. However, V50 firms still work on huge cases, with difficult and novel issues, and are generally a big deal. Sure there are more prestigious firms out there, but at some point you have to reflect on this and ask yourself whether you care about being an attorney or if you care only about being the top. I suppose if you are happy enough with the latter motivation and make it, fine. For most, however, it's probably easier to take a step back, take a breath and recognize that you are going to have an amazing chance at a career.

[Anonymous User]

I agree that its way overboard to say that anyone should be "crushed" working for a V50 firm. I don't even need to list out the reasons, but I don't think its fair to say it.

[Anonymous User]

School*: MVP
Market(s): DC, VA, FL, ATL
Approximate class rank: bottom 5%
Law review: N
Work experience: three years
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact? (diversity, etc. or whatever, really): Good interviewer
Screening Interviews: 38
Mass mails: 0
Callbacks received: 5
Callbacks accepted: 5
Offers w/vault ranges: None

[Anonymous User]

ask yourself whether you care about being an attorney or if you care only about being the top

Some people want both.

Maybe this is just a difficult thing to grasp unless you're in a position where people historically get an offer at an elite firm. Is being at a V50 objectively a bad place to be? Hell no. But during 1L, you were one of the best students at one of the best schools in the country. You think you're going to end up at one of the most elite firms in the country (think something like V5/STB/Covington DC/W&C) only to end up at a firm like dla piper/Freshfields/Winston NY. For months you've had people tell you that you're a "lock" for an elite firm like Cravath or W&C. You get your hopes up. You want to be at one of the best, only to have it not work out. Unfortunately, the wide majority of law students will never understand because they would die to work for a dla piper/Freshfields/Mayer NY, but it is what it is—very disappointing. And it comes across as insensitive and entitled as hell, but that's still the way it feels.

[Anonymous User]

ask yourself whether you care about being an attorney or if you care only about being the top

Some people want both.

Maybe this is just a difficult thing to grasp unless you're in a position where people historically get an offer at an elite firm. Is being at a V50 objectively a bad place to be? Hell no. But during 1L, you were one of the best students at one of the best schools in the country. You think you're going to end up at one of the most elite firms in the country (think something like V5/STB/Covington DC/W&C) only to end up at a firm like DLA Piper/Freshfields/Winston NY. For months you've had people tell you that you're a "lock" for an elite firm like Cravath or W&C. You get your hopes up. You want to be at one of the best, only to have it not work out. Unfortunately, the wide majority of law students will never understand because they would die to work for a DLA Piper/Freshfields/Mayer NY, but it is what it is—very disappointing. And it comes across as insensitive and entitled as hell, but that's still the way it feels.

It's looking like I'm gonna be in this position (3.7+ at Michigan; bad interviewer), and it sucks a bit, but in in the end it's still way better than being a median strikeout, etc...

[Anonymous User]

Some people want both.

Maybe this is just a difficult thing to grasp unless you're in a position where people historically get an offer at an elite firm. Is being at a V50 objectively a bad place to be? Hell no. But during 1L, you were one of the best students at one of the best schools in the country. You think you're going to end up at one of the most elite firms in the country (think something like V5/STB/Covington DC/W&C) only to end up at a firm like DLA Piper/Freshfields/Winston NY. For months you've had people tell you that you're a "lock" for an elite firm like Cravath or W&C. You get your hopes up. You want to be at one of the best, only to have it not work out. Unfortunately, the wide majority of law students will never understand because they would die to work for a DLA Piper/Freshfields/Mayer NY, but it is what it is—very disappointing. And it comes across as insensitive and entitled as hell, but that's still the way it feels.

I have been trying to think of a way to say this without coming off harsh, but this is the best I can do: "welcome to life."

People can stroke your ego all day long, it doesn't make you great. How many summers do the V5 take? How many 2L's have interviewed with these firms? Just because you are top 5% at a school like Duke or Georgetown doesn't mean you are going to get one of those jobs. There are plenty of top 5% at T10 schools, as well as top 1% at various other tier 1 schools. Some of these students also have advanced degrees, previous careers, special backgrounds, and the list goes on.

No matter how much other people tell you, or you tell yourself, that you are a special snowflake that is destin for the stars, it's not true. There are always going to be a lot of people out there that are smarter, more charismatic, and better looking than you. There are even going to be people that aren't and they'll still get better jobs and opportunities than you.

You can either sulk about it, or realize that even in the scheme of high expectations this is not a bad shake. In the end, if you are worth the V5 position, you have a decades-long career in which to remedy this injustice.


Again, let's step back here: a V50 firm is a great amazing opportunity.

