Law firm recruiter answering questions for a bit Forum

[adonai]

Can you comment on why law-related experience only matters during 1L and on and not pre-law (that seems to be the mantra here)? What would you think of someone who had only law related internships/work experience (where they did substantive work, not just paper pushing)?

[japes]

Can you comment on why law-related experience only matters during 1L and on and not pre-law (that seems to be the mantra here)? What would you think of someone who had only law related internships/work experience (where they did substantive work, not just paper pushing)?

Going off this, how much of a boon is pre-law school law work? I've been working at a small law firm doing actual substantial legal work (just finished up a 20-page Daubert motion, among other things). Is this a huge plus for interviewing for jobs 1L summer?

[Aston2412]

Can you comment on why law-related experience only matters during 1L and on and not pre-law (that seems to be the mantra here)? What would you think of someone who had only law related internships/work experience (where they did substantive work, not just paper pushing)?

Going off this, how much of a boon is pre-law school law work? I've been working at a small law firm doing actual substantial legal work (just finished up a 20-page Daubert motion, among other things). Is this a huge plus for interviewing for jobs 1L summer?

You're writing motions for court without any law school under your belt? I know practice is different from school but that just seems unusual.

[lawfirmrecruiter]

You've said several times in this thread that you understand why someone might not have a 1L summer job ITE. But, do you look at someone who got a law clerk job after 1L and think, "this person passed the smell test already" or "this person can at least interview" or anything positive about the fact that some firm out there decided to take that person over others? [especially if say grades are equal between a candidate with no 1L job and one with].

Its definitely a positive - especially if it is a firm gig. Those are extremely competitive and look fantastic on your resume. I just harp on it not being a negative because it really won't hurt you if you don't have a 1L firm job.

Follow up to that question, what about a 1L in-house position in a large company that is very representative of firm clients within my desired practice areas? Any particular advice on how to translate the experience there (seeing in-house counsel operations and the operations of a large business) into good cover letter points?

This would be good experience too. Just mention that you have experience with XYZ industry because of your time with X company. Then list out your duties and something you learned.

[lawfirmrecruiter]

Can you comment on why law-related experience only matters during 1L and on and not pre-law (that seems to be the mantra here)? What would you think of someone who had only law related internships/work experience (where they did substantive work, not just paper pushing)?

If you are talking about working at a law firm or counsel's office prior to going to law school, that is EXCELLENT. It shows that you really know what you are getting into with this career and know what you want. One of our rising stars was a paralegal for 2 years before he went to law school and it really paid off for him. It is not really a requirement nor is it stressed because it is actually pretty rare to have legal experience pre- law.

[lawfirmrecruiter]

Can you comment on why law-related experience only matters during 1L and on and not pre-law (that seems to be the mantra here)? What would you think of someone who had only law related internships/work experience (where they did substantive work, not just paper pushing)?

Going off this, how much of a boon is pre-law school law work? I've been working at a small law firm doing actual substantial legal work (just finished up a 20-page Daubert motion, among other things). Is this a huge plus for interviewing for jobs 1L summer?

Yes. See previous response.

[Anonymous User]

Can you comment on why law-related experience only matters during 1L and on and not pre-law (that seems to be the mantra here)? What would you think of someone who had only law related internships/work experience (where they did substantive work, not just paper pushing)?

Going off this, how much of a boon is pre-law school law work? I've been working at a small law firm doing actual substantial legal work (just finished up a 20-page Daubert motion, among other things). Is this a huge plus for interviewing for jobs 1L summer?

Yes. See previous response.

How hard is it to break into a firm's IP group in your market? I guess it's mostly soft IP there, which makes sense, but it's kind of my favorite city. Do you have any tips on how to sell the ability to work with patents when local firms mostly deal in copyrights or, even better, know if any of your peers are looking to add to their IP groups this year? From in-state though a different city, went to undergrad at the local powerhouse, currently at a law school that isn't far below my alma mater's, grades are good. I'm hoping firms there will at least give me a look even though I chose to go away for law school... thanks for any advice you can give - I can also pm you if you're concerned that this might out you or anything.

[Renne Walker]

Just bookmarking this for when I have time to go through all 17 pages.

I read that during 1L they will herd us all into the auditorium and explain what to expect from OCI, etc. Until then, this is a great heads-up! Thx.

[Anonymous User]

How much of a boost is Law Review? I know it is difficult to quantify, but if someone is say in the top 20% with LR, how would they be viewed next to someone at say, top 15% or 10% without it?

[turbotong]

Can you comment on why law-related experience only matters during 1L and on and not pre-law (that seems to be the mantra here)? What would you think of someone who had only law related internships/work experience (where they did substantive work, not just paper pushing)?

Going off this, how much of a boon is pre-law school law work? I've been working at a small law firm doing actual substantial legal work (just finished up a 20-page Daubert motion, among other things). Is this a huge plus for interviewing for jobs 1L summer?

Yes. See previous response.

How hard is it to break into a firm's IP group in your market? I guess it's mostly soft IP there, which makes sense, but it's kind of my favorite city. Do you have any tips on how to sell the ability to work with patents when local firms mostly deal in copyrights or, even better, know if any of your peers are looking to add to their IP groups this year? From in-state though a different city, went to undergrad at the local powerhouse, currently at a law school that isn't far below my alma mater's, grades are good. I'm hoping firms there will at least give me a look even though I chose to go away for law school... thanks for any advice you can give - I can also pm you if you're concerned that this might out you or anything.

Also, how hard is it to break into the hard IP group? Other than a science/engineering undergraduate degree requirement, are there any other differences in what you look for in a candidate?
Can you give an estimate as to the number of qualified applicants per hard IP slot compared to other areas?

[Renne Walker]

As an OL I was interviewed by a recruiter, representing a number of Big Law firms for one of numerous $1,300 a week summer positions. I read up on current events, which proved to be helpful since these events came up during our conversation and I was able to cite the Wall Street Journal and Times. Toward the very end of the interview the interviewer read off from a page listing several schools that had accepted me, the schools were quality tier one schools (none in the top 20). The interviewer asked if I had selected a school, I said I had just matriculated to NYU (through Early Action). The interviewer looked surprised since NYU was not on the list. The interview continued for an additional twenty minutes, with an emphasis on sending my deposit receipt as quickly as possible.

If there is a point to this, it is, I thought I was in the running even before mentioning NYU (which clearly was not the case). Then after two long months of waiting for a decision, the end result: I am 0-1 in turning an interview into a job. Granted, I knew going in that my chances were slim because there were probably +500 candidates going after 50 spots, plus, this “work at a big law during the summer” program was sponsored by SEO. SEO, per their literature and web site is a program for people of color and minorities. My minority status was paper-thin (my Granddad was Cuban). Is there a question anytime soon in our future? Yes, here in comes.

After the interview you conduct what typically happens then? How long does it take to receive word on the outcome?

Hypothetical: I have been to four interviews and feel that they all are promising, and then I receive an offer, what then? From earlier posts, it sounds like one good offer might be all we can hope for these days. Would the firm expect a quick acceptance or do they usually give us a week (or so) to accept. I take it there is nothing wrong with enthusiastically accepting the offer without hesitation.

Again, a great thread for us about to be 1L folks, who are already batting 0-1!

[seriouslyinformative]

You're going to be batting 0 for 100 after you're done applying for 1L SA positions at big firms. Relax. A single rejection doesn't mean much.

[romothesavior]

You're going to be batting 0 for 100 after you're done applying for 1L SA positions at big firms. Relax. A single rejection doesn't mean much.

+1. I don't even know what that post was about.

[Kronk]

You're going to be batting 0 for 100 after you're done applying for 1L SA positions at big firms. Relax. A single rejection doesn't mean much.

+1. I don't even know what that post was about.

I had to reread it a few times. SEO is a pre-law summer program for minority students that take place in a number of BigLaw firms. Looks like the poster got rejected from SEO (which makes sense given apparently he/she is white).

[Kilpatrick]

You're going to be batting 0 for 100 after you're done applying for 1L SA positions at big firms. Relax. A single rejection doesn't mean much.

+1. I don't even know what that post was about.

I had to reread it a few times. SEO is a pre-law summer program for minority students that take place in a number of BigLaw firms. Looks like the poster got rejected from SEO (which makes sense given apparently he/she is white).

Hahaha. Thank you for the TL;DR on that. I couldn't get through it.

[Anonymous User]

OP, can you say anything about the difference, in terms of applicant strength, between Law Review membership and membership on secondary journals? I understand of course that Law Review membership is more impressive, but the (often exaggerated) opinions on this site sometimes suggest that secondary journal membership is basically equivalent to participating in extracurricular clubs... What do you think?

[Renzo]

Yeah I read that like 5 times trying to figure out if someone at a TTTT was really asking if they could negotiate for 200K

Hope this does not come as a shock but there is a difference between Tier-4 and T-4 (unfortunately it is usually referred to as T-6).

You are going to fit in really, really well at Columbia.