[Anonymous User]

Some people want both.

Maybe this is just a difficult thing to grasp unless you're in a position where people historically get an offer at an elite firm. Is being at a V50 objectively a bad place to be? Hell no. But during 1L, you were one of the best students at one of the best schools in the country. You think you're going to end up at one of the most elite firms in the country (think something like V5/STB/Covington DC/W&C) only to end up at a firm like DLA Piper/Freshfields/Winston NY. For months you've had people tell you that you're a "lock" for an elite firm like Cravath or W&C. You get your hopes up. You want to be at one of the best, only to have it not work out. Unfortunately, the wide majority of law students will never understand because they would die to work for a DLA Piper/Freshfields/Mayer NY, but it is what it is—very disappointing. And it comes across as insensitive and entitled as hell, but that's still the way it feels.

I have been trying to think of a way to say this without coming off harsh, but this is the best I can do: "welcome to life."

People can stroke your ego all day long, it doesn't make you great. How many summers do the V5 take? How many 2L's have interviewed with these firms? Just because you are top 5% at a school like Duke or Georgetown doesn't mean you are going to get one of those jobs. There are plenty of top 5% at T10 schools, as well as top 1% at various other tier 1 schools. Some of these students also have advanced degrees, previous careers, special backgrounds, and the list goes on.

No matter how much other people tell you, or you tell yourself, that you are a special snowflake that is destin for the stars, it's not true. There are always going to be a lot of people out there that are smarter, more charismatic, and better looking than you. There are even going to be people that aren't and they'll still get better jobs and opportunities than you.

You can either sulk about it, or realize that even in the scheme of high expectations this is not a bad shake. In the end, if you are worth the V5 position, you have a decades-long career in which to remedy this injustice.

Again, let's step back here: a V50 firm is a great amazing opportunity.

<---- anon you quoted

I'm not sulking about it. I actually got a V5 offer and am certainly not anywhere close to the top 5% of my class, so this isn't a case of me being bitter about not getting what I wanted. But I do have friends in the position I described above. It's not about being a fucking special snowflake. It's about working hard and not seeing your work pay off for you, like it has for other people in your same position. It's about getting your hopes up, and being let down. I completely agree. A V50 firm is a terrific opportunity. Hell, going to Cornell might be a great opportunity, but that doesn't make the person who should have been able to get into Harvard feel any better. There are some people out there who strive to be one of the best. You're not one of those people, and that's fine.

[Anonymous User]

No matter how much other people tell you, or you tell yourself, that you are a special snowflake that is destin for the stars, it's not true. There are always going to be a lot of people out there that are smarter, more charismatic, and better looking than you. There are even going to be people that aren't and they'll still get better jobs and opportunities than you.

But I feel like a special snowflake. Why can't W&C just see the really amazing person I see in the mirror every day?

[Anonymous User]

Some people want both.

Maybe this is just a difficult thing to grasp unless you're in a position where people historically get an offer at an elite firm. Is being at a V50 objectively a bad place to be? Hell no. But during 1L, you were one of the best students at one of the best schools in the country. You think you're going to end up at one of the most elite firms in the country (think something like V5/STB/Covington DC/W&C) only to end up at a firm like DLA Piper/Freshfields/Winston NY. For months you've had people tell you that you're a "lock" for an elite firm like Cravath or W&C. You get your hopes up. You want to be at one of the best, only to have it not work out. Unfortunately, the wide majority of law students will never understand because they would die to work for a DLA Piper/Freshfields/Mayer NY, but it is what it is—very disappointing. And it comes across as insensitive and entitled as hell, but that's still the way it feels.

I have been trying to think of a way to say this without coming off harsh, but this is the best I can do: "welcome to life."

People can stroke your ego all day long, it doesn't make you great. How many summers do the V5 take? How many 2L's have interviewed with these firms? Just because you are top 5% at a school like Duke or Georgetown doesn't mean you are going to get one of those jobs. There are plenty of top 5% at T10 schools, as well as top 1% at various other tier 1 schools. Some of these students also have advanced degrees, previous careers, special backgrounds, and the list goes on.

No matter how much other people tell you, or you tell yourself, that you are a special snowflake that is destin for the stars, it's not true. There are always going to be a lot of people out there that are smarter, more charismatic, and better looking than you. There are even going to be people that aren't and they'll still get better jobs and opportunities than you.

You can either sulk about it, or realize that even in the scheme of high expectations this is not a bad shake. In the end, if you are worth the V5 position, you have a decades-long career in which to remedy this injustice.


Again, let's step back here: a V50 firm is a great amazing opportunity.

credited.