[Renne Walker]

SEO is a pre-law summer program for minority students that take place in a number of BigLaw firms. Looks like the poster got rejected from SEO (which makes sense given apparently he/she is white).

In their brochure, the classroom pictures clearly indicated that around 20% of the students were not of color.

What I was asking here, but totally mangled, was that after an interview how long should it take to hear back? In the case of SEO, after being strung along for three months to hear “no thank you” seemed excessive. I just wanted to gauge (on a average), how long does it take to hear back after an interview.

BTW: the SEO corporate law thread has been on TLS since 2008, generating over 53,000 views and over 2,400 responses. Below is their link. It is a very positive program.

--LinkRemoved--

[kalvano]

SEO is a pre-law summer program for minority students that take place in a number of BigLaw firms. Looks like the poster got rejected from SEO (which makes sense given apparently he/she is white).

In their brochure, the classroom pictures clearly indicated that around 20% of the students were not of color.

From the link you posted -

What is SEO?
Quick Pitch - The SEO Career Program places students of color interested in finance, philanthropy, business and corporate law in internships with competitive pay, rigorous training, support through mentors, and broad access to industry professionals.

[Anonymous User]

SEO is a pre-law summer program for minority students that take place in a number of BigLaw firms. Looks like the poster got rejected from SEO (which makes sense given apparently he/she is white).

In their brochure, the classroom pictures clearly indicated that around 20% of the students were not of color.

What I was asking here, but totally mangled, was that after an interview how long should it take to hear back? In the case of SEO, after being strung along for three months to hear “no thank you” seemed excessive. I just wanted to gauge (on a average), how long does it take to hear back after an interview.

BTW: the SEO corporate law thread has been on TLS since 2008, generating over 53,000 views and over 2,400 responses. Below is their link. It is a very positive program.

--LinkRemoved--

If you don't hear back you didn't get it. I don't know anyone who got a "Sorry we're not sorry" phone call. If you get a call then you got a call back or you got the job.

[smithc2011]

Thank you for answering questions!!


I noticed this was brought up earlier but I wasn't sure if there was an answer. I have a short and well-trimmed beard. I keep a beard because it covers a scar. The scar isn't that bad, but I prefer to keep it covered because it makes me self conscious. Should I shave for interviews and callbacks?

have you ever considered in investing in make up? Suck it up if your a guy. It's good for you.

Well, that was mean.

OP, Please do not wear makeup. You will mess it up and we will talk about you for years to come ...

I Lol'd

[vamedic03]

As an OL I was interviewed by a recruiter, representing a number of Big Law firms for one of numerous $1,300 a week summer positions. I read up on current events, which proved to be helpful since these events came up during our conversation and I was able to cite the Wall Street Journal and Times. Toward the very end of the interview the interviewer read off from a page listing several schools that had accepted me, the schools were quality tier one schools (none in the top 20). The interviewer asked if I had selected a school, I said I had just matriculated to NYU (through Early Action). The interviewer looked surprised since NYU was not on the list. The interview continued for an additional twenty minutes, with an emphasis on sending my deposit receipt as quickly as possible.

If there is a point to this, it is, I thought I was in the running even before mentioning NYU (which clearly was not the case). Then after two long months of waiting for a decision, the end result: I am 0-1 in turning an interview into a job. Granted, I knew going in that my chances were slim because there were probably +500 candidates going after 50 spots, plus, this “work at a big law during the summer” program was sponsored by SEO. SEO, per their literature and web site is a program for people of color and minorities. My minority status was paper-thin (my Granddad was Cuban). Is there a question anytime soon in our future? Yes, here in comes.

After the interview you conduct what typically happens then? How long does it take to receive word on the outcome?

Hypothetical: I have been to four interviews and feel that they all are promising, and then I receive an offer, what then? From earlier posts, it sounds like one good offer might be all we can hope for these days. Would the firm expect a quick acceptance or do they usually give us a week (or so) to accept. I take it there is nothing wrong with enthusiastically accepting the offer without hesitation.

Again, a great thread for us about to be 1L folks, who are already batting 0-1!

I'm confused here. What are you actually asking?

[Anonymous User]

How do you think a CPA will help if I want to go into Corp Law and I'm going to a T2? What do most big law firms think about CPAs? It seems like there are a good amt of CPAs on this board and basically I want to know how heavily the CPA would help land a biglaw job, regardless of grades.

[Anonymous User]

.

[Anonymous User]

After the interview you conduct what typically happens then? How long does it take to receive word on the outcome?

I'm confused here. What are you actually asking?

Focus on the sentences that end in a question mark.
Where o where is our OP?