[Anonymous User]

Some people want both.

Maybe this is just a difficult thing to grasp unless you're in a position where people historically get an offer at an elite firm. Is being at a V50 objectively a bad place to be? Hell no. But during 1L, you were one of the best students at one of the best schools in the country. You think you're going to end up at one of the most elite firms in the country (think something like V5/STB/Covington DC/W&C) only to end up at a firm like DLA Piper/Freshfields/Winston NY. For months you've had people tell you that you're a "lock" for an elite firm like Cravath or W&C. You get your hopes up. You want to be at one of the best, only to have it not work out. Unfortunately, the wide majority of law students will never understand because they would die to work for a DLA Piper/Freshfields/Mayer NY, but it is what it is—very disappointing. And it comes across as insensitive and entitled as hell, but that's still the way it feels.

I have been trying to think of a way to say this without coming off harsh, but this is the best I can do: "welcome to life."

People can stroke your ego all day long, it doesn't make you great. How many summers do the V5 take? How many 2L's have interviewed with these firms? Just because you are top 5% at a school like Duke or Georgetown doesn't mean you are going to get one of those jobs. There are plenty of top 5% at T10 schools, as well as top 1% at various other tier 1 schools. Some of these students also have advanced degrees, previous careers, special backgrounds, and the list goes on.

No matter how much other people tell you, or you tell yourself, that you are a special snowflake that is destin for the stars, it's not true. There are always going to be a lot of people out there that are smarter, more charismatic, and better looking than you. There are even going to be people that aren't and they'll still get better jobs and opportunities than you.

You can either sulk about it, or realize that even in the scheme of high expectations this is not a bad shake. In the end, if you are worth the V5 position, you have a decades-long career in which to remedy this injustice.


Again, let's step back here: a V50 firm is a great amazing opportunity.

credited.

I'm going to disagree and try to analogize it to running:

Say you are a great runner, even more naturally gifted than 99% of other runners. Not only that, but you train harder than most too. Your goal is to run make the Olympics (work in a V5 or so firm). If you run workouts that make you good enough to win the Olympics (top 5% at top 10), but you trip in the qualifiers, I think you have every right to be upset. Yes, most runners only dream of making it to the qualifiers and would give anything to be there. But, you put yourself on a different level than everyone else so you expect different things. We see Superbowl losers crying, etc etc and nobody tries to give them reality checks because they are not happy just being in the NFL.

Bottom line: there is nothing wrong with wanting more and hating having to settle for less than you are capable of.

[Anonymous User]

this thread has become ridiculous. i'm sorry, but i, and many others, would kill to "settle" for a V50. find another thread to "commiserate" in if you're so bummed about your V50 offer.

[Anonymous User]

Agreed. Sorry y'all didn't get V5's and all, but you have a job paying $160k and you have the type of grades to get a federal clerkship and "move up" to the firm you want in the future. You are in the type of situation where you may not get your V5 this summer, but you can certainly end up there after graduation/clerkship. Also, keep in mind that by you working at the V50, there is another person who normally fits that firm's profile that they may not have hired to get you and your shiny GPA.

[Anonymous User]

Back on topic now. Please post your OCI results

[Anonymous User]

If you want to complain about not reaching your Vault goals, another thread would actually be helpful for next year's class. If you post mistakes or errors that you made, that might help others not make them. "Why I underachieved and how you can avoid it" can be the name of the thread. Ready, go.

[SilverE2]

Anyone at Vandy have any results to report?

[Anonymous User]

School: HYS

Market(s): NY
Approximate class rank: half Hs, half Ps
Law review: No
Work experience: None
Anything else that might have an impact?: No
Screening Interviews: 28
Mass mails: 0
Callbacks received: 11
Callbacks accepted: 8
Offers w/vault ranges: 1 V5, 1 V10, 1 V20, 2 V50, 1 V100.

[Anonymous User]

School: CCN
Market: NY
Approx Rank: Top 20%
Law Review: No, secondary journal.
WE: None other than some summer work.
Anything else: Language skills and foreign experience
Screeners: 25
Mass Mails: 0
CBs Offered: 8
CBs Taken: 5
Offers w/ Ranges: 1 V5, 1 V20 (Taking the V20 (OMG! Prestige loss!?!) due to fit.)

[Anonymous User]

School*: DNCG
Market(s): Chicago, DC
Approximate class rank: Transferred from a T25, top 10%, law review
Law review: wrote onto law review at new school but it happened after OCI so firms never knew about it
Work experience: 4 years
IP background: no
Anything else that might have an impact? (diversity, etc. or whatever, really): pretty solid WE, high level jobs
Screening Interviews: 22
Mass mails: 0/8 on this front
Callbacks received: 14
Callbacks accepted: went on 9 or so, canceled several
Offers w/vault ranges: 6 offers (1 v10, 1 v15, 1 v30, 1 v50, 2 v75-100) Going with the v30. Super tough call but the v30 had a niche practice I want to work in, and I knew more folks there beforehand. Vault rankings are pretty ridiculous for anything outside of NYC. Chambers is much more helpful, IMO.
How many firms just didn't get back with you with a rejection/callback? 3
Thank-you notes sent: 90% of the time I sent a TY email. There is nothing to be gained from doing it.

[Anonymous User]

School*: UCLA
Market(s): LA
Approximate class rank: ~10%
Law review: NO
Work experience: YES
IP background: YES
Anything else that might have an impact? (diversity, etc. or whatever, really):
Screening Interviews: 10
Mass mails: 2 firms contacted me based on a resume they had on file from my 1L mass mailing.
Callbacks received: 6 (OCI) + 2
Callbacks accepted: 5 (canceled 3 after first OCI offer)
Offers w/vault ranges: 2 V25 (1 OCI, 1 non), 1 V50 (OCI), 1 Non-Vault IP Boutique(Non OCI)
How many firms just didn't get back with you with a rejection/callback? Gibson LA never heard back post screening interview
Thank-you notes sent: No.

I decided on one of the firms that I got connected with not through OCI

[Anonymous User]

School*: HYS
Market(s): SF/SV, NY as backup
Approximate class rank: ~50%
Law review: NO
Work experience: YES
IP background: YES
Anything else that might have an impact? (diversity, etc. or whatever, really):
Screening Interviews: 35 (did other markets as a backup)
Mass mails: 10 or so.
Callbacks received: 22
Callbacks accepted: 6 (6 SF ones..cancelled the vast majority of the rest)
Offers w/vault ranges: 1 V15, 1 V10, 1 V150
How many firms just didn't get back with you with a rejection/callback? Didn't track
Thank-you notes sent: Sometimes. Not recommended!

Take away: if you have an IP background and go to a top school (say T6), you can probably break into the bay area even without ties (I had none). Make sure to emphasize an interest in IP though!

[Anonymous User]

School: GULC
Market(s): DC
Approximate class rank: 10%
Law review: NO, Secondary journal
Work experience: YES, but not legal
IP background: NO
Anything else that might have an impact? (diversity, etc. or whatever, really):
Screening Interviews: 10
Mass mails: 20
Callbacks received: 4
Callbacks accepted: 3
Offers w/vault ranges: 1 V10, 1 V25 (withdrew from other callback before hearing anything)
How many firms just didn't get back with you with a rejection/callback? Didn't track

[Anonymous User]

lol at anyone complaining about V50.

Median 3L @ boalt and still looking for work here.

[Anonymous User]

School: DNCG
Market(s): NYC
Approximate class rank: just below median (maybe 5-10% below)
Law review: secondary
Work experience: yes
IP background: no
Anything else that might have an impact? (diversity, etc. or whatever, really): interesting WE, good at interviewing
Screening Interviews: 20
Mass mails: 0
Callbacks received: 5
Callbacks accepted: 4
Offers w/vault ranges: 4, all V50
How many firms just didn't get back with you with a rejection/callback? none

[Anonymous User]

School: CLS/NYU
Market(s): NYC, other markets as back-up (only went to CBs in NYC)
Approximate class rank: somewhat above top 10%
Law review: No, secondary
Work experience: No
IP background: No
Anything else?: LGBT; thought before the process that I was a bad interviewer, results suggest otherwise?
Screening Interviews: 32
Mass mails: 0
Callbacks received: 26
Callbacks accepted: 9 (4 V5, 2 V10, 2 V15, 1 boutique; cancelled the rest after a V10 offer)
Offers w/vault ranges: 3 V5, 2 V10, 1 V15, 1 boutique; splitting between a V10 and the boutique
No response?: None
Thank-you notes: Only to the boutique post-CB

[Anonymous User]

School: DCNG
Market(s): DC, NYC as backup
Approximate class rank: around top 10%
Law review: Yes
Work experience: Non-impressive WE
Anything else?:
Screening Interviews: 20
Mass mails: 0
Callbacks received: 6
Callbacks accepted:5
Offers w/vault ranges: 1 v100, 1 v15
No response?: 1 v5 has not gotten back to me yet after cb, assuming ding
Thank-you notes: No

Advice: Don't assume that because you have good grades you will automatically crush OCI. Try to show specific intersest in what the firm does.